?Re: [Az-Geocaching] Use of Geocaching.com for commercial solicitation
David Thompsen
listserv@azgeocaching.com
Fri, 28 May 2004 21:38:49 -0700 (PDT)
--0-1875538346-1085805529=:32369
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
If the company that the caller in question is Primerica, the scenario is much clearer to me.
Primerica is a "multi-level marketing" company in the mold of Amway/Quixtar or Mary Kay, except they sell insurance and financial services. As many people out there, likely including some that subscribe to this list, participate in companies like this, I'm going to try really hard to be even-handed so as not to offend.
MLMs rely upon recruiting other people below you to profit on a portion of their sales in addition to the income generated by your own sales. Unfortunately, MLMs usually offer products and services at substantially higher prices than can be gotten by shopping around, be it insurance or cosmetics.
A harsher view would say that MLMs are a shade away from pyramid schemes, which are illegal.
The caller in question, regardless of his initial reason for calling, sounded like yet another familiar predatory telemarketer at best, and more likely looking for additional recruits and sales than to get a reference.
Regardless, it is certainly foolish for someone to use members of the Arizona Geocaching community without their consent, for references or for direct marketing ---particularly if you may not have been on your best behavior lately.
"You better THINK!" -- A. Franklin
George Harris <george@customcals.com> wrote:
You can get penis enlargement pills on geocaching.com??!? Crap, don't let
Sweet Pea see that. She'll melt my credit card.
I'm a little confused at this scenario. Was this a genuine character
reference call, or was the caller using the "character reference" comment to
get his foot in the door, with the only purpose to see insurance?
And with the bad press Ken has been getting on this list lately, how in the
world could he use people on it for references??
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian - Team A.I."
To:
Sent: Friday, May 28, 2004 8:35 PM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Use of Geocaching.com for commercial
solicitation
> I have a feeling I was one of the first on that list of people he's given
> them to call as a character reference. They've called several times,
> leaving messages on both my home and cellphones. The home phone I don't
> know if I ever gave Ken, but it is a listed number. As far as my
cellphone
> is concerned, I'm not sure where that number came into play, but they have
> been annoying in their frequency of calls, none of which I've answered
> (after hearing a voice mail they left on my home phone).
>
> In my experience, it's always customary to ASK a person you are using as a
> character reference, and to perhaps give them a call when the hiring
process
> is in full swing so the call from the employer for this type of
information
> isn't unexpected and doesn't catch you off guard. I was never asked to be
a
> character reference, and in all honesty I would refuse for the simple fact
> that I don't know him well enough to be any kind of character reference,
and
> my contact with him has been very limited.
>
> I am very disappointed on his actions for doing this to more than one
> person, and it does indeed appear that he neglected to ask permission to
use
> anyone as a character reference, and for the fact that Primerica is so
> aggressive in their tactics that as a secondary portion of the
conversation
> they try to sell you something like an insurance policy. Give me a
freaking
> break already. Knowing now that he's done this, I don't see it being a
bad
> idea at all to report this to Geocaching.com. It's no better than trying
to
> harvest e-mail addresses from the main site in an effort to sell penis
> enlargement pills.
>
> Brian
> Team A.I.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "SquishyGecko"
> To:
> Sent: Friday, May 28, 2004 3:18 PM
> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Use of Geocaching.com for commercial solicitation
>
>
> > This morning I received a telephone call from someone named Ron Adams,
> > stating that he was doing a "character reference" for Highpointer.
After
> > returning the call and informing Mr. Adams that I had never met
> Highpointer,
> > he proceeded to state that Highpointer had told Mr. Adams that I was
> married
> > with two children, then attempted to sell me an insurance policy.
> >
> > Not only do I consider this a gross misrepresentation on the part of Mr.
> > Adams, but a gross violation of my privacy by Highpointer. I will be
> > contacting Geocaching.com to determine what violations of Geocaching.com
> > regulations may have been committed by Highpointer. I strongly
encourage
> > anyone else who receives such a call to ask Mr. Adams to add you to his
> "Do
> > Not Call" list, and then report the incident to Geocaching.com.
> >
> >
> > ---
> > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
> > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
> > Version: 6.0.691 / Virus Database: 452 - Release Date: 5/26/2004
> >
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> >
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> >
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
>
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.688 / Virus Database: 449 - Release Date: 5/25/2004
____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com
---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Friends. Fun. Try the all-new Yahoo! Messenger
--0-1875538346-1085805529=:32369
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
<DIV>If the company that the caller in question is Primerica, the scenario is much clearer to me. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Primerica is a "multi-level marketing" company in the mold of Amway/Quixtar or Mary Kay, except they sell insurance and financial services. As many people out there, likely including some that subscribe to this list, participate in companies like this, I'm going to try really hard to be even-handed so as not to offend.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>MLMs rely upon recruiting other people below you to profit on a portion of their sales in addition to the income generated by your own sales. Unfortunately, MLMs usually offer products and services at substantially higher prices than can be gotten by shopping around, be it insurance or cosmetics.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>A harsher view would say that MLMs are a shade away from pyramid schemes, which are illegal.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>The caller in question, regardless of his initial reason for calling, sounded like yet another familiar predatory telemarketer at best, and more likely looking for additional recruits and sales than to get a reference.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Regardless, it is certainly foolish for someone to use members of the Arizona Geocaching community without their consent, for references or for direct marketing ---particularly if you may not have been on your best behavior lately.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>"You better THINK!" -- A. Franklin</DIV>
<DIV><BR><BR><B><I>George Harris <george@customcals.com></I></B> wrote:</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">You can get penis enlargement pills on geocaching.com??!? Crap, don't let<BR>Sweet Pea see that. She'll melt my credit card.<BR><BR>I'm a little confused at this scenario. Was this a genuine character<BR>reference call, or was the caller using the "character reference" comment to<BR>get his foot in the door, with the only purpose to see insurance?<BR><BR>And with the bad press Ken has been getting on this list lately, how in the<BR>world could he use people on it for references??<BR><BR>----- Original Message ----- <BR>From: "Brian - Team A.I." <TEAMAI@COX.NET><BR>To: <LISTSERV@AZGEOCACHING.COM><BR>Sent: Friday, May 28, 2004 8:35 PM<BR>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Use of Geocaching.com for commercial<BR>solicitation<BR><BR><BR>> I have a feeling I was one of the first on that list of people he's given<BR>> them to call as a character reference. They've called several
times,<BR>> leaving messages on both my home and cellphones. The home phone I don't<BR>> know if I ever gave Ken, but it is a listed number. As far as my<BR>cellphone<BR>> is concerned, I'm not sure where that number came into play, but they have<BR>> been annoying in their frequency of calls, none of which I've answered<BR>> (after hearing a voice mail they left on my home phone).<BR>><BR>> In my experience, it's always customary to ASK a person you are using as a<BR>> character reference, and to perhaps give them a call when the hiring<BR>process<BR>> is in full swing so the call from the employer for this type of<BR>information<BR>> isn't unexpected and doesn't catch you off guard. I was never asked to be<BR>a<BR>> character reference, and in all honesty I would refuse for the simple fact<BR>> that I don't know him well enough to be any kind of character reference,<BR>and<BR>> my contact with him has been very limited.<BR>><BR>> I am
very disappointed on his actions for doing this to more than one<BR>> person, and it does indeed appear that he neglected to ask permission to<BR>use<BR>> anyone as a character reference, and for the fact that Primerica is so<BR>> aggressive in their tactics that as a secondary portion of the<BR>conversation<BR>> they try to sell you something like an insurance policy. Give me a<BR>freaking<BR>> break already. Knowing now that he's done this, I don't see it being a<BR>bad<BR>> idea at all to report this to Geocaching.com. It's no better than trying<BR>to<BR>> harvest e-mail addresses from the main site in an effort to sell penis<BR>> enlargement pills.<BR>><BR>> Brian<BR>> Team A.I.<BR>><BR>> ----- Original Message ----- <BR>> From: "SquishyGecko" <SQUISHYGECKO@YAHOO.COM><BR>> To: <LISTSERV@AZGEOCACHING.COM><BR>> Sent: Friday, May 28, 2004 3:18 PM<BR>> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Use of Geocaching.com for commercial
solicitation<BR>><BR>><BR>> > This morning I received a telephone call from someone named Ron Adams,<BR>> > stating that he was doing a "character reference" for Highpointer.<BR>After<BR>> > returning the call and informing Mr. Adams that I had never met<BR>> Highpointer,<BR>> > he proceeded to state that Highpointer had told Mr. Adams that I was<BR>> married<BR>> > with two children, then attempted to sell me an insurance policy.<BR>> ><BR>> > Not only do I consider this a gross misrepresentation on the part of Mr.<BR>> > Adams, but a gross violation of my privacy by Highpointer. I will be<BR>> > contacting Geocaching.com to determine what violations of Geocaching.com<BR>> > regulations may have been committed by Highpointer. I strongly<BR>encourage<BR>> > anyone else who receives such a call to ask Mr. Adams to add you to his<BR>> "Do<BR>> > Not Call" list, and then report the incident to
Geocaching.com.<BR>> ><BR>> ><BR>> > ---<BR>> > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.<BR>> > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).<BR>> > Version: 6.0.691 / Virus Database: 452 - Release Date: 5/26/2004<BR>> ><BR>> > ____________________________________________________________<BR>> > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com<BR>> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:<BR>> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching<BR>> ><BR>> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource<BR>> > http://www.azgeocaching.com<BR>> ><BR>><BR>><BR>> ____________________________________________________________<BR>> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com<BR>> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:<BR>> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching<BR>><BR>> Arizona's Geocaching
Resource<BR>> http://www.azgeocaching.com<BR>><BR>><BR><BR><BR>---<BR>Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.<BR>Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).<BR>Version: 6.0.688 / Virus Database: 449 - Release Date: 5/25/2004<BR><BR>____________________________________________________________<BR>Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com<BR>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:<BR>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching<BR><BR>Arizona's Geocaching Resource<BR>http://www.azgeocaching.com</BLOCKQUOTE><p>
<hr size=1><font face=arial size=-1>Do you Yahoo!?<br>Friends. Fun. <a href="http://messenger.yahoo.com/">Try the all-new Yahoo! Messenger</a>
--0-1875538346-1085805529=:32369--