From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 1 01:18:06 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Sparks) Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 18:18:06 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: GPS in the army Message-ID: <3E3B204E.8080106@mchsi.com> I watched this same program; what blew me away was the size of the military issued unit that (I think) they said cost a few thousand dollars. It was about the size of a lunchbox. Imagine trying to find a an urban micro with that and going unnoticed in a crowd of people. :-P Now if I could just get ahold of one of those laser range-finders they were using, _THAT_ would be cool! -- Team Sprocket >In an insomniac bout last night, I surfed into the Discovery Channel in >the middle of a program about US armed forces in Afghanistan. In one >segment they were showing how combat controllers (I think that was what >they were called, perhaps it was "forward controllers") perform their >duties. > >It is their job to provide target coordinates to air strikes. They do >this by sighting on a target and projecting a waypoint from where they >are to the target, which waypoint they then report to the bombers. They >showed a picture of a bazillion-dollar mil-spec GPS. Then the narrator >stated that the soldiers prefer to use consumer models as they are far >lighter and consume batteries much more slowly, while the film showed a >soldier using a clearly-labeled Garmin Vista to do the waypoint >projection. > >I'm not posting this to add ammo to the Garmin-Maggie skirmish here. I >just thought it was cool to be watching it and see them using a piece of >gear I've got in my backpack. > >Steve >Team Tierra Buena > From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 1 01:55:47 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ben Dilcher) Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 18:55:47 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Military GPS Message-ID: ------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C2C95A.5D9DFDB0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable My brother also said that my etrax Legend (or many other kinds of civ= ilian GPS's) can actually get an accuracy to a couple feet In ideal condi= tions. If you notice it will only tell you the accuracy is 10 or 11 feet= . This is because of government regs. They like to think they have the = best of everything and civilians can't get that good of technologies. Has yours ever told you that you where 2.55 ft from a waypoint? Mine= has and then you check the accuracy and it says 11 feet. This is becaus= e you are not supposed to have better than 10 ft accuracy. ------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C2C95A.5D9DFDB0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
  &n= bsp; My brother also said that my etrax Legend (or many other kinds of ci= vilian GPS's) can actually get an accuracy to a couple feet In ideal cond= itions.  If you notice it will only tell you the accuracy is 10 or 1= 1 feet.  This is because of government regs.  They like to thin= k they have the best of everything and civilians can't get that good of t= echnologies.
 
 
  &= nbsp; Has yours ever told you that you where 2.55 ft from a waypoint?&nbs= p; Mine has and then you check the accuracy and it says 11 feet.  Th= is is because you are not supposed to have better than 10 ft accuracy.
------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C2C95A.5D9DFDB0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 1 17:24:03 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 10:24:03 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Space Shuttle Message-ID: <001d01c2ca16$b87100e0$0828b83f@fishkiller> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01C2C9DC.0AFDF9C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable on its 113th mission the Columbia is now missing presumed destroyed = killing all aboard... not news that I like to wake up to ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01C2C9DC.0AFDF9C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
on its 113th mission the Columbia is = now missing=20 presumed destroyed killing all aboard...
 
 
not news that I like to wake up=20 to
------=_NextPart_000_001A_01C2C9DC.0AFDF9C0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun Feb 2 02:07:28 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (WOLFB8) Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 19:07:28 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Space Shuttle References: <001d01c2ca16$b87100e0$0828b83f@fishkiller> Message-ID: <001a01c2ca60$209804e0$bfd36844@aoldsl.net> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C2CA25.29D01A60 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable For those of you that want to show your support for the crew of the = Columbia there is a memorial at the challenger space center here in phx. = For those of you that did this cache as a drive by maybe tomorrow would = be the day to find out what the space center is all about. If you have not done this cache yet come out and show your support for = the friends and family of Columbia crew. The center is usually closed on Sundays but will be open tomorrow = 2-2-03. http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=3D30703 We will be known by the tracks we leave behind ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Regan Smith=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Saturday, February 01, 2003 10:24 AM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Space Shuttle on its 113th mission the Columbia is now missing presumed destroyed = killing all aboard... not news that I like to wake up to ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C2CA25.29D01A60 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
For those of you that want to show your = support for the crew of the Columbia there is a memorial at the = challenger=20 space center here in phx.  For those of you that did this cache as = a drive=20 by maybe tomorrow would be the day to find out what the space center is = all=20 about.
 
If you have not done this cache yet = come out and=20 show your support for the friends and family of Columbia = crew.
 
The center is usually closed on Sundays = but will be=20 open tomorrow 2-2-03.
 
htt= p://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=3D30703
 
 
We will be known by the tracks we leave behind
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Regan=20 Smith
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com =
Sent: Saturday, February 01, = 2003 10:24=20 AM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Space=20 Shuttle

on its 113th mission the Columbia is = now missing=20 presumed destroyed killing all aboard...
 
 
not news that I like to wake up=20 to
------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C2CA25.29D01A60-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun Feb 2 03:34:33 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 20:34:33 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Training on 2/2 Message-ID: <003c01c2ca6c$0143bb50$c069dd18@OUR> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_003D_01C2CA31.54E4E350 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit As of now (8:30 PM Saturday) I have had no indication from Ranger Wood that the training will be postponed or cancelled, so I assume it is still on. It would be tough to get to everyone anyway, other than through this list. I think Jim Scotti is already up here and I don't know if he has remote computing with him. I am planning on being at the Ranger Station tomorrow morning. It may not be as pleasant a day as perhaps we'd hoped. But I don't know what staying home would accomplish, other than I might take Libby's advice and visit the Challenger Space Center tomorrow if I wasn't committed to this. Steve Team Tierra Buena ------=_NextPart_000_003D_01C2CA31.54E4E350 Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
As of = now (8:30 PM=20 Saturday) I have had no indication from Ranger Wood that the training = will be=20 postponed or cancelled, so I assume it is still on. It would be tough to = get to=20 everyone anyway, other than through this list. I think Jim Scotti is = already up=20 here and I don't know if he has remote computing with = him.
 
I am = planning on=20 being at the Ranger Station tomorrow morning. It may not be as pleasant = a day as=20 perhaps we'd hoped. But I don't know what staying home would accomplish, = other=20 than I might take Libby's advice and visit the Challenger Space Center = tomorrow=20 if I wasn't committed to this.
 
Steve
Team = Tierra=20 Buena
 
 
------=_NextPart_000_003D_01C2CA31.54E4E350-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun Feb 2 04:01:18 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (mike and gale jett) Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 04:01:18 +0000 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Space Shuttle Message-ID:

We were out caching when we heard the news. I knew someone who worked on the computer systems on board the Columbia in her early days. Through him, I got to know her quite well. It kinda feels a little personal. Though of course the loss of the shuttle is nothing compared to the astronauts who lost their lives today. We grieve for their families.

>From: "Regan Smith"
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To:
>Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Space Shuttle
>Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 10:24:03 -0700
>
>on its 113th mission the Columbia is now missing presumed destroyed killing all aboard...
>
>
>not news that I like to wake up to

Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 3 05:27:24 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Romas J. Kirvaitis) Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 22:27:24 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Thompson Peak Message-ID: <000001c2cb44$f0ca7550$6401a8c0@cobaltblue> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C2CB0A.446D4B00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Is it possible to climb Thompson Peak and if so what is the best route = to take to its summit? I was under the impression that the best way to = reach it was from south 128th street and after a short trail its bushwhacking = time all of the way to the summit. Furthermore do you have any information = about climbing to the top of McDowell Peak? This I hear can be accessed from North 128th street and its basically bushwhacking & rock climbing the = whole way. Please let me know. =20 Thanks, Romas. ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C2CB0A.446D4B00 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Is it possible to climb Thompson Peak and if so what is the best route to take to its summit?  I was under the = impression that the best way to reach it was from south 128th = street and after a short trail its bushwhacking time all of the way to the summit.  = Furthermore do you have any information about climbing to the top of = McDowell Peak?  This I hear can be accessed from North 128th = street and its basically bushwhacking & rock climbing the whole way.  Please = let me know.

 

Thanks,

Romas…

------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C2CB0A.446D4B00-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 3 18:57:12 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ford, Denny) Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 11:57:12 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Tonto NF caches Message-ID: I know that there was a discussion of caches being removed in the Superstition Mountains/ Tonto National Forest. My question is, did it include all caches in the Tonto NF, specifically Durango's Watering Hole (GC4AF1). The cache owner works here in the building and is not on the list serve, so he did not see the emails, and I had not paid enough attention to see if it included all caches in the NF. If anyone has a list or knows any details it would be appreciated. thanks Denny Tres Hombres From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 3 19:29:13 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 11:29:13 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Thompson Peak (Romas J. Kirvaitis) In-Reply-To: <200302031918.MAA02016@ns2.sequoia.net> Message-ID: <20030203192913.82727.qmail@web21101.mail.yahoo.com> --0-1698720886-1044300553=:82058 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Romas, Please read my cache description for my Thompson Peak cache for information on the best way to ascend Thompson Peak. The trail I used to climb Thompson Peak begins at the end of Golden Eagle Blvd. in Fountain Hills. My cache is near the summit. Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer) --0-1698720886-1044300553=:82058 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

Romas,

Please read my cache description for my Thompson Peak cache for information on the best way to ascend Thompson Peak.  The trail I used to climb Thompson Peak begins at the end of Golden Eagle Blvd. in Fountain Hills.  My cache is near the summit.

Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer)

--0-1698720886-1044300553=:82058-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 3 19:32:04 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 11:32:04 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... Message-ID: <20030203113205.3689.h003.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Hi all, OK, I know this is off-topic, (see below for ON-Topic item) but I can't think of an easier way to pick the brains of 160+ people, and besides, this is harmless and shoudn't start a long discussion/argument! :-) Did anybody watch the new TV show "DRAGNET" last night (Sunday) 2100 hrs on ABC? IF so, could you please tell me how they got on the trail of the real killer? BOTH my hubby and I fell asleep about 2/3 thru the show (yeah, I know, we're REAL exciting people!! ) for a few minutes. We remember they were following up on people buying "serial killer" stuff online, is that how they got to the Hillside strangler copy-cat? We saw the last part with the wacko in the jail cell. Thanks for your help!! :-) Sorry for the off topic, but we are dying to find out and nobody I talked to so far today watched the show!! OK, ON TOPIC, keep your eyes out for a new THEMED cache SE of Prescott.....I put it out today and hope we can have some fun with it. It's called "McCache"..... Gee, can anybody guess what the THEME might be?? Trisha "Lightning" Prescott ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 3 20:13:16 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Nicol) Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 12:13:16 -0800 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Thompson Peak (Romas J. Kirvaitis) Message-ID: >From: ken@highpointer.com >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com >To: listserv@azgeocaching.com >CC: romas@cox.net >Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Thompson Peak (Romas J. Kirvaitis) >Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 11:29:13 -0800 (PST) > > >Romas, >Please read my cache description for my Thompson Peak cache for information >on the best way to ascend Thompson Peak. The trail I used to climb >Thompson Peak begins at the end of Golden Eagle Blvd. in Fountain Hills. >My cache is near the summit. >Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer) Romas, Thompson Peak is well worth the hike! The views are spectacular and Ken's cache is a very quality cache (as are many of his I have been too!). You will be well rewarded with great views and a good workout once you get up there! ;) There are two other excellent hikes on top of two other nearby peaks as well. Oh, and if you want another great workout and view after doing Thompson Peak there is always RTW-1 Cache NE of Mesa! :) Scott Team Ropingthewind _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 3 20:22:01 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff) Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 13:22:01 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Tonto NF caches In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E3ECF69.4000409@snaptek.com> Ford, Denny wrote: > I know that there was a discussion of caches being removed in the Superstition Mountains/ Tonto National Forest. My > question is, did it include all caches in the Tonto NF, specifically Durango's Watering Hole (GC4AF1). The cache owner > works here in the building and is not on the list serve, so he did not see the emails, and I had not paid enough > attention to see if it included all caches in the NF. Right now it appears to be just the superstition winderness area, I think the national forrest thing was just a rhumor. The Durango's Watering Hole (GC4AF1) cache was also not on the list of caches that were given to me, so I think it's OK for now. Brian Cluff Team Snaptek From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 3 20:28:54 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 15:28:54 -0500 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] canada.com Story Message-ID: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --AE8F_42E3_C4F0_4CD1_B2C4_3C19_F654_D888 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear highpointers@yahoogroups.com,listserv@azgeocaching.com, Your friend Ken@highpointer.com thought you might be interested in this canada.com story: "Students and parents mourn avalanche deaths" http://www.canada.com/calgary/story.asp?id=A0BCBD13-5D6E-4D3F-B15E-225A8E60BE93 Seven high school students from Alberta killed in British Columbia avalanche. _______________________________________ This is a free service courtesy of canada.com (http://www.canada.com) --AE8F_42E3_C4F0_4CD1_B2C4_3C19_F654_D888-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 3 20:37:18 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 13:37:18 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... References: <20030203113205.3689.h003.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Message-ID: <000b01c2cbc4$0c9dec60$c329b83f@fishkiller> What about StarGate SG1 friday night on SciFI chanel?? I missed the last 3rd as well ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 12:32 PM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... > Hi all, > > OK, I know this is off-topic, (see below for ON-Topic item) but I > can't think of an easier way to pick the brains of 160+ people, and > besides, this is harmless and shoudn't start a long > discussion/argument! :-) > > Did anybody watch the new TV show "DRAGNET" last night (Sunday) 2100 > hrs on ABC? IF so, could you please tell me how they got on the trail > of the real killer? BOTH my hubby and I fell asleep about 2/3 thru the > show (yeah, I know, we're REAL exciting people!! ) for a few minutes. > We remember they were following up on people buying "serial killer" > stuff online, is that how they got to the Hillside strangler copy-cat? > We saw the last part with the wacko in the jail cell. > > Thanks for your help!! :-) > > Sorry for the off topic, but we are dying to find out and nobody I > talked to so far today watched the show!! > > OK, ON TOPIC, keep your eyes out for a new THEMED cache SE of > Prescott.....I put it out today and hope we can have some fun with it. > It's called "McCache"..... > > Gee, can anybody guess what the THEME might be?? > > Trisha "Lightning" > Prescott > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > "Although no one can go back and > make a brand new start, > Anyone can start from now and > make a brand new ending." > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 3 21:33:11 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian LaFrance) Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 13:33:11 -0800 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... In-Reply-To: <000b01c2cbc4$0c9dec60$c329b83f@fishkiller> References: <20030203113205.3689.h003.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> <000b01c2cbc4$0c9dec60$c329b83f@fishkiller> Message-ID: <1044307991.3e3ee01792d84@webmail.brianlafrance.com> Fell asleep during South Park last week. What happened? Did they kill Kenny? Quoting Regan Smith : > What about StarGate SG1 friday night on SciFI chanel?? > I missed the last 3rd as well > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 12:32 PM > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... > > > > Hi all, > > > > OK, I know this is off-topic, (see below for ON-Topic item) but I > > can't think of an easier way to pick the brains of 160+ people, and > > besides, this is harmless and shoudn't start a long > > discussion/argument! :-) > > > > Did anybody watch the new TV show "DRAGNET" last night (Sunday) 2100 > > hrs on ABC? IF so, could you please tell me how they got on the trail > > of the real killer? BOTH my hubby and I fell asleep about 2/3 thru the > > show (yeah, I know, we're REAL exciting people!! ) for a few minutes. > > We remember they were following up on people buying "serial killer" > > stuff online, is that how they got to the Hillside strangler copy-cat? > > We saw the last part with the wacko in the jail cell. > > > > Thanks for your help!! :-) > > > > Sorry for the off topic, but we are dying to find out and nobody I > > talked to so far today watched the show!! > > > > OK, ON TOPIC, keep your eyes out for a new THEMED cache SE of > > Prescott.....I put it out today and hope we can have some fun with it. > > It's called "McCache"..... > > > > Gee, can anybody guess what the THEME might be?? > > > > Trisha "Lightning" > > Prescott > > > > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > "Although no one can go back and > > make a brand new start, > > Anyone can start from now and > > make a brand new ending." > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > http://www.azgeocaching.com > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 3 21:33:37 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 14:33:37 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... Message-ID: I have the Friday Night Star gate on tape. And watched it this morning before going to work. What do you want to know about it? Hiker "Regan Smith" To: Sent by: cc: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching. Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... com Monday February 3, 2003 01:37 PM Please respond to listserv What about StarGate SG1 friday night on SciFI chanel?? I missed the last 3rd as well ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 12:32 PM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... > Hi all, > > OK, I know this is off-topic, (see below for ON-Topic item) but I > can't think of an easier way to pick the brains of 160+ people, and > besides, this is harmless and shoudn't start a long > discussion/argument! :-) > > Did anybody watch the new TV show "DRAGNET" last night (Sunday) 2100 > hrs on ABC? IF so, could you please tell me how they got on the trail > of the real killer? BOTH my hubby and I fell asleep about 2/3 thru the > show (yeah, I know, we're REAL exciting people!! ) for a few minutes. > We remember they were following up on people buying "serial killer" > stuff online, is that how they got to the Hillside strangler copy-cat? > We saw the last part with the wacko in the jail cell. > > Thanks for your help!! :-) > > Sorry for the off topic, but we are dying to find out and nobody I > talked to so far today watched the show!! > > OK, ON TOPIC, keep your eyes out for a new THEMED cache SE of > Prescott.....I put it out today and hope we can have some fun with it. > It's called "McCache"..... > > Gee, can anybody guess what the THEME might be?? > > Trisha "Lightning" > Prescott > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > "Although no one can go back and > make a brand new start, > Anyone can start from now and > make a brand new ending." > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 3 11:25:41 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Heather Drake) Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 13:25:41 +0200 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] In Istanbul In-Reply-To: <200301310750.AAA14933@ns2.sequoia.net> Message-ID: Merhaba/Hi all you WARM AZ geocachers! Well, I made it to Istanbul, and I am _freezing_! here. It was snowing this morning on my way to work; not something I'm used to. I think TBs Shaggataur and Homer's Odyssey want to hibernate for a few months rather than be dropped off in some cold cache. Now to go looking for that one virtual cache here in Istanbul...... Allaha ismardalik/Bye for now, Heather (aka Darsantre in her log sigs) *^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^* I am NOT addicted to geocaching. I can stop at any time. Geocaching is not a way of life for me. I donšt need to geocache every day. I can drive past a known geocache location without stopping to search for it. I am NOT addicted to geocaching. Really. http://www.geocaching.com/ ^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 3 22:07:50 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 15:07:50 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] name of your Garmin unit Message-ID: Steve, What is the name of your Garmin unit. Barry From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 01:26:07 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 18:26:07 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... References: Message-ID: <001801c2cbec$6599e4e0$f4e9b141@fishkiller> Did Mayborn stay? and who found Jack first. Thanks ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 2:33 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... > > I have the Friday Night Star gate on tape. And watched it this morning > before going to work. What do you want to know about it? > > Hiker > > > > > > "Regan Smith" > To: > Sent by: cc: > az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching. Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... > com > > > > Monday February 3, 2003 01:37 PM > Please respond to listserv > > > > > > > What about StarGate SG1 friday night on SciFI chanel?? > I missed the last 3rd as well > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 12:32 PM > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... > > > > Hi all, > > > > OK, I know this is off-topic, (see below for ON-Topic item) but I > > can't think of an easier way to pick the brains of 160+ people, and > > besides, this is harmless and shoudn't start a long > > discussion/argument! :-) > > > > Did anybody watch the new TV show "DRAGNET" last night (Sunday) 2100 > > hrs on ABC? IF so, could you please tell me how they got on the trail > > of the real killer? BOTH my hubby and I fell asleep about 2/3 thru the > > show (yeah, I know, we're REAL exciting people!! ) for a few minutes. > > We remember they were following up on people buying "serial killer" > > stuff online, is that how they got to the Hillside strangler copy-cat? > > We saw the last part with the wacko in the jail cell. > > > > Thanks for your help!! :-) > > > > Sorry for the off topic, but we are dying to find out and nobody I > > talked to so far today watched the show!! > > > > OK, ON TOPIC, keep your eyes out for a new THEMED cache SE of > > Prescott.....I put it out today and hope we can have some fun with it. > > It's called "McCache"..... > > > > Gee, can anybody guess what the THEME might be?? > > > > Trisha "Lightning" > > Prescott > > > > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > "Although no one can go back and > > make a brand new start, > > Anyone can start from now and > > make a brand new ending." > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > http://www.azgeocaching.com > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 02:42:07 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 19:42:07 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto Message-ID: <003801c2cbf7$030f9a30$c069dd18@OUR> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0039_01C2CBBC.56B0C230 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit J. Scott Wood, Forest Archaeologist and Heritage Program Manager for Tonto National Forest today took a group of Geocachers on a tour of some of the archaeological sites within the Cave Creek Ranger District along the Seven Springs Road (FR24). He described methods of identifying sites, site etiquette, and the problems and challenges of managing such sites on public lands. He worked his way from the more obvious to some very subtle indicators of where sites are located. If this sounds familiar to those of you who have had site steward training, it's because we were given the same tour, and the same topics, although perhaps not to the level of depth that the stewards get. We had a sunny but very windy day. It was chilly by comparison to some of our recent weather, but it was still a great day to be out in Tonto. Scott also prepared a special "virtual" cache for us. He gave us the coordinates for an archaeological site and challenged us to find it. Just to make things interesting, he gave us the coordinates as they use them in the Forest Service: UTM and NAD27! (Note to Garmin owners: If you ever have to change format and datum in your GPSr, make sure you change the format first and then change the datum. You can ask just about any Garmin owner who was there why you need to remember that.) The Arizona Geocaching community is very fortunate to have someone like Scott at the Forest Service. Scott believes that the public owns the land and it's the Forest Service's job to manage it on behalf of the public. He recognizes the values of Geocaching and feels it's an ideal activity for National Forests. He doesn't think formal permission is required to place caches in Tonto, but as he said, "it can't hurt to stop in at the ranger station and let them know what you're doing." And he reiterated that caches do not belong in designated wilderness areas. About the Mesa Ranger District confiscations and the reports that all caches in the ranger district would be confiscated: Scott told me and some of the other attendees that he "chased that all the way to Washington." There is nothing coming out of the USFS that prohibits Geocaching on Forest Service land in general. He is going to have a talk with the staff at the Mesa RD office and make sure that they are only removing caches in the Wilderness. We had an enjoyable and educational day. Scott is amenable to doing this again if the interest is there. Steve Team Tierra Buena ------=_NextPart_000_0039_01C2CBBC.56B0C230 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
J. = Scott Wood,=20 Forest Archaeologist and Heritage Program Manager for Tonto National = Forest=20 today took a group of Geocachers on a tour of some of the archaeological = sites=20 within the Cave Creek Ranger District along the Seven Springs Road = (FR24). He=20 described methods of identifying sites, site etiquette, and the problems = and=20 challenges of managing such sites on public lands. He worked his way = from the=20 more obvious to some very subtle indicators of where sites are located. = If this=20 sounds familiar to those of you who have had site steward training, it's = because=20 we were given the same tour, and the same topics, although perhaps not = to the=20 level of depth that the stewards get.
 
We had = a sunny but=20 very windy day. It was chilly by comparison to some of our recent = weather, but=20 it was still a great day to be out in Tonto. Scott also prepared a = special=20 "virtual" cache for us. He gave us  the coordinates for an = archaeological=20 site and challenged us to find it. Just to make things interesting, he = gave us=20 the coordinates as they use them in the Forest Service: UTM and NAD27! = (Note=20 to Garmin owners: If you ever have to change format and datum in your = GPSr, make=20 sure you change the format first and then change the datum. You can ask = just=20 about any Garmin owner who was there why you need to remember=20 that.)
 
The = Arizona=20 Geocaching community is very fortunate to have someone like Scott = at the=20 Forest Service. Scott believes that the public owns the land and it's = the Forest=20 Service's job to manage it on behalf of the public. He recognizes the = values of=20 Geocaching and feels it's an ideal activity for National Forests. He = doesn't=20 think formal permission is required to place caches in Tonto, but as he = said,=20 "it can't hurt to stop in at the ranger station and let them know what = you're=20 doing." And he reiterated that caches do not belong in designated = wilderness=20 areas.
 
About = the Mesa=20 Ranger District confiscations and the reports that all caches in the = ranger=20 district would be confiscated: Scott told me and some of the other = attendees=20 that he "chased that all the way to Washington." There is nothing coming = out of=20 the USFS that prohibits Geocaching on Forest Service land in general. He = is=20 going to have a talk with the staff at the Mesa RD office and make sure = that=20 they are only removing caches in the Wilderness.
 
We had = an=20 enjoyable and educational day. Scott is amenable to doing this again if = the=20 interest is there.
 
Steve
Team = Tierra=20 Buena
------=_NextPart_000_0039_01C2CBBC.56B0C230-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 03:57:37 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 20:57:37 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] name of your Garmin unit In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <006601c2cc01$8ee410e0$c069dd18@OUR> > Steve, > What is the name of your Garmin unit. It's a GPSMap 76S. Do not confuse with the GPSMap 76. Significant differences. Steve Team Tierra Buena From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 03:57:37 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 20:57:37 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] In Istanbul In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <006701c2cc01$8f508e50$c069dd18@OUR> > Well, I made it to Istanbul, and I am _freezing_! here. It was snowing this > morning on my way to work; not something I'm used to. I think TBs > Shaggataur and Homer's Odyssey want to hibernate for a few months rather > than be dropped off in some cold cache. Now to go looking for that one > virtual cache here in Istanbul...... Glad to hear you made it safely, Heather. I take it you didn't go for that bug hotel in Frankfurt, then. Steve Team Tierra Buena From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 06:15:01 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Scott_Wood?=) Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 23:15:01 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] =?iso-8859-1?Q?What_would_you_do=3F?= Message-ID: <1073.206.228.113.56.1044339301.squirrel@www.myblueheaven.com> Hi everyone, I am still up here in North Idaho and decided that I wanted to place a virtual cache at a place on the University of Idaho campus that had trees that were planted by famous people. I picked a tree that was planted by a VERY famous US President nearly 100 years ago. I was just informed by one of the admins (moun10bike) that he would not approve my cache since it didn't live up to what he thought the new requirements should be for virtual caches. Namely it isn't a place that is unique that would be in a coffee table book. He said that if I wanted a cache here I should hide a micro at the location. For any number of reason this is just a bad idea, and a virtual is the only way to do this one. This area is that special, and you would be amazed as to the names that you will come across if you walk through the lawn and look at the plaques near each tree. What do you think I should do? Should I contact Jeremy and plead my case to him? Should I just let it go and not worry about it? I look forward to everyones suggestions. Scott From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 07:40:39 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (xWaterLilyx) Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 23:40:39 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] What_would_you_do? In-Reply-To: <1073.206.228.113.56.1044339301.squirrel@www.myblueheaven.com> Message-ID: <20030204074039.31594.qmail@web14807.mail.yahoo.com> --- Scott_Wood wrote: > Hi everyone, > > I am still up here in North Idaho and decided that I > wanted to place a > virtual cache at a place on the University of Idaho > campus that had trees > that were planted by famous people. I picked a tree > that was planted by a > VERY famous US President nearly 100 years ago. > > I was just informed by one of the admins > (moun10bike) that he would not > approve my cache since it didn't live up to what he > thought the new > requirements should be for virtual caches. Namely > it isn't a place that is > unique that would be in a coffee table book. He > said that if I wanted a > cache here I should hide a micro at the location. > For any number of reason > this is just a bad idea, and a virtual is the only > way to do this one. > This area is that special, and you would be amazed > as to the names that you > will come across if you walk through the lawn and > look at the plaques near > each tree. > > What do you think I should do? Should I contact > Jeremy and plead my case > to him? Should I just let it go and not worry about > it? > > I look forward to everyones suggestions. > > Scott You can always post it on other websites - such as your personal site, any of the other geocaching sites out there, or sites run by other personal sites from geocaching members. It might not get as much traffic as it would if geocaching.com posted it however it would be out there and people would be able to enjoy the unique spot you located. Which sounds like a neat virtual to me. ===== xWaterLilyx & RTF Team H20 Phoenix, AZ (Ahwatukee) Geocaching Site: http://www.geocities.com/xwaterlilyxrtf __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 11:58:11 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mark Heitowit) Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 04:58:11 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] What would you do? References: <1073.206.228.113.56.1044339301.squirrel@www.myblueheaven.com> Message-ID: <3E3FAAD2.CB0FDDB8@usa.net> We got the same answer from Eric yesterday. We emailed a response to him showing how each requirement from the rules page was met (a link to the rules page should be in the email you received). The cache was approved shortly after. good luck, Mark, Magical Memories Scott Wood wrote: > Hi everyone, > > I am still up here in North Idaho and decided that I wanted to place a > virtual cache at a place on the University of Idaho campus that had trees > that were planted by famous people. I picked a tree that was planted by a > VERY famous US President nearly 100 years ago. > > I was just informed by one of the admins (moun10bike) that he would not > approve my cache since it didn't live up to what he thought the new > requirements should be for virtual caches. Namely it isn't a place that is > unique that would be in a coffee table book. He said that if I wanted a > cache here I should hide a micro at the location. For any number of reason > this is just a bad idea, and a virtual is the only way to do this one. > This area is that special, and you would be amazed as to the names that you > will come across if you walk through the lawn and look at the plaques near > each tree. > > What do you think I should do? Should I contact Jeremy and plead my case > to him? Should I just let it go and not worry about it? > > I look forward to everyones suggestions. > > Scott > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 13:43:47 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 06:43:47 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] for the caching gods Message-ID: <004201c2cc53$7220cfa0$f700b83f@fishkiller> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_003F_01C2CC18.C4D88200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Howdy and good day I was wondering why I am unable to join the live chat, I was able to as = of Wednesday last week... I am running IE6.5=20 I made sure I had the most recent version of java ------=_NextPart_000_003F_01C2CC18.C4D88200 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Howdy and good day
 
I was wondering why I am unable to join = the live=20 chat, I was able to as of Wednesday last week...
 
I am running IE6.5
I made sure I had the most recent = version of=20 java
 
 
------=_NextPart_000_003F_01C2CC18.C4D88200-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 13:48:08 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Coyote1022) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 06:48:08 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] What would you do? In-Reply-To: <1073.206.228.113.56.1044339301.squirrel@www.myblueheaven.com> Message-ID: Definitely contact Jeremy and plead your case. If it is still declined, then let it go and don't worry about it. -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Scott Wood Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 11:15 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: [Az-Geocaching] What would you do? Hi everyone, I am still up here in North Idaho and decided that I wanted to place a virtual cache at a place on the University of Idaho campus that had trees that were planted by famous people. I picked a tree that was planted by a VERY famous US President nearly 100 years ago. I was just informed by one of the admins (moun10bike) that he would not approve my cache since it didn't live up to what he thought the new requirements should be for virtual caches. Namely it isn't a place that is unique that would be in a coffee table book. He said that if I wanted a cache here I should hide a micro at the location. For any number of reason this is just a bad idea, and a virtual is the only way to do this one. This area is that special, and you would be amazed as to the names that you will come across if you walk through the lawn and look at the plaques near each tree. What do you think I should do? Should I contact Jeremy and plead my case to him? Should I just let it go and not worry about it? I look forward to everyones suggestions. Scott ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 15:58:40 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 08:58:40 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... Message-ID: Sam figured out where they were and they were rescued by the tok'ra. Jack says that the Tok'ra will find a place for Mayborn. "Regan Smith" To: Sent by: cc: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching. Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... com Monday February 3, 2003 06:26 PM Please respond to listserv Did Mayborn stay? and who found Jack first. Thanks ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 2:33 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... > > I have the Friday Night Star gate on tape. And watched it this morning > before going to work. What do you want to know about it? > > Hiker > > > > > > "Regan Smith" > To: > Sent by: cc: > az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching. Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... > com > > > > Monday February 3, 2003 01:37 PM > Please respond to listserv > > > > > > > What about StarGate SG1 friday night on SciFI chanel?? > I missed the last 3rd as well > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 12:32 PM > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... > > > > Hi all, > > > > OK, I know this is off-topic, (see below for ON-Topic item) but I > > can't think of an easier way to pick the brains of 160+ people, and > > besides, this is harmless and shoudn't start a long > > discussion/argument! :-) > > > > Did anybody watch the new TV show "DRAGNET" last night (Sunday) 2100 > > hrs on ABC? IF so, could you please tell me how they got on the trail > > of the real killer? BOTH my hubby and I fell asleep about 2/3 thru the > > show (yeah, I know, we're REAL exciting people!! ) for a few minutes. > > We remember they were following up on people buying "serial killer" > > stuff online, is that how they got to the Hillside strangler copy-cat? > > We saw the last part with the wacko in the jail cell. > > > > Thanks for your help!! :-) > > > > Sorry for the off topic, but we are dying to find out and nobody I > > talked to so far today watched the show!! > > > > OK, ON TOPIC, keep your eyes out for a new THEMED cache SE of > > Prescott.....I put it out today and hope we can have some fun with it. > > It's called "McCache"..... > > > > Gee, can anybody guess what the THEME might be?? > > > > Trisha "Lightning" > > Prescott > > > > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > "Although no one can go back and > > make a brand new start, > > Anyone can start from now and > > make a brand new ending." > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > http://www.azgeocaching.com > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 16:15:39 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Chelby Geiss) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 09:15:39 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto In-Reply-To: <003801c2cbf7$030f9a30$c069dd18@OUR> Message-ID: Here is a link to the pictures that Kevin took on Sunday. Please excuse our S_L_O_W server! http://www.desertsol.com/~kevin/site_survey/ I can't believe I was too sick to go! Grrr! PS...my apologies to Ken and Virgil for having to ride in our furry truck! If I would have known we were going to have guests in the truck, I would have had Kev vacuum it out!!! :) Team desertSol Chelby & Kevin + Kiva and Lancer (German Shepherds) Apache Junction, AZ www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 16:22:26 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mike Ingoglia) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 09:22:26 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] What would you do? References: <1073.206.228.113.56.1044339301.squirrel@www.myblueheaven.com> Message-ID: <02a701c2cc69$9b3bb8d0$cf98a8c0@Mike> Obviously moun10bike doesn't find the area interesting so (assuming of course that your cache follows the rules) it appears it's his belief that if he doesn't find the area interesting then no one will. This is unfortunate... kind of like he's the geocache-Nazi. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Wood" To: Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 11:15 PM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] What would you do? > Hi everyone, > > I am still up here in North Idaho and decided that I wanted to place a > virtual cache at a place on the University of Idaho campus that had trees > that were planted by famous people. I picked a tree that was planted by a > VERY famous US President nearly 100 years ago. > > I was just informed by one of the admins (moun10bike) that he would not > approve my cache since it didn't live up to what he thought the new > requirements should be for virtual caches. Namely it isn't a place that is > unique that would be in a coffee table book. He said that if I wanted a > cache here I should hide a micro at the location. For any number of reason > this is just a bad idea, and a virtual is the only way to do this one. > This area is that special, and you would be amazed as to the names that you > will come across if you walk through the lawn and look at the plaques near > each tree. > > What do you think I should do? Should I contact Jeremy and plead my case > to him? Should I just let it go and not worry about it? > > I look forward to everyones suggestions. > > Scott > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 16:50:12 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Eric Quinn) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 08:50:12 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] What would you do? In-Reply-To: <02a701c2cc69$9b3bb8d0$cf98a8c0@Mike> Message-ID: <20030204165012.61023.qmail@web40607.mail.yahoo.com> Personally, I would prefer this attitude as opposed to a "let's permit everything". Otherwise, you get a ton of uninteresting places. In addition, it would fill up the database faster, resulting in the numbering system needing to be fixed sooner, more space required and fater processing needed to dig through all of the records. It's a privately run site, the approvers are volunteers appointed by the owner and they're flexible if you can show them how the cache in question does meet with the rules. Equating Moun10bike to one of the worst scourges the world has ever seen is extremely out of line. Eric Team Dragon --- Mike Ingoglia wrote: > Obviously moun10bike doesn't find the area > interesting so (assuming of > course that your cache follows the rules) it appears > it's his belief that if > he doesn't find the area interesting then no one > will. This is > unfortunate... kind of like he's the geocache-Nazi. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Scott Wood" > To: > Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 11:15 PM > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] What would you do? > > > > Hi everyone, > > > > I am still up here in North Idaho and decided that > I wanted to place a > > virtual cache at a place on the University of > Idaho campus that had trees > > that were planted by famous people. I picked a > tree that was planted by a > > VERY famous US President nearly 100 years ago. > > > > I was just informed by one of the admins > (moun10bike) that he would not > > approve my cache since it didn't live up to what > he thought the new > > requirements should be for virtual caches. Namely > it isn't a place that > is > > unique that would be in a coffee table book. He > said that if I wanted a > > cache here I should hide a micro at the location. > For any number of > reason > > this is just a bad idea, and a virtual is the only > way to do this one. > > This area is that special, and you would be amazed > as to the names that > you > > will come across if you walk through the lawn and > look at the plaques near > > each tree. > > > > What do you think I should do? Should I contact > Jeremy and plead my case > > to him? Should I just let it go and not worry > about it? > > > > I look forward to everyones suggestions. > > > > Scott > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Az-Geocaching mailing list > listserv@azgeocaching.com > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe > visit: > > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe > visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 16:53:56 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jason Poulter) Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 09:53:56 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] for the caching gods In-Reply-To: <004201c2cc53$7220cfa0$f700b83f@fishkiller> References: <004201c2cc53$7220cfa0$f700b83f@fishkiller> Message-ID: <3E3FF024.8050300@snaptek.com> don't know... everything is working fine... i just connected to it using mozilla and internet explorer... check you java make sure its working and you see that little logo java cup thing pop up in the top left corner of the box... if ya dont see that its not working.... make sure you didnt install something recently that might have changed settings or downgraded your jave? thats all i can think jason Regan Smith wrote: > Howdy and good day > > I was wondering why I am unable to join the live chat, I was able to as > of Wednesday last week... > > I am running IE6.5 > I made sure I had the most recent version of java > > From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 17:01:26 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mike Ingoglia) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 10:01:26 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] What would you do? References: <20030204165012.61023.qmail@web40607.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <04aa01c2cc6f$0da7eba0$cf98a8c0@Mike> You obviously don't watch Seinfeld..... the Soup-Nazi. :) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eric Quinn" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 9:50 AM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] What would you do? > Personally, I would prefer this attitude as opposed to > a "let's permit everything". Otherwise, you get a ton > of uninteresting places. In addition, it would fill up > the database faster, resulting in the numbering system > needing to be fixed sooner, more space required and > fater processing needed to dig through all of the > records. > > It's a privately run site, the approvers are > volunteers appointed by the owner and they're flexible > if you can show them how the cache in question does > meet with the rules. Equating Moun10bike to one of the > worst scourges the world has ever seen is extremely > out of line. > > > Eric > Team Dragon > > > --- Mike Ingoglia wrote: > > Obviously moun10bike doesn't find the area > > interesting so (assuming of > > course that your cache follows the rules) it appears > > it's his belief that if > > he doesn't find the area interesting then no one > > will. This is > > unfortunate... kind of like he's the geocache-Nazi. > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Scott Wood" > > To: > > Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 11:15 PM > > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] What would you do? > > > > > > > Hi everyone, > > > > > > I am still up here in North Idaho and decided that > > I wanted to place a > > > virtual cache at a place on the University of > > Idaho campus that had trees > > > that were planted by famous people. I picked a > > tree that was planted by a > > > VERY famous US President nearly 100 years ago. > > > > > > I was just informed by one of the admins > > (moun10bike) that he would not > > > approve my cache since it didn't live up to what > > he thought the new > > > requirements should be for virtual caches. Namely > > it isn't a place that > > is > > > unique that would be in a coffee table book. He > > said that if I wanted a > > > cache here I should hide a micro at the location. > > For any number of > > reason > > > this is just a bad idea, and a virtual is the only > > way to do this one. > > > This area is that special, and you would be amazed > > as to the names that > > you > > > will come across if you walk through the lawn and > > look at the plaques near > > > each tree. > > > > > > What do you think I should do? Should I contact > > Jeremy and plead my case > > > to him? Should I just let it go and not worry > > about it? > > > > > > I look forward to everyones suggestions. > > > > > > Scott > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > > Az-Geocaching mailing list > > listserv@azgeocaching.com > > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe > > visit: > > > > > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe > > visit: > > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. > http://mailplus.yahoo.com > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 17:53:02 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jason Poulter) Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 10:53:02 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] New Photo Albums!!! Online! Message-ID: <3E3FFDFE.7000609@snaptek.com> There are new pictures in the AzGeocaching.com Photo Album the pictures from the ElCamino Diablo Strike Force Mission and pictures from the Site Steward Training jason From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 19:13:37 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 12:13:37 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... References: Message-ID: <001701c2cc81$860335c0$d431b83f@fishkiller> Thanks!!!!!!!!! ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 8:58 AM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... > > Sam figured out where they were and they were rescued by the tok'ra. Jack > says that the Tok'ra will find a place for Mayborn. > > > > > > "Regan Smith" > To: > Sent by: cc: > az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching. Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... > com > > > > Monday February 3, 2003 06:26 PM > Please respond to listserv > > > > > > > Did Mayborn stay? and who found Jack first. > > > Thanks > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 2:33 PM > Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... > > > > > > I have the Friday Night Star gate on tape. And watched it this morning > > before going to work. What do you want to know about it? > > > > Hiker > > > > > > > > > > > > "Regan Smith" > > To: > > > Sent by: cc: > > az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching. Subject: > Re: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... > > com > > > > > > > > Monday February 3, 2003 01:37 PM > > Please respond to listserv > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What about StarGate SG1 friday night on SciFI chanel?? > > I missed the last 3rd as well > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: > > To: > > Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 12:32 PM > > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Question..... > > > > > > > Hi all, > > > > > > OK, I know this is off-topic, (see below for ON-Topic item) but I > > > can't think of an easier way to pick the brains of 160+ people, and > > > besides, this is harmless and shoudn't start a long > > > discussion/argument! :-) > > > > > > Did anybody watch the new TV show "DRAGNET" last night (Sunday) 2100 > > > hrs on ABC? IF so, could you please tell me how they got on the trail > > > of the real killer? BOTH my hubby and I fell asleep about 2/3 thru the > > > show (yeah, I know, we're REAL exciting people!! ) for a few minutes. > > > We remember they were following up on people buying "serial killer" > > > stuff online, is that how they got to the Hillside strangler copy-cat? > > > We saw the last part with the wacko in the jail cell. > > > > > > Thanks for your help!! :-) > > > > > > Sorry for the off topic, but we are dying to find out and nobody I > > > talked to so far today watched the show!! > > > > > > OK, ON TOPIC, keep your eyes out for a new THEMED cache SE of > > > Prescott.....I put it out today and hope we can have some fun with it. > > > It's called "McCache"..... > > > > > > Gee, can anybody guess what the THEME might be?? > > > > > > Trisha "Lightning" > > > Prescott > > > > > > > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > > "Although no one can go back and > > > make a brand new start, > > > Anyone can start from now and > > > make a brand new ending." > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 19:52:00 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 12:52:00 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] From the Scottsdale Weekly Fishwrap Message-ID: <001801c2cc86$e395bb40$c069dd18@OUR> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01C2CC4C.3736E340 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This may be of interest to some: TONTO NATIONAL FOREST PASSES NOW AVAILABLE New 2003 annual passes are now available for more than 40 recreation sites in the Tonto National Forest. The passes will be sold at a discount price since a printing contract problem prevented their delivery at the beginning of the year. The normal cost of a pass valid for seven days a week throughout the year is $90. A weekday pass, valid Monday through Thursday, is normally $60. Discounted prices will be $80 for the seven-day pass and $50 for the weekday pass. People with a 2002 ass will be allowed to use it through Feb. 16 to allow time to purchase a 2003 pass. The windshield-sticker pass exempts vehicles from the required daily parking fees. Passes also cover additional parking fees for vehicles with boats at launch sites on Saguaro, Canyon, Apache, Roosevelt, Bartlett and Horseshoe lakes. For more information, contact the Tonto National Forest Cave Creek Ranger Station, 40202 N. Cave Creek, Rd., Scottsdale, (480) 595-3300. Steve Team Tierra Buena ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01C2CC4C.3736E340 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
This = may be of=20 interest to some:
 
 
TONTO = NATIONAL=20 FOREST PASSES NOW AVAILABLE
 
New = 2003 annual=20 passes are now available for more than 40 recreation sites in the Tonto = National=20 Forest. The passes will be sold at a discount price since a printing = contract=20 problem prevented their delivery at the beginning of the=20 year.
 
The = normal cost of=20 a pass valid for seven days a week throughout the year is $90. A weekday = pass,=20 valid Monday through Thursday, is normally $60. Discounted prices will = be $80=20 for the seven-day pass and $50 for the weekday pass.
 
People = with a 2002=20 ass will be allowed to use it through Feb. 16 to allow time to purchase = a 2003=20 pass.
 
The=20 windshield-sticker pass exempts vehicles from the required daily parking = fees.=20 Passes also cover additional parking fees for vehicles with boats at = launch=20 sites on Saguaro, Canyon, Apache, Roosevelt, Bartlett and Horseshoe=20 lakes.
 
For = more=20 information, contact the Tonto National Forest Cave Creek Ranger = Station, 40202=20 N. Cave Creek, Rd., Scottsdale, (480) 595-3300.
 
Steve
Team = Tierra=20 Buena
------=_NextPart_000_0019_01C2CC4C.3736E340-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 19:57:44 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 11:57:44 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Great idea for virtual cache along a tree-lined drive: Banyon Drive in Hilo, Hawaii Message-ID: <20030204195744.71924.qmail@web21104.mail.yahoo.com> --0-1958223694-1044388664=:71146 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii If you're ever in Hilo, Hawaii, here is a great place to visit with famous trees, and worthy of a virtual cache (one has not been established there). Along Banyan Drive near Lili'uokalani Gardens, there are many large banyan trees planted by numerous dignitaries and celebrities beginning in 1933 and continuing up until the 1960's. Each of these trees is marked by a sign or plant noting the name of the person who planted it and the date it was planted. Among the famous people who planted trees included Babe Ruth, Cecil B. deMille, King George V, Franklin D. Roosevelt, Amelia Earhart, Louis Armstrong, and Richard M. Nixon. I learned about several years ago while reading a publication of the Society for American Baseball Research (SABR) which described the Babe Ruth banyan tree that the Babe planted in front of the Hilo Hawaiian Hotel during an off-season trip in October 1993. I visited Banyan Drive in July 2000, during a trip to Hawaii when I attended the Highpointers Club convention in Kona and ascended Mauna Kea, highest point of Hawaii. If any geocachers do visit the Big Island of Hawaii, I recommend that you visit Banyan Drive in Hilo, and make a virtual cache. I recommend a multi-location virtual, which would have coordinates for a list of trees planted by notable people such as the Babe, FDR, Nixon, etc. To complete the cache, go to each of the locations and identify the person who planted the tree. If I revisited Hilo before such a virtual cache is established, I would make the cache myself. Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer) --0-1958223694-1044388664=:71146 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

If you're ever in Hilo, Hawaii, here is a great place to visit with famous trees, and worthy of a virtual cache (one has not been established there).  Along Banyan Drive near Lili'uokalani Gardens, there are many large banyan trees planted by numerous dignitaries and celebrities beginning in 1933 and continuing up until the 1960's.  Each of these trees is marked by a sign or plant noting the name of the person who planted it and the date it was planted.  Among the famous people who planted trees included Babe Ruth, Cecil B. deMille, King George V, Franklin D. Roosevelt, Amelia Earhart, Louis Armstrong, and Richard M. Nixon.

I learned about several years ago while reading a publication of the Society for American Baseball Research (SABR) which described the Babe Ruth banyan tree that the Babe planted in front of the Hilo Hawaiian Hotel during an off-season trip in October 1993.  I visited Banyan Drive in July 2000, during a trip to Hawaii when I attended the Highpointers Club convention in Kona and ascended Mauna Kea, highest point of Hawaii.

If any geocachers do visit the Big Island of Hawaii, I recommend that you visit Banyan Drive in Hilo, and make a virtual cache.  I recommend a multi-location virtual, which would have coordinates for a list of trees planted by notable people such as the Babe, FDR, Nixon, etc.  To complete the cache, go to each of the locations and identify the person who planted the tree.   If I revisited Hilo before such a virtual cache is established, I would make the cache myself.

Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer) 

--0-1958223694-1044388664=:71146-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 20:00:48 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 13:00:48 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Mohawks in Yuma? Message-ID: <001e01c2cc88$1ee1ac80$c069dd18@OUR> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001F_01C2CC4D.7282D480 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Other than having read Dee Brown's "Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee" many years ago (great book, BTW), I don't know anything about Native American history, shame on me. But when we were down in Yuma for the Strike Force, there were several geographic entities in the area that contained the name "Mohawk". There was Mohawk Valley, the Mohawk Canal, and others. I've always associated the Mohawks with upstate New York, James Fenimore Cooper and all that. Does anyone here know how the "Mohawk influence" came to Yuma County, Arizona? Barring that, anyone have any suggestions as to how I might find out? Googling "Mohawk" and "Arizona" wasn't much help. Steve Team Tierra Buena ------=_NextPart_000_001F_01C2CC4D.7282D480 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
Other = than having=20 read Dee Brown's "Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee" many years ago (great = book,=20 BTW), I don't know anything about Native American history, shame on=20 me. But when we were down in Yuma for the Strike = Force, there=20 were several geographic entities in the area that contained the name = "Mohawk".=20 There was Mohawk Valley, the Mohawk Canal, and = others.
 
I've = always=20 associated the Mohawks with upstate New York, James Fenimore Cooper and = all=20 that. Does anyone here know how the "Mohawk influence" came to Yuma = County,=20 Arizona? Barring that, anyone have any suggestions as to how I might = find out?=20 Googling "Mohawk" and "Arizona" wasn't much help.
 
Steve
Team = Tierra=20 Buena
------=_NextPart_000_001F_01C2CC4D.7282D480-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 20:21:09 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mark Heitowit) Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 13:21:09 -0700 Subject: [[Az-Geocaching] Mohawks in Yuma?] Message-ID: <232HBDuVJ3920S18.1044390069@uwdvg018.cms.usa.net> You might try the public library, The Yuma Chamber of Commerce, or The Heard Museum. "Team Tierra Buena" wrote: > --------------------------------------------- > Attachment:  > MIME Type: multipart/alternative > --------------------------------------------- > Other than having read Dee Brown's "Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee" many > years ago (great book, BTW), I don't know anything about Native American > history, shame on me. But when we were down in Yuma for the Strike > Force, there were several geographic entities in the area that contained > the name "Mohawk". There was Mohawk Valley, the Mohawk Canal, and > others. > > I've always associated the Mohawks with upstate New York, James Fenimore > Cooper and all that. Does anyone here know how the "Mohawk influence" > came to Yuma County, Arizona? Barring that, anyone have any suggestions > as to how I might find out? Googling "Mohawk" and "Arizona" wasn't much > help. > > Steve > Team Tierra Buena > From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 20:30:29 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 12:30:29 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] From the Scottsdale Weekly Fishwrap Message-ID: <20030204123030.6005.h018.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Hm....darnit, I left my "2002 ass" back in December someplace.... heh heh Trisha "Team Tierra Buena" wrote: Message This may be of interest to some:     TONTO NATIONAL FOREST PASSES NOW AVAILABLE   New 2003 annual passes are now available for more than 40 recreation sites in the Tonto National Forest. The passes will be sold at a discount price since a printing contract problem prevented their delivery at the beginning of the year.   The normal cost of a pass valid for seven days a week throughout the year is $90. A weekday pass, valid Monday through Thursday, is normally $60. Discounted prices will be $80 for the seven-day pass and $50 for the weekday pass.   People with a 2002 ass will be allowed to use it through Feb. 16 to allow time to purchase a 2003 pass.   The windshield-sticker pass exempts vehicles from the required daily parking fees. Passes also cover additional parking fees for vehicles with boats at launch sites on Saguaro, Canyon, Apache, Roosevelt, Bartlett and Horseshoe lakes.   For more information, contact the Tonto National Forest Cave Creek Ranger Station, 40202 N. Cave Creek, Rd., Scottsdale, (480) 595-3300.   Steve Team Tierra Buena ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 20:34:43 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 13:34:43 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] From the Scottsdale Weekly Fishwrap In-Reply-To: <20030204123030.6005.h018.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Message-ID: <000b01c2cc8c$da1ee220$c069dd18@OUR> > Hm....darnit, I left my "2002 ass" back in December someplace.... Putt knot yore truss en spiel chequers. From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 21:33:07 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 13:33:07 -0800 (PST) Subject: [[Az-Geocaching] Mohawks in Yuma?] Message-ID: <20030204133307.19356.h018.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> On Tue, 04 Feb 2003, Mark Heitowit wrote: > > You might try the public library, The Yuma Chamber of Commerce, or The > Heard > Museum. > > "Team Tierra Buena" wrote: > > --------------------------------------------- > > Attachment:  > > MIME Type: multipart/alternative > > --------------------------------------------- > > Other than having read Dee Brown's "Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee" > many > > years ago (great book, BTW), I don't know anything about Native > American > > history, shame on me. But when we were down in Yuma for the Strike > > Force, there were several geographic entities in the area that > contained > > the name "Mohawk". There was Mohawk Valley, the Mohawk Canal, and > > others. > > > > I've always associated the Mohawks with upstate New York, James > Fenimore > > Cooper and all that. Does anyone here know how the "Mohawk influence" > > came to Yuma County, Arizona? Barring that, anyone have any > suggestions > > as to how I might find out? Googling "Mohawk" and "Arizona" wasn't > much > > help. > > > > Steve > > Team Tierra Buena > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 21:35:26 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 14:35:26 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto References: <003801c2cbf7$030f9a30$c069dd18@OUR> Message-ID: <003701c2cc95$568efcc0$fe29b83f@fishkiller> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0034_01C2CC5A.A8AE18A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MessageHe recognizes the values of Geocaching and feels it's an ideal = activity for National Forests. He doesn't think formal permission is = required to place caches in Tonto, but as he said, "it can't hurt to = stop in at the ranger station and let them know what you're doing." And = he reiterated that caches do not belong in designated wilderness areas. Is it possible that someone official could log on the Main website and = Request an Archive of those Physical Caches? as after logging a find on Scorpions2003 was emailed by the owner with = this question: Why would the rangers go out looking for it? and if you read my log and wonder what my note said it was simply Forest = Ranger dude login to the website and join us on the legal caches ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Team Tierra Buena=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 7:42 PM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto J. Scott Wood, Forest Archaeologist and Heritage Program Manager for = Tonto National Forest today took a group of Geocachers on a tour of some = of the archaeological sites within the Cave Creek Ranger District along = the Seven Springs Road (FR24). He described methods of identifying = sites, site etiquette, and the problems and challenges of managing such = sites on public lands. He worked his way from the more obvious to some = very subtle indicators of where sites are located. If this sounds = familiar to those of you who have had site steward training, it's = because we were given the same tour, and the same topics, although = perhaps not to the level of depth that the stewards get. We had a sunny but very windy day. It was chilly by comparison to some = of our recent weather, but it was still a great day to be out in Tonto. = Scott also prepared a special "virtual" cache for us. He gave us the = coordinates for an archaeological site and challenged us to find it. = Just to make things interesting, he gave us the coordinates as they use = them in the Forest Service: UTM and NAD27! (Note to Garmin owners: If = you ever have to change format and datum in your GPSr, make sure you = change the format first and then change the datum. You can ask just = about any Garmin owner who was there why you need to remember that.) The Arizona Geocaching community is very fortunate to have someone = like Scott at the Forest Service. Scott believes that the public owns = the land and it's the Forest Service's job to manage it on behalf of the = public. He recognizes the values of Geocaching and feels it's an ideal = activity for National Forests. He doesn't think formal permission is = required to place caches in Tonto, but as he said, "it can't hurt to = stop in at the ranger station and let them know what you're doing." And = he reiterated that caches do not belong in designated wilderness areas. About the Mesa Ranger District confiscations and the reports that all = caches in the ranger district would be confiscated: Scott told me and = some of the other attendees that he "chased that all the way to = Washington." There is nothing coming out of the USFS that prohibits = Geocaching on Forest Service land in general. He is going to have a talk = with the staff at the Mesa RD office and make sure that they are only = removing caches in the Wilderness.=20 We had an enjoyable and educational day. Scott is amenable to doing = this again if the interest is there. Steve Team Tierra Buena ------=_NextPart_000_0034_01C2CC5A.A8AE18A0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
He = recognizes the=20 values of Geocaching and feels it's an ideal activity for National = Forests. He=20 doesn't think formal permission is required to place caches in Tonto, = but as he=20 said, "it can't hurt to stop in at the ranger station and let them know = what=20 you're doing." And he reiterated that caches do not belong in designated = wilderness areas.
 
Is it=20 possible that someone official could log on the Main website and Request = an=20 Archive of those Physical Caches?
 
as after=20 logging a find on Scorpions2003 was emailed by the owner with this=20 question:
Why would the=20 rangers go out looking for it?
 
and if = you read my=20 log and wonder what my note said it was simply Forest Ranger dude login = to the=20 website and join us on the legal caches
 
 

----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Team Tierra Buena =
Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 = 7:42=20 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Our = Day in=20 Tonto

J. = Scott Wood,=20 Forest Archaeologist and Heritage Program Manager for Tonto National = Forest=20 today took a group of Geocachers on a tour of some of the = archaeological sites=20 within the Cave Creek Ranger District along the Seven Springs Road = (FR24). He=20 described methods of identifying sites, site etiquette, and the = problems and=20 challenges of managing such sites on public lands. He worked his way = from the=20 more obvious to some very subtle indicators of where sites are = located. If=20 this sounds familiar to those of you who have had site steward = training, it's=20 because we were given the same tour, and the same topics, although = perhaps not=20 to the level of depth that the stewards get.
 
We = had a sunny=20 but very windy day. It was chilly by comparison to some of our recent = weather,=20 but it was still a great day to be out in Tonto. Scott also prepared a = special=20 "virtual" cache for us. He gave us  the coordinates for an = archaeological=20 site and challenged us to find it. Just to make things interesting, he = gave us=20 the coordinates as they use them in the Forest Service: UTM and NAD27! = (Note to Garmin owners: If you ever have to change format and = datum in=20 your GPSr, make sure you change the format first and then change the = datum.=20 You can ask just about any Garmin owner who was there why you need to = remember=20 that.)
 
The = Arizona=20 Geocaching community is very fortunate to have someone like Scott = at the=20 Forest Service. Scott believes that the public owns the land and it's = the=20 Forest Service's job to manage it on behalf of the public. He = recognizes the=20 values of Geocaching and feels it's an ideal activity for National = Forests. He=20 doesn't think formal permission is required to place caches in Tonto, = but as=20 he said, "it can't hurt to stop in at the ranger station and let them = know=20 what you're doing." And he reiterated that caches do not belong in = designated=20 wilderness areas.
 
About the Mesa=20 Ranger District confiscations and the reports that all caches in the = ranger=20 district would be confiscated: Scott told me and some of the other = attendees=20 that he "chased that all the way to Washington." There is nothing = coming out=20 of the USFS that prohibits Geocaching on Forest Service land in = general. He is=20 going to have a talk with the staff at the Mesa RD office and make = sure that=20 they are only removing caches in the Wilderness.
 
We = had an=20 enjoyable and educational day. Scott is amenable to doing this again = if the=20 interest is there.
 
Steve
Team = Tierra=20 Buena
------=_NextPart_000_0034_01C2CC5A.A8AE18A0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 21:35:58 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 13:35:58 -0800 (PST) Subject: [[Az-Geocaching] Mohawks in Yuma?] Message-ID: <20030204133559.14886.h018.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Steve, If you do find out, please let me know. Now you have me curious, and my searching didn't turn up anything. There is a town on the map named Mohawk, near the mountains and valley. Could they be related somehow to the Grumman OV-1C Mohawk Army Surveillance aircraft? (Maybe developed somewhere near Yuma/Goldwater?) Probably not, eh? Trisha On Tue, 04 Feb 2003, Mark Heitowit wrote: > > You might try the public library, The Yuma Chamber of Commerce, or The > Heard > Museum. > > "Team Tierra Buena" wrote: > > --------------------------------------------- > > Attachment:  > > MIME Type: multipart/alternative > > --------------------------------------------- > > Other than having read Dee Brown's "Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee" > many > > years ago (great book, BTW), I don't know anything about Native > American > > history, shame on me. But when we were down in Yuma for the Strike > > Force, there were several geographic entities in the area that > contained > > the name "Mohawk". There was Mohawk Valley, the Mohawk Canal, and > > others. > > > > I've always associated the Mohawks with upstate New York, James > Fenimore > > Cooper and all that. Does anyone here know how the "Mohawk influence" > > came to Yuma County, Arizona? Barring that, anyone have any > suggestions > > as to how I might find out? Googling "Mohawk" and "Arizona" wasn't > much > > help. > > > > Steve > > Team Tierra Buena > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 21:35:47 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Henson) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 14:35:47 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Mohawks in Yuma? In-Reply-To: <001e01c2cc88$1ee1ac80$c069dd18@OUR> Message-ID: <9F922B72-3888-11D7-B25B-000393A13A32@cableone.net> --Apple-Mail-2--484645598 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; format=flowed > ...I've always associated the Mohawks with upstate New York, James=20 > Fenimore Cooper and all that. Does anyone here know how the "Mohawk=20 > influence" came to Yuma County, Arizona? Barring that, anyone have any=20= > suggestions as to how I might find out? Googling "Mohawk" and=20 > "Arizona" wasn't much help. > Steve, hope this is what your were looking for? Mohawk El.: 545=92 Loc.: Yuma In 1869 Mohawk was not the same place as Mission Camp. The later is=20 thirty miles west northwest of Mohawk Station. The original stage=20 station was also not the same as Mohawk on GLO 1903 (twenty-two miles=20 to the west southwest of Chrystoval). The original Mohawk Station was so named by men who created the=20 Butterfield Overland stage route. Many came from New York State and=20 brought place names from there to Arizona. As a stage station, Mohawk=20= vanished. The name came to be applied to the valley in which the stage=20= station was first located. Long before this time, the name had first=20 been applied to Mohawk Gap lying between Texas Hill on the east and=20 Antelope Hill on the west, now known as Mohawk Pass. This same place=20 shows a Mohawk on Smith Map 1879, the first map to use the name Mohawk=20= Range for the mountains bordering the western side of the valley. =20 These mountains were known in the early days as the Big Horn Mountain=20 or Mohawk Peak. In the 1880=92s the present Mohawk was established and the population = was=20 sufficient to require a post office. In 1956 Mohawk consisted of a=20 section station on the railroad, a service station, a motel and a=20 single residence. According to post office records, Chrystoval was=20 changed to Mohawk as of September 30, 1905. The above was taken from: Arizona Place Names, Revised and enlarged by=20= Byrd H. Granger, The University of Arizona Press, 1960. --Apple-Mail-2--484645598 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/enriched; charset=WINDOWS-1252 ...I've always associated the Mohawks with upstate New York, James Fenimore Cooper and all that. Does anyone here know how the "Mohawk influence" came to Yuma County, Arizona? Barring that, anyone have any suggestions as to how I might find out? Googling "Mohawk" and "Arizona" wasn't much help. Steve, hope this is what your were looking for? GenevaMohawk El.: 545=92 Loc.: Yuma In 1869 Mohawk was not the same place as Mission Camp. The later is thirty miles west northwest of Mohawk Station. The original stage station was also not the same as Mohawk on GLO 1903 (twenty-two miles to the west southwest of Chrystoval). The original Mohawk Station was so named by men who created the Butterfield Overland stage route. Many came from New York State and brought place names from there to Arizona. As a stage station, Mohawk vanished. The name came to be applied to the valley in which the stage station was first located. Long before this time, the name had first been applied to Mohawk Gap lying between Texas Hill on the east and Antelope Hill on the west, now known as Mohawk Pass. This same place shows a Mohawk on Smith Map 1879, the first map to use the name Mohawk Range for the mountains bordering the western side of the valley. These mountains were known in the early days as the Big Horn Mountain or Mohawk Peak. In the 1880=92s the present Mohawk was established and the population was sufficient to require a post office. In 1956 Mohawk consisted of a section station on the railroad, a service station, a motel and a single residence. According to post office records, Chrystoval was changed to Mohawk as of September 30, 1905. The above was taken from: Arizona Place Names, Revised and enlarged by Byrd H. Granger, The University of Arizona Press, 1960. --Apple-Mail-2--484645598-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 21:48:01 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 13:48:01 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Mohawks in Yuma? Message-ID: <20030204134801.22318.h018.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Very interesting and good detective work, Ken! Thanks! I was getting ready to email the school in Roll and see if anybody knew..... Trisha Ken Henson wrote: > > > ...I've always associated the Mohawks with upstate New York, James > > Fenimore Cooper and all that. Does anyone here know how the "Mohawk > > influence" came to Yuma County, Arizona? Barring that, anyone have > any > > suggestions as to how I might find out? Googling "Mohawk" and > > "Arizona" wasn't much help. > > > > Steve, hope this is what your were looking for? > > Mohawk El.: 545’ Loc.: Yuma > > In 1869 Mohawk was not the same place as Mission Camp. The later is > thirty miles west northwest of Mohawk Station. The original stage > station was also not the same as Mohawk on GLO 1903 (twenty-two miles > to the west southwest of Chrystoval). > > The original Mohawk Station was so named by men who created the > Butterfield Overland stage route. Many came from New York State and > brought place names from there to Arizona. As a stage station, Mohawk > vanished. The name came to be applied to the valley in which the > stage > station was first located. Long before this time, the name had first > been applied to Mohawk Gap lying between Texas Hill on the east and > Antelope Hill on the west, now known as Mohawk Pass. This same place > shows a Mohawk on Smith Map 1879, the first map to use the name Mohawk > Range for the mountains bordering the western side of the valley. > These mountains were known in the early days as the Big Horn Mountain > or Mohawk Peak. > > In the 1880’s the present Mohawk was established and the population > was > sufficient to require a post office. In 1956 Mohawk consisted of a > section station on the railroad, a service station, a motel and a > single residence. According to post office records, Chrystoval was > changed to Mohawk as of September 30, 1905. > > The above was taken from: Arizona Place Names, Revised and enlarged by > Byrd H. Granger, The University of Arizona Press, 1960. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 21:55:59 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 13:55:59 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Neat Place-Name site Message-ID: <20030204135559.23833.h018.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> In looking for info about "Mohawk" AZ, I found a very neat query site for place-names. It confirms Ken's data that "Mohawk" came from New Yorkers......Check it out! http://geonames.usgs.gov/pls/gnis/web_query.gnis_web_query_form ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 21:56:28 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (xWaterLilyx) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 13:56:28 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Mohawks in Yuma? In-Reply-To: <9F922B72-3888-11D7-B25B-000393A13A32@cableone.net> Message-ID: <20030204215628.46205.qmail@web14802.mail.yahoo.com> --0-782444466-1044395788=:45166 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Ken Henson wrote: > ...I've always associated the Mohawks with upstate New York, James > Fenimore Cooper and all that. Does anyone here know how the "Mohawk > influence" came to Yuma County, Arizona? Barring that, anyone have any > suggestions as to how I might find out? Googling "Mohawk" and > "Arizona" wasn't much help. > Steve, hope this is what your were looking for? Mohawk El.: 545’ Loc.: Yuma In 1869 Mohawk was not the same place as Mission Camp. The later is thirty miles west northwest of Mohawk Station. The original stage station was also not the same as Mohawk on GLO 1903 (twenty-two miles to the west southwest of Chrystoval). The original Mohawk Station was so named by men who created the Butterfield Overland stage route. Many came from New York State and brought place names from there to Arizona. As a stage station, Mohawk vanished. The name came to be applied to the valley in which the stage station was first located. Long before this time, the name had first been applied to Mohawk Gap lying between Texas Hill on the east and Antelope Hill on the west, now known as Mohawk Pass. This same place shows a Mohawk on Smith Map 1879, the first map to use the name Mohawk Range for the mountains bordering the western side of the valley. These mountains were known in the early days as the Big Horn Mountain or Mohawk Peak. In the 1880’s the present Mohawk was established and the population was sufficient to require a post office. In 1956 Mohawk consisted of a section station on the railroad, a service station, a motel and a single residence. According to post office records, Chrystoval was changed to Mohawk as of September 30, 1905. The above was taken from: Arizona Place Names, Revised and enlarged by Byrd H. Granger, The University of Arizona Press, 1960. ------------------------------------------------ And now we know!! Because I was getting curious myself and about to do some searchs. Much easier to keep reading the list serve and see the answer pop up on somebody else's hard work!! Thanks for the quick history lesson, and it makes sense if they were from NY. xWaterLilyx & RTF Team H20 Phoenix, AZ (Ahwatukee) Geocaching Site: http://www.geocities.com/xwaterlilyxrtf --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now --0-782444466-1044395788=:45166 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

 Ken Henson <khenson@cableone.net> wrote:

> ...I've always associated the Mohawks with upstate New York, James
> Fenimore Cooper and all that. Does anyone here know how the "Mohawk
> influence" came to Yuma County, Arizona? Barring that, anyone have any
> suggestions as to how I might find out? Googling "Mohawk" and
> "Arizona" wasn't much help.
>

Steve, hope this is what your were looking for?

Mohawk El.: 545’ Loc.: Yuma

In 1869 Mohawk was not the same place as Mission Camp. The later is
thirty miles west northwest of Mohawk Station. The original stage
station was also not the same as Mohawk on GLO 1903 (twenty-two miles
to the west southwest of Chrystoval).

The original Mohawk Station was so named by men who created the
Butterfield Overland stage route. Many came from New York State and
brought place names from there to Arizona. As a stage station, Mohawk
vanished. The name came to be applied to the valley in which the stage
station was first located. Long before this time, the name had first
been applied to Mohawk Gap lying between Texas Hill on the east and
Antelope Hill on the west, now known as Mohawk Pass. This same place
shows a Mohawk on Smith Map 1879, the first map to use the name Mohawk
Range for the mountains bordering the western side of the valley.
These mountains were known in the early days as the Big Horn Mountain
or Mohawk Peak.

In the 1880’s the present Mohawk was established and the population was
sufficient to require a post office. In 1956 Mohawk consisted of a
section station on the railroad, a service station, a motel and a
single residence. According to post office records, Chrystoval was
changed to Mohawk as of September 30, 1905.

The above was taken from: Arizona Place Names, Revised and enlarged by
Byrd H. Granger, The University of Arizona Press, 1960.

------------------------------------------------

 

And now we know!! Because I was getting curious myself and about to do some searchs.  Much easier to keep reading the list serve and see the answer pop up on somebody else's hard work!!

 

Thanks for the quick history lesson, and it makes sense if they were from NY.



xWaterLilyx & RTF
Team H20
Phoenix, AZ (Ahwatukee)

Geocaching Site: http://www.geocities.com/xwaterlilyxrtf


Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now --0-782444466-1044395788=:45166-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 22:28:55 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mike Ingoglia) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 15:28:55 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] off topic References: <20030204165012.61023.qmail@web40607.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <010c01c2cc9c$cd80ccd0$cf98a8c0@Mike> Since I know there's several of you that are into rock crawlin'/ 4 wheelin' I figured I'd pass this on. Someone I know has a two day 4 wheelin' trip with http://www.bb4wa.com/training/group.htm in April that he can't use... if anyone's interested you can contact me at mike@leaplab.com. He paid $295 for it but will let it go for the "best offer"... Figured I'd pass this on (wish I could use it!) Mike From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 4 22:53:29 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 14:53:29 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] off topic Message-ID: <20030204145330.27128.h018.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> I dunno....I think 4 wheelin' is pretty CLOSE to On-topic! Wish I could go Trisha "Mike Ingoglia" wrote: > > Since I know there's several of you that are into rock crawlin'/ 4 > wheelin' > I figured I'd pass this on. Someone I know has a two day 4 wheelin' > trip > with http://www.bb4wa.com/training/group.htm in April that he can't > use... > if anyone's interested you can contact me at mike@leaplab.com. He > paid $295 > for it but will let it go for the "best offer"... Figured I'd pass > this on > (wish I could use it!) > > Mike > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 5 03:18:14 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 19:18:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] New Prescott Cache Message-ID: <20030204191815.7874.h004.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Hey all! Put on your sense of humor (or your funny mask) and check out my new cache: "McCache" GCCF65. I hope you laugh. Some guy in El Paso emailed me and said he came across it, he rolled on the floor laughing, it must be a universal problem, can he use the idea? (like, he needs to ask? no...) Can't remember if I already sent a note to the list serve (where did I leave my brain??) so sorry if this is redundant.... C-ya Trisha "Lightning" Prescott ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 5 03:28:41 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 20:28:41 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Neat Place-Name site In-Reply-To: <20030204135559.23833.h018.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Message-ID: <001e01c2ccc6$aecf3040$c069dd18@OUR> > In looking for info about "Mohawk" AZ, I found a very neat query site for > place-names. That is a neat site, Trisha, thank you! It's going into my bookmark list. Interesting to note that besides Yuma County, there are "Mohawks" in Coconino, Mohave, Pima, Pinal, Santa Cruz, and Yavapai counties as well, although four of them are mines. Steve Team Tierra Buena From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 5 03:28:41 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 20:28:41 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Mohawks in Yuma? In-Reply-To: <9F922B72-3888-11D7-B25B-000393A13A32@cableone.net> Message-ID: <001f01c2ccc6$af92a750$c069dd18@OUR> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0020_01C2CC8C.0333CF50 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Steve, hope this is what your were looking for? Mohawk El.: 545' Loc.: Yuma In 1869 Mohawk was not the same place as Mission Camp. That's exactly what I was looking for, Ken. Thank you. The above was taken from: Arizona Place Names, Revised and enlarged by Byrd H. Granger, The University of Arizona Press, 1960. I've always wanted to get a copy of that book. Now I may have no choice. Steve Team Tierra Buena ------=_NextPart_000_0020_01C2CC8C.0333CF50 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message

Steve, hope this is what your were looking = for?

Mohawk El.: 545’ Loc.: = Yuma

In=20 1869 Mohawk was not the same place as Mission Camp.  
 
That's exactly what I was looking for, Ken. Thank=20 you.

The above was taken from: Arizona Place Names, = Revised=20 and enlarged by Byrd H. Granger, The University of Arizona Press, = 1960. 
 
I've=20 always wanted to get a copy of that book. Now I may have no=20 choice.
 
Steve
Team=20 Tierra Buena 
------=_NextPart_000_0020_01C2CC8C.0333CF50-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 5 03:28:41 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 20:28:41 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto In-Reply-To: <003701c2cc95$568efcc0$fe29b83f@fishkiller> Message-ID: <002401c2ccc6$b0287eb0$c069dd18@OUR> > Is it possible that someone official could log on the Main website and > Request an Archive of those Physical Caches? *Anyone* with a login can do just that, not only officials. Next time you log a cache, look at the choices for log type. There are: Found, Not Found, Note, and "Cache Should be Archived". > as after logging a find on Scorpions2003 was emailed by the owner with > this > question: Why would the rangers go out looking for it? Since their profile indicates that this team has yet to find its first cache, it's evident they are new at this. You may want to drop them a note explaining exactly why the Rangers are going to take their cache sooner or later, and suggesting they remove it and archive it themselves. (What would be really cool is if, when they archived it, they put a note on the cache page explaining that they didn't know it was prohibited to place caches in wilderness areas and that's why they removed it, but that may be too much to ask.) You might also point them to azgeocaching.com. Steve Team Tierra Buena From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 5 04:53:48 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Henson) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 21:53:48 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Dugas Run In-Reply-To: <20030204145330.27128.h018.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Message-ID: More 4 wheelin' info. No Club Club - Monthly Widcat Run February 8 Destination: Dugas Run Difficulty: 2.5 - 3 A three rating: Four-wheel drive required due to terrain and loose traction for safe, easy travel. Rocks and ledges 12 - 15". Lo-range gears used. Challenges for novice driver. Clearance advised. Street tires unacceptable. Meet at: Teske's Restaurant in Mayer. 8:00 A.M. Return by: Suppertime P.M. Comment: If interested in breakfast, Tesk's @ 7:15 AM. From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 5 05:04:04 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (kevin) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 22:04:04 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Message-ID: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C2CC99.595AA310 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Scott, I just went thru the same issue on my Cache "Valley View and then some." I took a couple of minutes to share the historical value. The next day the Cache was listed. So yes plead your case. Kevin- TeamAzona ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C2CC99.595AA310 Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Scott, I just went thru the same issue on my Cache “Valley = View and then some.”  I took a couple of minutes to share the = historical value. The next day the Cache was listed. So yes plead your = case.

Kevin- TeamAzona

------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C2CC99.595AA310-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 5 06:49:33 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Scott_Wood?=) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 23:49:33 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_[Az-Geocaching]_Cache?= In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1207.206.228.112.142.1044427773.squirrel@www.myblueheaven.com> > Scott, I just went thru the same issue on my Cache "Valley View and > then some." I took a couple of minutes to share the historical value. > The next day the Cache was listed. So yes plead your case. I have probably missed a bunch of e-mail on this over the last day or so, I have somewhat limited e-mail ability right now, but I finally got the cache approved. I really think people will like this virtual. From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 5 13:54:06 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 06:54:06 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto revisited References: <002401c2ccc6$b0287eb0$c069dd18@OUR> Message-ID: <002701c2cd1e$0d90c6a0$7f29b83f@fishkiller> > > Is it possible that someone official could log on the Main website and > > > Request an Archive of those Physical Caches? > > *Anyone* with a login can do just that, not only officials. Next time > you log a cache, look at the choices for log type. There are: Found, Not > Found, Note, and "Cache Should be Archived". > My point is why hasn't like anyone who knows the complete list of caches in the Wilderness Area done that????? or why didn't the Rangers do that when they got the Coords for the Caches??? > > as after logging a find on Scorpions2003 was emailed by the owner with > > > this > > question: Why would the rangers go out looking for it? > > Since their profile indicates that this team has yet to find its first > cache, it's evident they are new at this. You may want to drop them a > note explaining exactly why the Rangers are going to take their cache > sooner or later, and suggesting they remove it and archive it > themselves. (What would be really cool is if, when they archived it, > they put a note on the cache page explaining that they didn't know it > was prohibited to place caches in wilderness areas and that's why they > removed it, but that may be too much to ask.) You might also point them > to azgeocaching.com. > Done did that prior to this posting :) The lady caches under a different name > Steve > Team Tierra Buena > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 5 14:21:19 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 07:21:19 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Java problems for the gods Message-ID: <005d01c2cd21$e1f156a0$7f29b83f@fishkiller> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_005A_01C2CCE7.2DC82BC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi even reloaded the program=20 still get=20 load: Class EIRC not found error Thanks for the Help :) Regan ------=_NextPart_000_005A_01C2CCE7.2DC82BC0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi
 
even reloaded the program
 
still get
 
load: Class EIRC not found = error
 
 
Thanks for the Help :)
 
Regan
------=_NextPart_000_005A_01C2CCE7.2DC82BC0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 5 19:06:43 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 12:06:43 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Java problems for the gods References: <005d01c2cd21$e1f156a0$7f29b83f@fishkiller> Message-ID: <000f01c2cd49$c9bfeba0$5310b83f@fishkiller> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C2CD0F.0C42C0A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ok some more reloading and now all get instead of the logo is the white = square with the red square green circle and blue triangle inside ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Regan Smith=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Wednesday, February 05, 2003 7:21 AM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Java problems for the gods Hi even reloaded the program=20 still get=20 load: Class EIRC not found error Thanks for the Help :) Regan ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C2CD0F.0C42C0A0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Ok some more reloading and now all get = instead of=20 the logo is the white square with the red square green circle and blue = triangle=20 inside
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Regan=20 Smith
Sent: Wednesday, February 05, = 2003 7:21=20 AM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Java = problems=20 for the gods

Hi
 
even reloaded the program =
 
still get
 
load: Class EIRC not found = error
 
 
Thanks for the Help :)
 
Regan
------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C2CD0F.0C42C0A0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 5 19:33:32 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jason Poulter) Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 12:33:32 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Java problems for the gods In-Reply-To: <000f01c2cd49$c9bfeba0$5310b83f@fishkiller> References: <005d01c2cd21$e1f156a0$7f29b83f@fishkiller> <000f01c2cd49$c9bfeba0$5310b83f@fishkiller> Message-ID: <3E41670C.7010501@snaptek.com> maybe you got a virus... or turned off java in your browser... cuz its working fine.... i has to be a prob on your puter jason Regan Smith wrote: > Ok some more reloading and now all get instead of the logo is the white > square with the red square green circle and blue triangle inside > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* Regan Smith > *To:* listserv@azgeocaching.com > *Sent:* Wednesday, February 05, 2003 7:21 AM > *Subject:* [Az-Geocaching] Java problems for the gods > > Hi > > even reloaded the program > > still get > > load: Class EIRC not found error > > > Thanks for the Help :) > > Regan From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 5 21:42:18 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN) Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 14:42:18 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Java problems for the gods Message-ID: ------=_NextPart_001_0004_01C2CD24.C85DC360 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On February 5, 2003 at 2:40 PM RandMan added a note to Regan: If you ever figure it out let me know. I tried to download it about a mo= nth ago and got the same thing you did. =20 Rand On February 5, 2003 at 12:12 PM Regan wrote Re: Java: Ok some more reloading and now all get instead of the logo is the white s= quare with the red square green circle and blue triangle inside. Thanks = for the Help :) Regan ------=_NextPart_001_0004_01C2CD24.C85DC360 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On February 5, 2003 at 2:40 PM&nb= sp;RandMan added a note to Regan:
 
If you ever figure it out let me know.  I tried to download it abou= t a month ago and got the same thing you did. 
 
Rand
 
On February 5, 2003 at 12:12 PM Regan wrote Re:= Java:
 
Ok some more reloading and now all g= et instead of the logo is the white square with the red square green circ= le and blue triangle inside.  Tha= nks for the Help :)  Regan=
------=_NextPart_001_0004_01C2CD24.C85DC360-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 6 00:41:30 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 17:41:30 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto revisited In-Reply-To: <002701c2cd1e$0d90c6a0$7f29b83f@fishkiller> Message-ID: <002501c2cd78$82307aa0$c069dd18@OUR> > My point is why hasn't like anyone who knows the complete list of caches in > the Wilderness Area done that????? or why didn't the Rangers do that when > they got the Coords for the Caches??? Most cachers would rather be caching than playing Cache Cop. And I doubt anyone knows the "complete list of caches in the Wilderness Area". And even if they did, someone else will come along and place a new one, just as happened here. Understandably, I think, the Rangers couldn't care less whether anyone mistakenly goes to the cache site or not, as long as there's no cache there when they arrive. They don't understand how the game is played, nor do they want to or have the time to. It's not their job. Granted, they're probably not thinking about the potential for extra traffic or someone tramping about in the site area looking for something that isn't there. More likely they figure if they just remove it, word will get out quickly enough and people will stop going to the site. That strategy worked rather well in the case of the original Superstition caches they confiscated. Steve Team Tierra Buena From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 6 02:30:17 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Carol King) Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 19:30:17 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Tree Caches for Scott Message-ID: <3E41C8B9.6060208@qwest.net> I had the same experience with my "Favorite Things II " cache(check zip code 85718 if you want to see the cache), but as soon as I explained the significance and beauty of my chosen things, and why the cache had to be a multi-virtual cache, they approved it. So I think they just don't recognize trees as historical or interesting in themselves, but once you plead your case, they understand. So go for it, and what's the name of your cache, so I can go find it??? From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 6 03:23:10 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken) Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 20:23:10 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto revisited References: <002501c2cd78$82307aa0$c069dd18@OUR> Message-ID: <003401c2cd8f$1314c1a0$91f50244@cx301817d> Libby and I went as land stewards to the conservation law enforcement seminar held in Prescott Today. Approximately 100-150 officers from Game & Fish, and various park rangers from the state attended.While there the instructors began discussing Geocaching and how it has had a negative impact on some archeological sites. My belief is that they formed these opinions based upon the poorly written article in the Arizona Repulsive. During this seminar I was able to speak to the various instructors and educate them about our hobby. As a result they gave me some time to speak to the group and give an impromptu presentation about Geocaching. I encouraged the members to check the website and address any of their concerns through the internet. After making my presentation I had several members approach me and said that they had changed their minds and do not consider it as serious a threat as they had been led to believe. I think I left them with a positive impression. The archeological community does have legitimate concerns about placing caches in archeological sites.The consensus of the archeologists is that placing caches near these sites is extremely damaging. I have learned that moving objects, i.e.rocks & stuff while hunting for a cache, can destroy the historical significance of the site. There are severe criminal and civil penalties that can be assessed if damage is done to these sites. Since there are many unpublished archeological sites throughout the state I encouraged the members of the Conservation Law Enforcement community to log on the Geocaching web site to check there respective areas for caches that may be placed, or near unknown archeological sites. If you happen to get an e-mail from one of them requesting you remove a cache, please do so. I believe the majority of them left with a more positive outlook about our hobby. Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the Navajo Nation Police Department. He told me that they will not allow any geocaches on their lands. If you are caught on their lands without a permit you can be arrested. This is just a reminder to please not place any caches on tribal lands. It still amazes me how much damage one poorly written and researched newspaper article can cause. Ken WhereRwee? A.K.A. Geocaching Land Steward ;) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Team Tierra Buena" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 05, 2003 5:41 PM Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto revisited > > My point is why hasn't like anyone who knows the complete list of > caches in > > the Wilderness Area done that????? or why didn't the Rangers do that > when > > they got the Coords for the Caches??? > > Most cachers would rather be caching than playing Cache Cop. And I doubt > anyone knows the "complete list of caches in the Wilderness Area". And > even if they did, someone else will come along and place a new one, just > as happened here. > > Understandably, I think, the Rangers couldn't care less whether anyone > mistakenly goes to the cache site or not, as long as there's no cache > there when they arrive. They don't understand how the game is played, > nor do they want to or have the time to. It's not their job. Granted, > they're probably not thinking about the potential for extra traffic or > someone tramping about in the site area looking for something that isn't > there. More likely they figure if they just remove it, word will get out > quickly enough and people will stop going to the site. That strategy > worked rather well in the case of the original Superstition caches they > confiscated. > > Steve > Team Tierra Buena > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 6 03:43:04 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Chelby Geiss) Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 20:43:04 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto revisited In-Reply-To: <003401c2cd8f$1314c1a0$91f50244@cx301817d> Message-ID: <1933A29A-3985-11D7-A5E2-000393545682@desertsol.com> BRAVO KEN! OK, here is an idea (and I apologize if someone has already suggested this and I forgot)...and maybe it is a bad one. What if we had a geocaching day for land agencies. Ya, we had the "official" meeting...but what about a hands on experience for these people on real caches with real cachers? Just a thought.... C:) Team desertSol Chelby & Kevin + Kiva and Lancer (German Shepherds) Apache Junction, AZ www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 6 04:00:14 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 21:00:14 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto revisited In-Reply-To: <003401c2cd8f$1314c1a0$91f50244@cx301817d> Message-ID: <002801c2cd94$40d303e0$c069dd18@OUR> > During this seminar I was able to speak to the various instructors and > educate them about our hobby. As a result they gave me some time to speak to > the group and give an impromptu presentation about Geocaching. I encouraged > the members to check the website and address any of their concerns through > the internet. After making my presentation I had several members approach me > and said that they had changed their minds and do not consider it as serious > a threat as they had been led to believe. I think I left them with a > positive impression. At last, someone has been able to cross the chasm. Thank you, Ken! I think you bring some credibility to the debate that few others here could (for those of you who may not be aware, Ken is a law enforcement professional as well as a site steward -- and a Geocacher). > Since there are many unpublished archeological sites throughout the state I > encouraged the members of the Conservation Law Enforcement community to log > on the Geocaching web site to check there respective areas for caches that > may be placed, or near unknown archeological sites. If you happen to get an > e-mail from one of them requesting you remove a cache, please do so. I > believe the majority of them left with a more positive outlook about our > hobby. I hope they are creating accounts so that they will be able to email the owners of caches that are cause for concern. We're always going to have newcomers, people who don't read this list, etc., who could place caches where they shouldn't be. > Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the Navajo Nation > Police Department. He told me that they will not allow any geocaches on > their lands. If you are caught on their lands without a permit you can be > arrested. This is just a reminder to please not place any caches on tribal > lands. Unlike National Parks in Arizona, where someone may yet get permission to place a cache, tribal lands are not public lands. Sometimes people talk about trying to get permission from tribal leaders, but they overlook the fact that everyone who wants to hunt that cache would also have to get permission. It ain't just the Navajos, it's every Indian nation in Arizona. We've got a few bazillion acres left where we can place caches, as long as we adhere to the rules. > It still amazes me how much damage one poorly written and researched > newspaper article can cause. Steve Team Tierra Buena "Freedom of the press is guaranteed only to those who own one." A. J. Liebling From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 6 05:19:01 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Scott_Wood?=) Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 22:19:01 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_[Az-Geocaching]_Tree_Caches_for_Scott?= In-Reply-To: <3E41C8B9.6060208@qwest.net> References: <3E41C8B9.6060208@qwest.net> Message-ID: <1165.206.228.113.137.1044508741.squirrel@www.myblueheaven.com> > I had the same experience with my "Favorite Things II " cache(check zip > code 85718 if you want to see the cache), but as soon as I explained > the significance and beauty of my chosen things, and why the cache had > to be a multi-virtual cache, they approved it. So I think they just > don't recognize trees as historical or interesting in themselves, but > once you plead your case, they understand. So go for it, and what's > the name of your cache, so I can go find it??? The name of the cache is Famous Trees, but you will have to travel a little. It is about 1500 driving miles from Tucson. I didn't feel that I could place a real cache since I will only be here for about 1 more week, so a virtual seemed to fit the bill. From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 6 13:12:27 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (WOLFB8) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 06:12:27 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto revisited References: <002501c2cd78$82307aa0$c069dd18@OUR> <003401c2cd8f$1314c1a0$91f50244@cx301817d> Message-ID: <019f01c2cde1$677a5000$bfd36844@ph.cox.net> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_019C_01C2CDA6.B92D1580 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >Libby and I went as land stewards to the conservation law enforcement >seminar held in Prescott Today. Approximately 100-150 officers from = Game & >Fish, and various park rangers from the state attended.While there the >instructors began discussing Geocaching and how it has had a negative = impact >on some archeological sites. My belief is that they formed these = opinions >based upon the poorly written article in the Arizona Repulsive.=20 Just going to piggyback off of ken letter here I have to disagree with ken on were there opinion have come from. I = believe it more from shelly talking to the land officers. From the = people I talked to it seemed that the officer from the west valley had = more negative thing to say than the ones from the east valley. >During this seminar I was able to speak to the various instructors and >educate them about our hobby. As a result they gave me some time to = speak to >the group and give an impromptu presentation about Geocaching. I = encouraged >the members to check the website and address any of their concerns = through >the internet. After making my presentation I had several members = approach me >and said that they had changed their minds and do not consider it as = serious >a threat as they had been led to believe. I think I left them with a >positive impression. Yeppers he did do that >The archeological community does have legitimate concerns about placing >caches in archeological sites.The consensus of the archeologists is = that >placing caches near these sites is extremely damaging. I have learned = that >moving objects, I.e.rocks & stuff while hunting for a cache, can = destroy the >historical significance of the site. There are severe criminal and = civil >penalties that can be assessed if damage is done to these sites. Since = there >are many unpublished archeological sites throughout the state I = encouraged >the members of the Conservation Law Enforcement community to log on the >Geocaching web site to check there respective areas for caches that may = be >placed, or near unknown archeological sites. If you happen to get an = e-mail >from one of them requesting you remove a cache, please do so. I believe = the >nmajority of them left with a more positive outlook about our hobby. Here again I do not totally agree with Ken.. We all know of caches out = there at are close to archeological site. I believe that the geocaching = community needs to police its own. All those they will not be able to = charge geocacher with a felony the hider and the finders of the cache on = a archeological can be taken to civil court. Were finds can range into = the $100K. They would also be able to take all the toys(jeeps ,4x4, GPS) = used to find the cache. I suggest if you think a cache is on a site do = not log it, instead remove it, contact the cache owner have them remove = it. We as cacher can not expect land manager or law enforcement to go = though all the trouble of logging into geocaching.com and sending us = little notes. As a side note here the cache on shaw butt is in the archeological site. = I was there on Sunday with the manager of the salt river site stewarts. = As a matter of fact I have been assigned that site and will remove it if = it is still there the next time I check on that site as I been = instructed to. (Just toss it in the trash). I know that there are 2 = caches in the white tanks that are also so on sites >Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the Navajo = Nation >Police Department. He told me that they will not allow any geocaches on >their lands. If you are caught on their lands without a permit you can = be >arrested. This is just a reminder to please not place any caches on = tribal >lands. The sergeant had a story to tell about a couple of cacher that wee shot = at while looking for a cache. When they reported it to him they were = sited for trespassing and told that if the people wanted to kill them = they would have. >It still amazes me how much damage one poorly written and researched >newspaper article can cause. While talking to other stewarts there I found out that all Shelly has to = do all day is play site stewart. Since her present cause is geocaching = STILL we need to start getting permittion for caches. I was also = informed that (forget what national forest) that the national forest = around Prescott is all for geocaching just like tonto. BOTTOM LINE DON'T PLACE A CACHE WITH OUT PERMISSION FIRST. We will be known by the tracks we leave behind ------=_NextPart_000_019C_01C2CDA6.B92D1580 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>Libby and I=20 went as land stewards to the conservation law enforcement
>seminar = held in=20 Prescott Today. Approximately 100-150 officers from Game = &
>Fish, and=20 various park rangers from the state attended.While there = the
>instructors=20 began discussing Geocaching and how it has had a negative = impact
>on some=20 archeological sites. My belief is that they formed these = opinions
>based=20 upon the poorly written article in the Arizona Repulsive. =
Just going to piggyback off of ken letter=20 here
I have to disagree with ken on were there opinion have = come from.=20 I believe it more from shelly talking to the  land officers. From = the=20 people I talked to it seemed that the officer from the west valley had = more=20 negative thing to say than the ones from the east=20 valley.

>During this seminar I was able to speak to the = various=20 instructors and
>educate them about our hobby. As a result they = gave me=20 some time to speak to
>the group and give an impromptu = presentation about=20 Geocaching.  I encouraged
>the members to check the website = and=20 address any of their concerns through
>the internet. After making = my=20 presentation I had several members approach me
>and said that they = had=20 changed their minds and do not consider it as serious
>a threat as = they=20 had been led to believe. I think I left them with a
>positive=20 impression.
Yeppers he did do that

>The archeological community does have legitimate concerns = about=20 placing
>caches in archeological sites.The consensus of the = archeologists=20 is that
>placing caches near these sites is extremely damaging. I = have=20 learned that
>moving objects, I.e.rocks & stuff while hunting = for a=20 cache, can destroy the
>historical significance of the site. There = are=20 severe criminal and civil
>penalties that can be assessed if = damage is=20 done to these sites. Since there
>are many unpublished = archeological sites=20 throughout the state I encouraged
>the members of the Conservation = Law=20 Enforcement community to log on the
>Geocaching web site to check = there=20 respective areas for caches that may be
>placed, or near unknown=20 archeological sites. If you happen to get an e-mail
>from one of = them=20 requesting you remove a cache, please do so. I believe the
>nmajority of them left with a more positive outlook about our=20 hobby.
 
Here again I do not = totally agree=20 with Ken.. We all know of caches out there at are close to archeological = site. I=20 believe that the geocaching community needs to police its own. All those = they=20 will not be able to charge geocacher with a felony the hider and the = finders of=20 the cache on a archeological can be taken to civil court. Were finds can = range=20 into the $100K. They would also be able to take all the toys(jeeps ,4x4, = GPS) used to find the cache. I suggest if you think a cache is on a = site do=20 not log it, instead remove it, contact the cache owner have them remove = it. We=20 as cacher can not expect land manager or law enforcement to go though = all the=20 trouble of logging into geocaching.com and sending us little = notes.
 
As a side note here the = cache on shaw=20 butt is in the archeological site. I was there on Sunday with the = manager of the=20 salt river site stewarts. As a matter of fact I have been assigned that = site and=20 will remove it if it is still there the next time I check on that site = as I been=20 instructed to. (Just toss it in the trash). I know that there are 2 = caches in=20 the white tanks that are also so on sites


>Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with = the=20 Navajo Nation
>Police Department. He told me that they will not = allow any=20 geocaches on
>their lands. If you are caught on their lands = without a=20 permit you can be
>arrested. This is just a reminder to please not = place=20 any caches on tribal
>lands.
 
The sergeant had a = story to tell=20 about a couple of cacher that wee shot at while looking for a cache. = When they=20 reported it to him they were sited for trespassing and told that if the = people=20 wanted to kill them they would have.

>It still amazes = me how=20 much damage one poorly written and researched
>newspaper article = can=20 cause.
 
While talking to other = stewarts there=20 I found out that all Shelly has to do all day is play site stewart. = Since her=20 present cause is geocaching STILL we need to start getting permittion = for=20 caches. I was also informed that (forget what national forest) that the = national=20 forest around Prescott is all for geocaching just like = tonto.
 
BOTTOM LINE DON'T PLACE = A CACHE WITH=20 OUT PERMISSION FIRST.

We will be known by the tracks we leave=20 behind
------=_NextPart_000_019C_01C2CDA6.B92D1580-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 6 14:08:35 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 07:08:35 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto revisited References: <002501c2cd78$82307aa0$c069dd18@OUR> <003401c2cd8f$1314c1a0$91f50244@cx301817d> <019f01c2cde1$677a5000$bfd36844@ph.cox.net> Message-ID: <002901c2cde9$3e49e760$0b10b83f@fishkiller> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0026_01C2CDAE.90D6E040 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable While talking to other stewarts there I found out that all Shelly has to = do all day is play site stewart. Since her present cause is geocaching = STILL we need to start getting permittion for caches. I was also = informed that (forget what national forest) that the national forest = around Prescott is all for geocaching just like tonto. BOTTOM LINE DON'T PLACE A CACHE WITH OUT PERMISSION FIRST Would this include those caches that are on like modern Public and = Private land and property as well?? ----- Original Message -----=20 From: WOLFB8=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 6:12 AM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto revisited >Libby and I went as land stewards to the conservation law enforcement >seminar held in Prescott Today. Approximately 100-150 officers from = Game & >Fish, and various park rangers from the state attended.While there = the >instructors began discussing Geocaching and how it has had a negative = impact >on some archeological sites. My belief is that they formed these = opinions >based upon the poorly written article in the Arizona Repulsive.=20 Just going to piggyback off of ken letter here I have to disagree with ken on were there opinion have come from. I = believe it more from shelly talking to the land officers. From the = people I talked to it seemed that the officer from the west valley had = more negative thing to say than the ones from the east valley. >During this seminar I was able to speak to the various instructors = and >educate them about our hobby. As a result they gave me some time to = speak to >the group and give an impromptu presentation about Geocaching. I = encouraged >the members to check the website and address any of their concerns = through >the internet. After making my presentation I had several members = approach me >and said that they had changed their minds and do not consider it as = serious >a threat as they had been led to believe. I think I left them with a >positive impression. Yeppers he did do that >The archeological community does have legitimate concerns about = placing >caches in archeological sites.The consensus of the archeologists is = that >placing caches near these sites is extremely damaging. I have learned = that >moving objects, I.e.rocks & stuff while hunting for a cache, can = destroy the >historical significance of the site. There are severe criminal and = civil >penalties that can be assessed if damage is done to these sites. = Since there >are many unpublished archeological sites throughout the state I = encouraged >the members of the Conservation Law Enforcement community to log on = the >Geocaching web site to check there respective areas for caches that = may be >placed, or near unknown archeological sites. If you happen to get an = e-mail >from one of them requesting you remove a cache, please do so. I = believe the >nmajority of them left with a more positive outlook about our hobby. Here again I do not totally agree with Ken.. We all know of caches out = there at are close to archeological site. I believe that the geocaching = community needs to police its own. All those they will not be able to = charge geocacher with a felony the hider and the finders of the cache on = a archeological can be taken to civil court. Were finds can range into = the $100K. They would also be able to take all the toys(jeeps ,4x4, GPS) = used to find the cache. I suggest if you think a cache is on a site do = not log it, instead remove it, contact the cache owner have them remove = it. We as cacher can not expect land manager or law enforcement to go = though all the trouble of logging into geocaching.com and sending us = little notes. As a side note here the cache on shaw butt is in the archeological = site. I was there on Sunday with the manager of the salt river site = stewarts. As a matter of fact I have been assigned that site and will = remove it if it is still there the next time I check on that site as I = been instructed to. (Just toss it in the trash). I know that there are 2 = caches in the white tanks that are also so on sites >Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the Navajo = Nation >Police Department. He told me that they will not allow any geocaches = on >their lands. If you are caught on their lands without a permit you = can be >arrested. This is just a reminder to please not place any caches on = tribal >lands. The sergeant had a story to tell about a couple of cacher that wee = shot at while looking for a cache. When they reported it to him they = were sited for trespassing and told that if the people wanted to kill = them they would have. >It still amazes me how much damage one poorly written and researched >newspaper article can cause. While talking to other stewarts there I found out that all Shelly has = to do all day is play site stewart. Since her present cause is = geocaching STILL we need to start getting permittion for caches. I was = also informed that (forget what national forest) that the national = forest around Prescott is all for geocaching just like tonto. BOTTOM LINE DON'T PLACE A CACHE WITH OUT PERMISSION FIRST. We will be known by the tracks we leave behind ------=_NextPart_000_0026_01C2CDAE.90D6E040 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
While talking to other = stewarts there=20 I found out that all Shelly has to do all day is play site stewart. = Since her=20 present cause is geocaching STILL we need to start getting permittion = for=20 caches. I was also informed that (forget what national forest) that the = national=20 forest around Prescott is all for geocaching just like = tonto.
 
BOTTOM LINE DON'T PLACE = A CACHE WITH=20 OUT PERMISSION FIRST
 
Would this include those caches that = are on=20 like modern Public and Private land and property as = well??
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 WOLFB8 =
Sent: Thursday, February 06, = 2003 6:12=20 AM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] = Our Day in=20 Tonto revisited

>Libby and=20 I went as land stewards to the conservation law = enforcement
>seminar=20 held in Prescott Today. Approximately 100-150 officers from Game=20 &
>Fish, and various park rangers from the state = attended.While=20 there the
>instructors began discussing Geocaching and how it = has had a=20 negative impact
>on some archeological sites. My belief is that = they=20 formed these opinions
>based upon the poorly written article in = the=20 Arizona Repulsive.
Just going to piggyback off of ken letter=20 here
I have to disagree with ken on were there opinion have = come=20 from. I believe it more from shelly talking to the  land = officers. From=20 the people I talked to it seemed that the officer from the west valley = had=20 more negative thing to say than the ones from the east=20 valley.

>During this seminar I was able to speak to = the=20 various instructors and
>educate them about our hobby. As a = result they=20 gave me some time to speak to
>the group and give an impromptu=20 presentation about Geocaching.  I encouraged
>the members = to check=20 the website and address any of their concerns through
>the = internet.=20 After making my presentation I had several members approach = me
>and said=20 that they had changed their minds and do not consider it as = serious
>a=20 threat as they had been led to believe. I think I left them with=20 a
>positive impression.
Yeppers he did do that

>The archeological community does have legitimate concerns = about=20 placing
>caches in archeological sites.The consensus of the=20 archeologists is that
>placing caches near these sites is = extremely=20 damaging. I have learned that
>moving objects, I.e.rocks & = stuff=20 while hunting for a cache, can destroy the
>historical = significance of=20 the site. There are severe criminal and civil
>penalties that = can be=20 assessed if damage is done to these sites. Since there
>are many = unpublished archeological sites throughout the state I = encouraged
>the=20 members of the Conservation Law Enforcement community to log on=20 the
>Geocaching web site to check there respective areas for = caches that=20 may be
>placed, or near unknown archeological sites. If you = happen to=20 get an e-mail
>from one of them requesting you remove a cache, = please do=20 so. I believe the
>nmajority of them left with a more positive outlook about our = hobby.
 
Here again I do not = totally agree=20 with Ken.. We all know of caches out there at are close to = archeological site.=20 I believe that the geocaching community needs to police its own. All = those=20 they will not be able to charge geocacher with a felony the hider and = the=20 finders of the cache on a archeological can be taken to civil court. = Were=20 finds can range into the $100K. They would also be able to take all = the=20 toys(jeeps ,4x4, GPS) used to find the cache. I suggest if you = think a=20 cache is on a site do not log it, instead remove it, contact the cache = owner=20 have them remove it. We as cacher can not expect land manager or law=20 enforcement to go though all the trouble of logging into = geocaching.com and=20 sending us little notes.
 
As a side note here = the cache on=20 shaw butt is in the archeological site. I was there on Sunday with the = manager=20 of the salt river site stewarts. As a matter of fact I have been = assigned that=20 site and will remove it if it is still there the next time I check on = that=20 site as I been instructed to. (Just toss it in the trash). I know that = there=20 are 2 caches in the white tanks that are also so on sites


>Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant = with the=20 Navajo Nation
>Police Department. He told me that they will not = allow=20 any geocaches on
>their lands. If you are caught on their lands = without=20 a permit you can be
>arrested. This is just a reminder to please = not=20 place any caches on tribal
>lands.
 
The sergeant had a = story to tell=20 about a couple of cacher that wee shot at while looking for a cache. = When they=20 reported it to him they were sited for trespassing and told that if = the people=20 wanted to kill them they would have.

>It still amazes = me how=20 much damage one poorly written and researched
>newspaper article = can=20 cause.
 
While talking to = other stewarts=20 there I found out that all Shelly has to do all day is play site = stewart.=20 Since her present cause is geocaching STILL we need to start getting=20 permittion for caches. I was also informed that (forget what national = forest)=20 that the national forest around Prescott is all for geocaching just = like=20 tonto.
 
BOTTOM LINE DON'T = PLACE A CACHE=20 WITH OUT PERMISSION FIRST.

We will be known by the tracks we leave=20 behind
------=_NextPart_000_0026_01C2CDAE.90D6E040-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 6 14:14:53 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 07:14:53 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto revisited In-Reply-To: <002901c2cde9$3e49e760$0b10b83f@fishkiller> Message-ID: <000401c2cdea$1f0444d0$c069dd18@OUR> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C2CDAF.72A56CD0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Would this include those caches that are on like modern Public and Private land and property as well?? Yes. Steve Team Tierra Buena ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C2CDAF.72A56CD0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
 
Would this include those caches that = are on=20 like modern Public and Private land and property as well?? 
 
Yes.
 
Steve
Team=20 = Tierra Buena 
------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C2CDAF.72A56CD0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 6 15:31:33 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 08:31:33 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto revisited References: <000401c2cdea$1f0444d0$c069dd18@OUR> Message-ID: <000d01c2cdf4$d5731ac0$4621b83f@fishkiller> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C2CDBA.27F6EBE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Messagecould I add "Just because it is a location for a cache doesn't = mean the cache fits the location"? ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Team Tierra Buena=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 7:14 AM Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto revisited Would this include those caches that are on like modern Public and = Private land and property as well??=20 Yes. Steve Team Tierra Buena ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C2CDBA.27F6EBE0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
could I add "Just because it is a = location for a=20 cache doesn't mean the cache fits the location"?
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Team Tierra Buena =
Sent: Thursday, February 06, = 2003 7:14=20 AM
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] = Our Day in=20 Tonto revisited

 
Would this include those caches = that=20 are on like modern Public and Private land and property as = well?? 
 
Yes.
 
Steve
Team=20 = Tierra Buena 
------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C2CDBA.27F6EBE0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 6 15:38:57 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 08:38:57 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto revisited In-Reply-To: <000d01c2cdf4$d5731ac0$4621b83f@fishkiller> Message-ID: <000e01c2cdf5$ddc4d0a0$c069dd18@OUR> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C2CDBB.3165F8A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit could I add "Just because it is a location for a cache doesn't mean the cache fits the location"? Well said. Steve Team Tierra Buena ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C2CDBB.3165F8A0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
could I add "Just because it is a = location for a=20 cache doesn't mean the cache fits the location"? 
 
Well = said.
 
Steve
Team Tierra=20 Buena 
------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C2CDBB.3165F8A0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 6 17:00:04 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Koch, Dan) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 10:00:04 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Team DaSH Message-ID: Has anyone noticed that we haven't heard from Team DaSH since the Camino del Diablo trip? They haven't even been caching since then. Think we scared them off? ;) LazyK - Dan From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 6 19:18:05 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (mike and gale jett) Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2003 19:18:05 +0000 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation Message-ID:
Two of you wrote
 
Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the Navajo Nation
>Police Department. He told me that they will not allow any geocaches on
>their lands. If you are caught on their lands without a permit you can be
>arrested. This is just a reminder to please not place any caches on tribal
>lands.
 
The sergeant had a story to tell about a couple of cacher that wee shot at while looking for a cache. When they reported it to him they were sited for trespassing and told that if the people wanted to kill them they would have.

 

I feel the need to defend the Navajo Nation. Some of you may know that Mike is Navajo born and raised. His family still lives on the reservation. I lived there for 2 years while working for Indian Health Service. Lately the tribe has been having a lot of trouble with gangs, a lot more than you might think. Part of it has to do with the extreme poverty up there as well as unemployment, alcoholism etc. There has also been a huge push lately to return to ultra conservative traditional ways which some older Navajos would like to take as far as cutting out the outside world. That won't ever happen. There are still many rational people up there. The upshot is, as long as you treat the Navajo, Hopi, or any other tribe with great respect, including laws and their privacy, you will be treated the same. Please don't read all of the above and be discouraged from visiting the reservations of Arizona. I've done so for over 20 years, with and without Mike, and have al! ways been treated very well. On a side note, Mike and I have been talking about doing an event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a homestead ranch in the Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail that leads down to his family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family to visit. The views are spectacular. Would people be interested?



STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 6 21:50:01 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mike Ingoglia) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 14:50:01 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation References: Message-ID: <320301c2ce29$b2fad840$cf98a8c0@Mike> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_3200_01C2CDEF.06843280 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Let me step back a bit from all political correctness and voice my = OPINION: It's unfortunate about the story of the geocachers being shot at. I've = personally met a lot of Navajo people that have a hatred for "white = people". These people (not all, but a good number) seem to have a chip = on their shoulder about "us" taking the land from them. I've = experienced this first hand as well as my wife experienced it growing up = in Page, AZ. The way I see it, it is the way humans are. There's not a = group of people in history that haven't fought over land rights... = including all the Indians. Yeah, we've all become more civilized and = politics prevent it from happening as much these days, but they just = need to get over it and deal with it... they don't need to be shooting = at anyone. If it was up to me, the reservations would become state = trust lands and the Indians would have to integrate into our society = rather than segregating themselves from it(sorry, I still have a few = years until I'm old enough to run for President) :-). It's ridiculous = the free ride our government gives them. I just love driving (NOT!) = through the reservation (on the highway) and seeing run-down single = wides with a satellite dish and a brand new Chevy pickup out front. I'm = beginning to believe getting "free rides" is the American way. ----- Original Message -----=20 From: mike and gale jett=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 12:18 PM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation Two of you wrote Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the Navajo = Nation >Police Department. He told me that they will not allow any geocaches = on >their lands. If you are caught on their lands without a permit you = can be >arrested. This is just a reminder to please not place any caches on = tribal >lands.=20 The sergeant had a story to tell about a couple of cacher that wee = shot at while looking for a cache. When they reported it to him they = were sited for trespassing and told that if the people wanted to kill = them they would have. I feel the need to defend the Navajo Nation. Some of you may know that = Mike is Navajo born and raised. His family still lives on the = reservation. I lived there for 2 years while working for Indian Health = Service. Lately the tribe has been having a lot of trouble with gangs, a = lot more than you might think. Part of it has to do with the extreme = poverty up there as well as unemployment, alcoholism etc. There has also = been a huge push lately to return to ultra conservative traditional ways = which some older Navajos would like to take as far as cutting out the = outside world. That won't ever happen. There are still many rational = people up there. The upshot is, as long as you treat the Navajo, Hopi, = or any other tribe with great respect, including laws and their privacy, = you will be treated the same. Please don't read all of the above and be = discouraged from visiting the reservations of Arizona. I've done so for = over 20 years, with and without Mike, and have al! ! ways been treated = very well. On a side note, Mike and I have been talking about doing an = event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a homestead ranch in the = Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail = that leads down to his family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always = welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family to = visit. The views are spectacular. Would people be interested? -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* = ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your = setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: = http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com ------=_NextPart_000_3200_01C2CDEF.06843280 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Let me step back a bit from all = political=20 correctness and voice my OPINION:
 
It's unfortunate about the story of the = geocachers=20 being shot at.  I've personally met a lot of Navajo people that = have a=20 hatred for "white people".  These people (not all, but a good = number)=20 seem to have a chip on their shoulder about "us" taking the land from=20 them.  I've experienced this first hand as well as my wife = experienced it=20 growing up in Page, AZ.  The way I see it, it is the way humans = are. =20 There's not a group of people in history that haven't fought over land = rights...=20 including all the Indians.  Yeah, we've all become more civilized = and=20 politics prevent it from happening as much these days, but they just = need to get=20 over it and deal with it... they don't need to be shooting at = anyone.  If=20 it was up to me, the reservations would become state trust lands and the = Indians=20 would have to integrate into our society rather than segregating = themselves from=20 it(sorry, I still have a few years until I'm old enough to run for=20 President)  :-).  It's ridiculous the free ride our government = gives=20 them.  I just love driving (NOT!) through the reservation (on the = highway)=20 and seeing run-down single wides with a satellite dish and a brand new = Chevy=20 pickup out front.  I'm beginning to believe getting "free rides" is = the=20 American way.
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 mike and gale jett =
Sent: Thursday, February 06, = 2003 12:18=20 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo = Nation

Two of you wrote
 
Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the = Navajo=20 Nation
>Police Department. He told me that they will not allow = any=20 geocaches on
>their lands. If you are caught on their lands = without a=20 permit you can be
>arrested. This is just a reminder to please = not place=20 any caches on tribal
>lands.
 
The sergeant had a = story to tell=20 about a couple of cacher that wee shot at while looking for a cache. = When they=20 reported it to him they were sited for trespassing and told that if = the people=20 wanted to kill them they would have.

 

I feel the need to defend the Navajo Nation. = Some of=20 you may know that Mike is Navajo born and raised. His family still = lives on=20 the reservation. I lived there for 2 years while working for Indian = Health=20 Service. Lately the tribe has been having a lot of trouble with gangs, = a lot=20 more than you might think. Part of it has to do with the extreme = poverty up=20 there as well as unemployment, alcoholism etc. There has also been a = huge push=20 lately to return to ultra conservative traditional ways which some = older=20 Navajos would like to take as far as cutting out the outside world. = That won't=20 ever happen. There are still many rational people up there. The upshot = is, as=20 long as you treat the Navajo, Hopi, or any other tribe with great = respect,=20 including laws and their privacy, you will be treated the same. Please = don't=20 read all of the above and be discouraged from visiting the = reservations of=20 Arizona. I've done so for over 20 years, with and without Mike, and = have al! !=20 ways been treated very well. On a side note, Mike and I have been = talking=20 about doing an event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a = homestead=20 ranch in the Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. = There is a=20 trail that leads down to his family's cabin (not a hogan). His family = always=20 welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family = to visit.=20 The views are spectacular. Would people be interested?



STOP MORE SPAM with the new = MSN 8=20 and get 2 months FREE*=20 ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching=20 mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe = or=20 unsubscribe visit:=20 http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's=20 Geocaching Resource = http://www.azgeocaching.com
------=_NextPart_000_3200_01C2CDEF.06843280-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 6 23:41:44 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (WOLFB8) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 16:41:44 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation References: Message-ID: <01cb01c2ce39$f0497980$bfd36844@ph.cox.net> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01BF_01C2CDFE.A20F63A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Please do not take what I said about the Navajo cop wrong...It was meant = will all respect. the point is the geocacher were trespassing plain and = simple. the cache was by a archeological site.... I only relay the = story to warn people the Tribe of Arizona and that is all of them DO NOT = WANT CACHES ON THERE LAND..... doing so is at your own risk of any thing = from a fine to death...hey there allot of land out there you may be a = archeological site by the time someone finds your body.. I personally would love to see you do the event cache... that would be = so kewl We will be known by the tracks we leave behind ----- Original Message -----=20 From: mike and gale jett=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 12:18 PM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation Two of you wrote Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the Navajo = Nation >Police Department. He told me that they will not allow any geocaches = on >their lands. If you are caught on their lands without a permit you = can be >arrested. This is just a reminder to please not place any caches on = tribal >lands.=20 The sergeant had a story to tell about a couple of cacher that wee = shot at while looking for a cache. When they reported it to him they = were sited for trespassing and told that if the people wanted to kill = them they would have. I feel the need to defend the Navajo Nation. Some of you may know that = Mike is Navajo born and raised. His family still lives on the = reservation. I lived there for 2 years while working for Indian Health = Service. Lately the tribe has been having a lot of trouble with gangs, a = lot more than you might think. Part of it has to do with the extreme = poverty up there as well as unemployment, alcoholism etc. There has also = been a huge push lately to return to ultra conservative traditional ways = which some older Navajos would like to take as far as cutting out the = outside world. That won't ever happen. There are still many rational = people up there. The upshot is, as long as you treat the Navajo, Hopi, = or any other tribe with great respect, including laws and their privacy, = you will be treated the same. Please don't read all of the above and be = discouraged from visiting the reservations of Arizona. I've done so for = over 20 years, with and without Mike, and have al! ! ways been treated = very well. On a side note, Mike and I have been talking about doing an = event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a homestead ranch in the = Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail = that leads down to his family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always = welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family to = visit. The views are spectacular. Would people be interested? -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* = ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your = setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: = http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com ------=_NextPart_000_01BF_01C2CDFE.A20F63A0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Please do not take what I said about = the Navajo cop=20 wrong...It was meant will all respect. the point is the geocacher were=20 trespassing plain and simple.  the cache was by = a archeological=20 site....    I only relay the story to warn people the = Tribe of=20 Arizona and that is all of them DO NOT WANT CACHES ON THERE LAND..... = doing so=20 is at your own risk of any thing from a fine to death...hey there allot = of land=20 out there you may be a archeological site by the time someone finds your = body..
 
I personally would love = to see you do=20 the event cache... that would be so kewl
 
 
We will be known by the tracks we leave behind
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 mike and gale jett =
Sent: Thursday, February 06, = 2003 12:18=20 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo = Nation

Two of you wrote
 
Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the = Navajo=20 Nation
>Police Department. He told me that they will not allow = any=20 geocaches on
>their lands. If you are caught on their lands = without a=20 permit you can be
>arrested. This is just a reminder to please = not place=20 any caches on tribal
>lands.
 
The sergeant had a = story to tell=20 about a couple of cacher that wee shot at while looking for a cache. = When they=20 reported it to him they were sited for trespassing and told that if = the people=20 wanted to kill them they would have.

 

I feel the need to defend the Navajo Nation. = Some of=20 you may know that Mike is Navajo born and raised. His family still = lives on=20 the reservation. I lived there for 2 years while working for Indian = Health=20 Service. Lately the tribe has been having a lot of trouble with gangs, = a lot=20 more than you might think. Part of it has to do with the extreme = poverty up=20 there as well as unemployment, alcoholism etc. There has also been a = huge push=20 lately to return to ultra conservative traditional ways which some = older=20 Navajos would like to take as far as cutting out the outside world. = That won't=20 ever happen. There are still many rational people up there. The upshot = is, as=20 long as you treat the Navajo, Hopi, or any other tribe with great = respect,=20 including laws and their privacy, you will be treated the same. Please = don't=20 read all of the above and be discouraged from visiting the = reservations of=20 Arizona. I've done so for over 20 years, with and without Mike, and = have al! !=20 ways been treated very well. On a side note, Mike and I have been = talking=20 about doing an event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a = homestead=20 ranch in the Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. = There is a=20 trail that leads down to his family's cabin (not a hogan). His family = always=20 welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family = to visit.=20 The views are spectacular. Would people be interested?



STOP MORE SPAM with the new = MSN 8=20 and get 2 months FREE*=20 ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching=20 mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe = or=20 unsubscribe visit:=20 http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's=20 Geocaching Resource = http://www.azgeocaching.com ------=_NextPart_000_01BF_01C2CDFE.A20F63A0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 6 23:41:44 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (WOLFB8) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 16:41:44 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation References: Message-ID: <01cc01c2ce3a$6bb5d960$bfd36844@ph.cox.net> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01BF_01C2CDFE.A20F63A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Please do not take what I said about the Navajo cop wrong...It was meant = will all respect. the point is the geocacher were trespassing plain and = simple. the cache was by a archeological site.... I only relay the = story to warn people the Tribe of Arizona and that is all of them DO NOT = WANT CACHES ON THERE LAND..... doing so is at your own risk of any thing = from a fine to death...hey there allot of land out there you may be a = archeological site by the time someone finds your body.. I personally would love to see you do the event cache... that would be = so kewl We will be known by the tracks we leave behind ----- Original Message -----=20 From: mike and gale jett=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 12:18 PM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation Two of you wrote Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the Navajo = Nation >Police Department. He told me that they will not allow any geocaches = on >their lands. If you are caught on their lands without a permit you = can be >arrested. This is just a reminder to please not place any caches on = tribal >lands.=20 The sergeant had a story to tell about a couple of cacher that wee = shot at while looking for a cache. When they reported it to him they = were sited for trespassing and told that if the people wanted to kill = them they would have. I feel the need to defend the Navajo Nation. Some of you may know that = Mike is Navajo born and raised. His family still lives on the = reservation. I lived there for 2 years while working for Indian Health = Service. Lately the tribe has been having a lot of trouble with gangs, a = lot more than you might think. Part of it has to do with the extreme = poverty up there as well as unemployment, alcoholism etc. There has also = been a huge push lately to return to ultra conservative traditional ways = which some older Navajos would like to take as far as cutting out the = outside world. That won't ever happen. There are still many rational = people up there. The upshot is, as long as you treat the Navajo, Hopi, = or any other tribe with great respect, including laws and their privacy, = you will be treated the same. Please don't read all of the above and be = discouraged from visiting the reservations of Arizona. I've done so for = over 20 years, with and without Mike, and have al! ! ways been treated = very well. On a side note, Mike and I have been talking about doing an = event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a homestead ranch in the = Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail = that leads down to his family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always = welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family to = visit. The views are spectacular. Would people be interested? -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* = ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your = setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: = http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com ------=_NextPart_000_01BF_01C2CDFE.A20F63A0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Please do not take what I said about = the Navajo cop=20 wrong...It was meant will all respect. the point is the geocacher were=20 trespassing plain and simple.  the cache was by = a archeological=20 site....    I only relay the story to warn people the = Tribe of=20 Arizona and that is all of them DO NOT WANT CACHES ON THERE LAND..... = doing so=20 is at your own risk of any thing from a fine to death...hey there allot = of land=20 out there you may be a archeological site by the time someone finds your = body..
 
I personally would love = to see you do=20 the event cache... that would be so kewl
 
 
We will be known by the tracks we leave behind
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 mike and gale jett =
Sent: Thursday, February 06, = 2003 12:18=20 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo = Nation

Two of you wrote
 
Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the = Navajo=20 Nation
>Police Department. He told me that they will not allow = any=20 geocaches on
>their lands. If you are caught on their lands = without a=20 permit you can be
>arrested. This is just a reminder to please = not place=20 any caches on tribal
>lands.
 
The sergeant had a = story to tell=20 about a couple of cacher that wee shot at while looking for a cache. = When they=20 reported it to him they were sited for trespassing and told that if = the people=20 wanted to kill them they would have.

 

I feel the need to defend the Navajo Nation. = Some of=20 you may know that Mike is Navajo born and raised. His family still = lives on=20 the reservation. I lived there for 2 years while working for Indian = Health=20 Service. Lately the tribe has been having a lot of trouble with gangs, = a lot=20 more than you might think. Part of it has to do with the extreme = poverty up=20 there as well as unemployment, alcoholism etc. There has also been a = huge push=20 lately to return to ultra conservative traditional ways which some = older=20 Navajos would like to take as far as cutting out the outside world. = That won't=20 ever happen. There are still many rational people up there. The upshot = is, as=20 long as you treat the Navajo, Hopi, or any other tribe with great = respect,=20 including laws and their privacy, you will be treated the same. Please = don't=20 read all of the above and be discouraged from visiting the = reservations of=20 Arizona. I've done so for over 20 years, with and without Mike, and = have al! !=20 ways been treated very well. On a side note, Mike and I have been = talking=20 about doing an event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a = homestead=20 ranch in the Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. = There is a=20 trail that leads down to his family's cabin (not a hogan). His family = always=20 welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family = to visit.=20 The views are spectacular. Would people be interested?



STOP MORE SPAM with the new = MSN 8=20 and get 2 months FREE*=20 ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching=20 mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe = or=20 unsubscribe visit:=20 http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's=20 Geocaching Resource = http://www.azgeocaching.com ------=_NextPart_000_01BF_01C2CDFE.A20F63A0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 6 23:46:13 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (WOLFB8) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 16:46:13 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation References: <320301c2ce29$b2fad840$cf98a8c0@Mike> Message-ID: <01cd01c2ce3a$6bcfca00$bfd36844@ph.cox.net> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01C8_01C2CDFF.42934EE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable bottom line is they were trespassing private property is just that no = matter who owns it!!!! We will be known by the tracks we leave behind ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Mike Ingoglia=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 2:50 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation Let me step back a bit from all political correctness and voice my = OPINION: It's unfortunate about the story of the geocachers being shot at. = I've personally met a lot of Navajo people that have a hatred for "white = people". These people (not all, but a good number) seem to have a chip = on their shoulder about "us" taking the land from them. I've = experienced this first hand as well as my wife experienced it growing up = in Page, AZ. The way I see it, it is the way humans are. There's not a = group of people in history that haven't fought over land rights... = including all the Indians. Yeah, we've all become more civilized and = politics prevent it from happening as much these days, but they just = need to get over it and deal with it... they don't need to be shooting = at anyone. If it was up to me, the reservations would become state = trust lands and the Indians would have to integrate into our society = rather than segregating themselves from it(sorry, I still have a few = years until I'm old enough to run for President) :-). It's ridiculous = the free ride our government gives them. I just love driving (NOT!) = through the reservation (on the highway) and seeing run-down single = wides with a satellite dish and a brand new Chevy pickup out front. I'm = beginning to believe getting "free rides" is the American way. ----- Original Message -----=20 From: mike and gale jett=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 12:18 PM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation Two of you wrote Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the Navajo = Nation >Police Department. He told me that they will not allow any = geocaches on >their lands. If you are caught on their lands without a permit you = can be >arrested. This is just a reminder to please not place any caches on = tribal >lands.=20 The sergeant had a story to tell about a couple of cacher that wee = shot at while looking for a cache. When they reported it to him they = were sited for trespassing and told that if the people wanted to kill = them they would have. I feel the need to defend the Navajo Nation. Some of you may know = that Mike is Navajo born and raised. His family still lives on the = reservation. I lived there for 2 years while working for Indian Health = Service. Lately the tribe has been having a lot of trouble with gangs, a = lot more than you might think. Part of it has to do with the extreme = poverty up there as well as unemployment, alcoholism etc. There has also = been a huge push lately to return to ultra conservative traditional ways = which some older Navajos would like to take as far as cutting out the = outside world. That won't ever happen. There are still many rational = people up there. The upshot is, as long as you treat the Navajo, Hopi, = or any other tribe with great respect, including laws and their privacy, = you will be treated the same. Please don't read all of the above and be = discouraged from visiting the reservations of Arizona. I've done so for = over 20 years, with and without Mike, and have al! ! ways been treated = very well. On a side note, Mike and I have been talking about doing an = event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a homestead ranch in the = Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail = that leads down to his family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always = welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family to = visit. The views are spectacular. Would people be interested? -------------------------------------------------------------------------= --- STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* = ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your = setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: = http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com ------=_NextPart_000_01C8_01C2CDFF.42934EE0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
 bottom line is they were = trespassing =20 private property is just that no matter who owns it!!!!
 
We will be known by the tracks we leave behind
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Mike = Ingoglia=20
Sent: Thursday, February 06, = 2003 2:50=20 PM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] = Navajo=20 Nation

Let me step back a bit from all = political=20 correctness and voice my OPINION:
 
It's unfortunate about the story of = the=20 geocachers being shot at.  I've personally met a lot of Navajo = people=20 that have a hatred for "white people".  These people (not = all, but a=20 good number) seem to have a chip on their shoulder about "us" taking = the land=20 from them.  I've experienced this first hand as well as my wife=20 experienced it growing up in Page, AZ.  The way I see it, it is = the way=20 humans are.  There's not a group of people in history that = haven't fought=20 over land rights... including all the Indians.  Yeah, we've all = become=20 more civilized and politics prevent it from happening as much these = days, but=20 they just need to get over it and deal with it... they don't need to = be=20 shooting at anyone.  If it was up to me, the reservations would = become=20 state trust lands and the Indians would have to integrate into our = society=20 rather than segregating themselves from it(sorry, I still have a few = years=20 until I'm old enough to run for President)  :-).  It's = ridiculous=20 the free ride our government gives them.  I just love driving = (NOT!)=20 through the reservation (on the highway) and seeing run-down single = wides with=20 a satellite dish and a brand new Chevy pickup out front.  I'm = beginning=20 to believe getting "free rides" is the American way.
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 mike and gale jett =
Sent: Thursday, February 06, = 2003 12:18=20 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] = Navajo=20 Nation

Two of you wrote
 
Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the = Navajo=20 Nation
>Police Department. He told me that they will not allow = any=20 geocaches on
>their lands. If you are caught on their lands = without a=20 permit you can be
>arrested. This is just a reminder to please = not=20 place any caches on tribal
>lands.
 
The sergeant had a = story to tell=20 about a couple of cacher that wee shot at while looking for a cache. = When=20 they reported it to him they were sited for trespassing and told = that if the=20 people wanted to kill them they would have.

 

I feel the need to defend the Navajo = Nation. Some of=20 you may know that Mike is Navajo born and raised. His family still = lives on=20 the reservation. I lived there for 2 years while working for Indian = Health=20 Service. Lately the tribe has been having a lot of trouble with = gangs, a lot=20 more than you might think. Part of it has to do with the extreme = poverty up=20 there as well as unemployment, alcoholism etc. There has also been a = huge=20 push lately to return to ultra conservative traditional ways which = some=20 older Navajos would like to take as far as cutting out the outside = world.=20 That won't ever happen. There are still many rational people up = there. The=20 upshot is, as long as you treat the Navajo, Hopi, or any other tribe = with=20 great respect, including laws and their privacy, you will be treated = the=20 same. Please don't read all of the above and be discouraged from = visiting=20 the reservations of Arizona. I've done so for over 20 years, with = and=20 without Mike, and have al! ! ways been treated very well. On a side = note,=20 Mike and I have been talking about doing an event cache in Canyon de = Chelly.=20 His family has a homestead ranch in the Canyon del Muerto branch = beyond=20 where the tourists go. There is a trail that leads down to his = family's=20 cabin (not a hogan). His family always welcomes guests and permits = are not=20 needed for friends of the family to visit. The views are = spectacular. Would=20 people be interested?



STOP MORE SPAM with the = new MSN=20 8 and get 2 months FREE*=20 ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching=20 mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, = subscribe or=20 unsubscribe visit:=20 http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's=20 Geocaching Resource=20 http://www.azgeocaching.com
------=_NextPart_000_01C8_01C2CDFF.42934EE0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 7 00:21:17 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mike Ingoglia) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 17:21:17 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation References: <320301c2ce29$b2fad840$cf98a8c0@Mike> <01cd01c2ce3a$6bcfca00$bfd36844@ph.cox.net> Message-ID: <334b01c2ce3e$d4ca5800$cf98a8c0@Mike> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_3348_01C2CE04.285ADE30 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Yeah, but is shooting someone based on the fact that they're cruising = around in the desert fair punishment (I'm not buyin' that Navajo Nation = laws crap)? If I shot someone walking up to my door, I'd go to jail... = even if I caught someone in my house climbing back out the window after = ripping me off this still isn't justification.... now if someone is in = my house and I thought my family's lives were in danger that's a = completely different story. ----- Original Message -----=20 From: WOLFB8=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 4:46 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation bottom line is they were trespassing private property is just that = no matter who owns it!!!! We will be known by the tracks we leave behind ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Mike Ingoglia=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 2:50 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation Let me step back a bit from all political correctness and voice my = OPINION: It's unfortunate about the story of the geocachers being shot at. = I've personally met a lot of Navajo people that have a hatred for "white = people". These people (not all, but a good number) seem to have a chip = on their shoulder about "us" taking the land from them. I've = experienced this first hand as well as my wife experienced it growing up = in Page, AZ. The way I see it, it is the way humans are. There's not a = group of people in history that haven't fought over land rights... = including all the Indians. Yeah, we've all become more civilized and = politics prevent it from happening as much these days, but they just = need to get over it and deal with it... they don't need to be shooting = at anyone. If it was up to me, the reservations would become state = trust lands and the Indians would have to integrate into our society = rather than segregating themselves from it(sorry, I still have a few = years until I'm old enough to run for President) :-). It's ridiculous = the free ride our government gives them. I just love driving (NOT!) = through the reservation (on the highway) and seeing run-down single = wides with a satellite dish and a brand new Chevy pickup out front. I'm = beginning to believe getting "free rides" is the American way. ----- Original Message -----=20 From: mike and gale jett=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 12:18 PM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation Two of you wrote Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the Navajo = Nation >Police Department. He told me that they will not allow any = geocaches on >their lands. If you are caught on their lands without a permit = you can be >arrested. This is just a reminder to please not place any caches = on tribal >lands.=20 The sergeant had a story to tell about a couple of cacher that wee = shot at while looking for a cache. When they reported it to him they = were sited for trespassing and told that if the people wanted to kill = them they would have. I feel the need to defend the Navajo Nation. Some of you may know = that Mike is Navajo born and raised. His family still lives on the = reservation. I lived there for 2 years while working for Indian Health = Service. Lately the tribe has been having a lot of trouble with gangs, a = lot more than you might think. Part of it has to do with the extreme = poverty up there as well as unemployment, alcoholism etc. There has also = been a huge push lately to return to ultra conservative traditional ways = which some older Navajos would like to take as far as cutting out the = outside world. That won't ever happen. There are still many rational = people up there. The upshot is, as long as you treat the Navajo, Hopi, = or any other tribe with great respect, including laws and their privacy, = you will be treated the same. Please don't read all of the above and be = discouraged from visiting the reservations of Arizona. I've done so for = over 20 years, with and without Mike, and have al! ! ways been treated = very well. On a side note, Mike and I have been talking about doing an = event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a homestead ranch in the = Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail = that leads down to his family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always = welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family to = visit. The views are spectacular. Would people be interested? -------------------------------------------------------------------------= - STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* = ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your = setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: = http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com ------=_NextPart_000_3348_01C2CE04.285ADE30 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Yeah, but is shooting someone based on = the fact=20 that they're cruising around in the desert fair punishment (I'm not = buyin' that=20 Navajo Nation laws crap)?  If I shot someone walking up to my door, = I'd go=20 to jail... even if I caught someone in my house climbing back out the = window=20 after ripping me off this still isn't justification.... now if someone = is in my=20 house and I thought my family's lives were in danger that's a completely = different story.
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 WOLFB8 =
Sent: Thursday, February 06, = 2003 4:46=20 PM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] = Navajo=20 Nation

 bottom line is they were = trespassing =20 private property is just that no matter who owns it!!!!
 
We will be known by the tracks we leave behind
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Mike = Ingoglia=20
Sent: Thursday, February 06, = 2003 2:50=20 PM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] = Navajo=20 Nation

Let me step back a bit from all = political=20 correctness and voice my OPINION:
 
It's unfortunate about the story of = the=20 geocachers being shot at.  I've personally met a lot of Navajo = people=20 that have a hatred for "white people".  These people (not = all, but=20 a good number) seem to have a chip on their shoulder about "us" = taking the=20 land from them.  I've experienced this first hand as well as my = wife=20 experienced it growing up in Page, AZ.  The way I see it, it is = the way=20 humans are.  There's not a group of people in history that = haven't=20 fought over land rights... including all the Indians.  Yeah, = we've all=20 become more civilized and politics prevent it from happening as much = these=20 days, but they just need to get over it and deal with it... they = don't need=20 to be shooting at anyone.  If it was up to me, the reservations = would=20 become state trust lands and the Indians would have to integrate = into our=20 society rather than segregating themselves from it(sorry, I still = have a few=20 years until I'm old enough to run for President)  :-).  = It's=20 ridiculous the free ride our government gives them.  I just = love=20 driving (NOT!) through the reservation (on the highway) and seeing = run-down=20 single wides with a satellite dish and a brand new Chevy pickup out=20 front.  I'm beginning to believe getting "free rides" is the = American=20 way.
 
 
----- Original Message ----- =
From:=20 mike and gale = jett
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
Sent: Thursday, February = 06, 2003=20 12:18 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] = Navajo=20 Nation

Two of you wrote
 
Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the = Navajo=20 Nation
>Police Department. He told me that they will not = allow any=20 geocaches on
>their lands. If you are caught on their lands = without=20 a permit you can be
>arrested. This is just a reminder to = please not=20 place any caches on tribal
>lands.
 
The sergeant had = a story to=20 tell about a couple of cacher that wee shot at while looking for a = cache.=20 When they reported it to him they were sited for trespassing and = told that=20 if the people wanted to kill them they would = have.

 

I feel the need to defend the Navajo = Nation. Some=20 of you may know that Mike is Navajo born and raised. His family = still=20 lives on the reservation. I lived there for 2 years while working = for=20 Indian Health Service. Lately the tribe has been having a lot of = trouble=20 with gangs, a lot more than you might think. Part of it has to do = with the=20 extreme poverty up there as well as unemployment, alcoholism etc. = There=20 has also been a huge push lately to return to ultra conservative=20 traditional ways which some older Navajos would like to take as = far as=20 cutting out the outside world. That won't ever happen. There are = still=20 many rational people up there. The upshot is, as long as you treat = the=20 Navajo, Hopi, or any other tribe with great respect, including = laws and=20 their privacy, you will be treated the same. Please don't read all = of the=20 above and be discouraged from visiting the reservations of = Arizona. I've=20 done so for over 20 years, with and without Mike, and have al! ! = ways been=20 treated very well. On a side note, Mike and I have been talking = about=20 doing an event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a = homestead ranch=20 in the Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. = There is a=20 trail that leads down to his family's cabin (not a hogan). His = family=20 always welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of = the=20 family to visit. The views are spectacular. Would people be=20 interested?



STOP MORE SPAM with the = new MSN=20 8 and get 2 months FREE*=20 ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching=20 mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, = subscribe or=20 unsubscribe visit:=20 http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's=20 Geocaching Resource=20 http://www.azgeocaching.com
= ------=_NextPart_000_3348_01C2CE04.285ADE30-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 7 00:32:18 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (WOLFB8) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 17:32:18 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation References: <320301c2ce29$b2fad840$cf98a8c0@Mike> <01cd01c2ce3a$6bcfca00$bfd36844@ph.cox.net> <334b01c2ce3e$d4ca5800$cf98a8c0@Mike> Message-ID: <002201c2ce40$606425c0$bfd36844@ph.cox.net> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001F_01C2CE05.B284C840 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable do not know all the details of who was were ect. or if the geocacher was = packing..or if the cop went to look for the shotter.......bottom line = don't trespass We will be known by the tracks we leave behind ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Mike Ingoglia=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 5:21 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation Yeah, but is shooting someone based on the fact that they're cruising = around in the desert fair punishment (I'm not buyin' that Navajo Nation = laws crap)? If I shot someone walking up to my door, I'd go to jail... = even if I caught someone in my house climbing back out the window after = ripping me off this still isn't justification.... now if someone is in = my house and I thought my family's lives were in danger that's a = completely different story. ----- Original Message -----=20 From: WOLFB8=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 4:46 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation bottom line is they were trespassing private property is just that = no matter who owns it!!!! We will be known by the tracks we leave behind ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Mike Ingoglia=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 2:50 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation Let me step back a bit from all political correctness and voice my = OPINION: It's unfortunate about the story of the geocachers being shot at. = I've personally met a lot of Navajo people that have a hatred for "white = people". These people (not all, but a good number) seem to have a chip = on their shoulder about "us" taking the land from them. I've = experienced this first hand as well as my wife experienced it growing up = in Page, AZ. The way I see it, it is the way humans are. There's not a = group of people in history that haven't fought over land rights... = including all the Indians. Yeah, we've all become more civilized and = politics prevent it from happening as much these days, but they just = need to get over it and deal with it... they don't need to be shooting = at anyone. If it was up to me, the reservations would become state = trust lands and the Indians would have to integrate into our society = rather than segregating themselves from it(sorry, I still have a few = years until I'm old enough to run for President) :-). It's ridiculous = the free ride our government gives them. I just love driving (NOT!) = through the reservation (on the highway) and seeing run-down single = wides with a satellite dish and a brand new Chevy pickup out front. I'm = beginning to believe getting "free rides" is the American way. ----- Original Message -----=20 From: mike and gale jett=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 12:18 PM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation Two of you wrote Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the = Navajo Nation >Police Department. He told me that they will not allow any = geocaches on >their lands. If you are caught on their lands without a permit = you can be >arrested. This is just a reminder to please not place any = caches on tribal >lands.=20 The sergeant had a story to tell about a couple of cacher that = wee shot at while looking for a cache. When they reported it to him they = were sited for trespassing and told that if the people wanted to kill = them they would have. I feel the need to defend the Navajo Nation. Some of you may = know that Mike is Navajo born and raised. His family still lives on the = reservation. I lived there for 2 years while working for Indian Health = Service. Lately the tribe has been having a lot of trouble with gangs, a = lot more than you might think. Part of it has to do with the extreme = poverty up there as well as unemployment, alcoholism etc. There has also = been a huge push lately to return to ultra conservative traditional ways = which some older Navajos would like to take as far as cutting out the = outside world. That won't ever happen. There are still many rational = people up there. The upshot is, as long as you treat the Navajo, Hopi, = or any other tribe with great respect, including laws and their privacy, = you will be treated the same. Please don't read all of the above and be = discouraged from visiting the reservations of Arizona. I've done so for = over 20 years, with and without Mike, and have al! ! ways been treated = very well. On a side note, Mike and I have been talking about doing an = event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a homestead ranch in the = Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail = that leads down to his family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always = welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family to = visit. The views are spectacular. Would people be interested? ------------------------------------------------------------------------ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* = ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your = setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: = http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com ------=_NextPart_000_001F_01C2CE05.B284C840 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
do not know all the details of who was = were ect. or=20 if the geocacher was packing..or if the cop went to look for the=20 shotter.......bottom line don't trespass
We will be known by the tracks we leave behind
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Mike = Ingoglia=20
Sent: Thursday, February 06, = 2003 5:21=20 PM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] = Navajo=20 Nation

Yeah, but is shooting someone based = on the fact=20 that they're cruising around in the desert fair punishment (I'm not = buyin'=20 that Navajo Nation laws crap)?  If I shot someone walking up to = my door,=20 I'd go to jail... even if I caught someone in my house climbing back = out the=20 window after ripping me off this still isn't justification.... now if = someone=20 is in my house and I thought my family's lives were in danger that's a = completely different story.
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 WOLFB8 =
Sent: Thursday, February 06, = 2003 4:46=20 PM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] = Navajo=20 Nation

 bottom line is they were=20 trespassing  private property is just that no matter who owns=20 it!!!!
 
We will be known by the tracks we leave behind
----- Original Message ----- =
From:=20 Mike = Ingoglia=20
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
Sent: Thursday, February = 06, 2003=20 2:50 PM
Subject: Re: = [Az-Geocaching] Navajo=20 Nation

Let me step back a bit from all = political=20 correctness and voice my OPINION:
 
It's unfortunate about the story = of the=20 geocachers being shot at.  I've personally met a lot of = Navajo people=20 that have a hatred for "white people".  These = people (not all,=20 but a good number) seem to have a chip on their shoulder about = "us" taking=20 the land from them.  I've experienced this first hand as well = as my=20 wife experienced it growing up in Page, AZ.  The way I see = it, it is=20 the way humans are.  There's not a group of people in history = that=20 haven't fought over land rights... including all the = Indians.  Yeah,=20 we've all become more civilized and politics prevent it from = happening as=20 much these days, but they just need to get over it and deal with = it...=20 they don't need to be shooting at anyone.  If it was up to = me, the=20 reservations would become state trust lands and the Indians would = have to=20 integrate into our society rather than segregating themselves from = it(sorry, I still have a few years until I'm old enough to run for = President)  :-).  It's ridiculous the free ride our = government=20 gives them.  I just love driving (NOT!) through the = reservation (on=20 the highway) and seeing run-down single wides with a satellite = dish and a=20 brand new Chevy pickup out front.  I'm beginning to believe = getting=20 "free rides" is the American way.
 
 
----- Original Message ----- =
From:=20 mike and gale = jett
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
Sent: Thursday, February = 06, 2003=20 12:18 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] = Navajo=20 Nation

Two of you wrote
 
Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the = Navajo=20 Nation
>Police Department. He told me that they will not = allow any=20 geocaches on
>their lands. If you are caught on their = lands=20 without a permit you can be
>arrested. This is just a = reminder to=20 please not place any caches on tribal
>lands.
 
The sergeant = had a story to=20 tell about a couple of cacher that wee shot at while looking for = a=20 cache. When they reported it to him they were sited for = trespassing and=20 told that if the people wanted to kill them they would=20 have.

 

I feel the need to defend the Navajo = Nation. Some=20 of you may know that Mike is Navajo born and raised. His family = still=20 lives on the reservation. I lived there for 2 years while = working for=20 Indian Health Service. Lately the tribe has been having a lot of = trouble=20 with gangs, a lot more than you might think. Part of it has to = do with=20 the extreme poverty up there as well as unemployment, alcoholism = etc.=20 There has also been a huge push lately to return to ultra = conservative=20 traditional ways which some older Navajos would like to take as = far as=20 cutting out the outside world. That won't ever happen. There are = still=20 many rational people up there. The upshot is, as long as you = treat the=20 Navajo, Hopi, or any other tribe with great respect, including = laws and=20 their privacy, you will be treated the same. Please don't read = all of=20 the above and be discouraged from visiting the reservations of = Arizona.=20 I've done so for over 20 years, with and without Mike, and have = al! !=20 ways been treated very well. On a side note, Mike and I have = been=20 talking about doing an event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His = family has a=20 homestead ranch in the Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the = tourists go. There is a trail that leads down to his family's = cabin (not=20 a hogan). His family always welcomes guests and permits are not = needed=20 for friends of the family to visit. The views are spectacular. = Would=20 people be interested?



STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN=20 8 and get 2 months FREE*=20 ____________________________________________________________=20 Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit = your=20 setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:=20 http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching=20 Arizona's Geocaching Resource=20 = http://www.azgeocaching.com
------=_NextPart_000_001F_01C2CE05.B284C840-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 7 01:08:44 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 20:08:44 EST Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Team DaSH Message-ID: <163.1b5a20d4.2b74611c@aol.com> --part1_163.1b5a20d4.2b74611c_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Team DaSH is alive and well! We've just been working a lot since the trip. I'm leaving to go camping tomorrow with a group of non-cachers, but hopefully I'll be able to find a couple in the area! I do appreciate the concern. And just for the record, it would take a group a bit scarier than all of you to scare us off! :) Dave Team DaSH --part1_163.1b5a20d4.2b74611c_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Team DaSH is alive and well!&nb= sp; We've just been working a lot since the trip.  I'm leaving to go ca= mping tomorrow with a group of non-cachers, but hopefully I'll be able to fi= nd a couple in the area!  I do appreciate the concern.  And just f= or the record, it would take a group a bit scarier than all of you to scare=20= us off!  :)

Dave
Team DaSH
 --part1_163.1b5a20d4.2b74611c_boundary-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 7 02:00:20 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Burkett) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 19:00:20 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation In-Reply-To: Message-ID: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0028_01C2CE11.FED6A180 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > On a side note, Mike and I have been talking about doing an event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a > homestead ranch in the Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail that leads down to his > family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family to >visit. The views are spectacular. Would people be interested? Deb and I would be interested. ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com ------=_NextPart_000_0028_01C2CE11.FED6A180 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

> On a side note, Mike and I = have been talking about doing an event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a =

> homestead ranch in the Canyon = del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail that leads down to = his

> family's cabin (not a hogan). = His family always welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the = family to

>visit. The views are = spectacular. Would people be interested?


Deb and I = would be interested.

____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com ------=_NextPart_000_0028_01C2CE11.FED6A180-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 7 03:28:30 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (HighwayHavoc) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 19:28:30 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030207032830.17178.qmail@web40505.mail.yahoo.com> Absolutely interested over here! Mark A. Pederson --- mike and gale jett wrote: On a side note, Mike and I have been talking about doing an event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a homestead ranch in the Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail that leads down to his family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family to visit. The views are spectacular. Would people be interested? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 7 04:13:01 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (mike and gale jett) Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2003 04:13:01 +0000 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation Message-ID:

Take a good look at the abject poverty they live in and tell me they have a free ride. The average yearly income on the Navajo Reservation is $2000 a year. Yes I meant two thousand dollars per year. The average life expectancy for Native Americans is far lower than it is for other Americans. Infant mortality rates are higher... I could go on. The conditions they live in are like that of a third world country. As far as assimilation goes... My husband's family all went to college. Mike is a pharmacist, one brother an urban planner, another works at UMC in Tucson. His two surviving sisters are 1) physician's assistant and 2) a data management specialist with a cancer treatment center. My in laws are all upstanding and hardworking people who did not get a free ride. In fact, they all had to overcome the kind of racism that unfortunately many people still exhibit towards Native Americans.

Oh that Viking temperment...

>From: "Mike Ingoglia"
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To:
>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation
>Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 14:50:01 -0700
>
>Let me step back a bit from all political correctness and voice my OPINION:
>
>It's unfortunate about the story of the geocachers being shot at. I've personally met a lot of Navajo people that have a hatred for "white people". These people (not all, but a good number) seem to have a chip on their shoulder about "us" taking the land from them. I've experienced this first hand as well as my wife experienced it growing up in Page, AZ. The way I see it, it is the way humans are. There's not a group of people in history that haven't fought over land rights... including all the Indians. Yeah, we've all become more civilized and politics prevent it from happening as much these days, but they just need to get over it and deal with it... they don't need to be shooting at anyone. If it was up to me, the reservations would become state trust lands and the Indians would have to integrate into our society rather than segregating themselves from it(sorry, I still have a few years until I'm old enough to run for President) :-). It's ridiculous the free ride our government gives them. I just love driving (NOT!) through the reservation (on the highway) and seeing run-down single wides with a satellite dish and a brand new Chevy pickup out front. I'm beginning to believe getting "free rides" is the American way.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: mike and gale jett
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 12:18 PM
> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation
>
>
> Two of you wrote
>
> Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the Navajo Nation
> >Police Department. He told me that they will not allow any geocaches on
> >their lands. If you are caught on their lands without a permit you can be
> >arrested. This is just a reminder to please not place any caches on tribal
> >lands.
>
> The sergeant had a story to tell about a couple of cacher that wee shot at while looking for a cache. When they reported it to him they were sited for trespassing and told that if the people wanted to kill them they would have.
>
>
>
> I feel the need to defend the Navajo Nation. Some of you may know that Mike is Navajo born and raised. His family still lives on the reservation. I lived there for 2 years while working for Indian Health Service. Lately the tribe has been having a lot of trouble with gangs, a lot more than you might think. Part of it has to do with the extreme poverty up there as well as unemployment, alcoholism etc. There has also been a huge push lately to return to ultra conservative traditional ways which some older Navajos would like to take as far as cutting out the outside world. That won't ever happen. There are still many rational people up there. The upshot is, as long as you treat the Navajo, Hopi, or any other tribe with great respect, including laws and their privacy, you will be treated the same. Please don't read all of the above and be discouraged from visiting the reservations of Arizona. I've done so for over 20 years, with and without Mike, and have al! ! ways been treated very well. On a side note, Mike and I have been talking about doing an event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a homestead ranch in the Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail that leads down to his family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family to visit. The views are spectacular. Would people be interested?
>
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com

MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*. From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 7 04:21:53 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Coyote1022) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 21:21:53 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation In-Reply-To: Message-ID: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0000_01C2CE25.C5055CD0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I would definitely be interested! Gordon Team Coyote1022 -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of mike and gale jett Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 12:18 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation Two of you wrote Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the Navajo Nation >Police Department. He told me that they will not allow any geocaches on >their lands. If you are caught on their lands without a permit you can be >arrested. This is just a reminder to please not place any caches on tribal >lands. The sergeant had a story to tell about a couple of cacher that wee shot at while looking for a cache. When they reported it to him they were sited for trespassing and told that if the people wanted to kill them they would have. I feel the need to defend the Navajo Nation. Some of you may know that Mike is Navajo born and raised. His family still lives on the reservation. I lived there for 2 years while working for Indian Health Service. Lately the tribe has been having a lot of trouble with gangs, a lot more than you might think. Part of it has to do with the extreme poverty up there as well as unemployment, alcoholism etc. There has also been a huge push lately to return to ultra conservative traditional ways which some older Navajos would like to take as far as cutting out the outside world. That won't ever happen. There are still many rational people up there. The upshot is, as long as you treat the Navajo, Hopi, or any other tribe with great respect, including laws and their privacy, you will be treated the same. Please don't read all of the above and be discouraged from visiting the reservations of Arizona. I've done so for over 20 years, with and without Mike, and have al! ! ways been treated very well. On a side note, Mike and I have been talking about doing an event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a homestead ranch in the Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail that leads down to his family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family to visit. The views are spectacular. Would people be interested? ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com ------=_NextPart_000_0000_01C2CE25.C5055CD0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I = would=20 definitely be interested!
 
Gordon
Team=20 Coyote1022
-----Original Message-----
From:=20 az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20 [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of = mike=20 and gale jett
Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 12:18=20 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: = [Az-Geocaching]=20 Navajo Nation

Two of you wrote
 
Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the = Navajo=20 Nation
>Police Department. He told me that they will not allow = any=20 geocaches on
>their lands. If you are caught on their lands = without a=20 permit you can be
>arrested. This is just a reminder to please = not place=20 any caches on tribal
>lands.
 
The sergeant had a = story to tell=20 about a couple of cacher that wee shot at while looking for a cache. = When they=20 reported it to him they were sited for trespassing and told that if = the people=20 wanted to kill them they would have.

 

I feel the need to defend the Navajo Nation. = Some of=20 you may know that Mike is Navajo born and raised. His family still = lives on=20 the reservation. I lived there for 2 years while working for Indian = Health=20 Service. Lately the tribe has been having a lot of trouble with gangs, = a lot=20 more than you might think. Part of it has to do with the extreme = poverty up=20 there as well as unemployment, alcoholism etc. There has also been a = huge push=20 lately to return to ultra conservative traditional ways which some = older=20 Navajos would like to take as far as cutting out the outside world. = That won't=20 ever happen. There are still many rational people up there. The upshot = is, as=20 long as you treat the Navajo, Hopi, or any other tribe with great = respect,=20 including laws and their privacy, you will be treated the same. Please = don't=20 read all of the above and be discouraged from visiting the = reservations of=20 Arizona. I've done so for over 20 years, with and without Mike, and = have al! !=20 ways been treated very well. On a side note, Mike and I have been = talking=20 about doing an event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a = homestead=20 ranch in the Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. = There is a=20 trail that leads down to his family's cabin (not a hogan). His family = always=20 welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family = to visit.=20 The views are spectacular. Would people be interested?



STOP MORE SPAM with the new = MSN 8=20 and get 2 months FREE*=20 ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching=20 mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe = or=20 unsubscribe visit:=20 http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's=20 Geocaching Resource = http://www.azgeocaching.com
------=_NextPart_000_0000_01C2CE25.C5055CD0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 7 05:37:43 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jerry Nelson) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 22:37:43 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation References: Message-ID: <003601c2ce6b$09ef5ea0$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0033_01C2CE30.5D45C200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Include Jerry and Cindy, Team Offtrail, in the Canyon de Chelly event = cache if/when it becomes a reality. Thanks to you both. On a side note, Mike and I have been talking about doing an event cache = in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a homestead ranch in the Canyon del = Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail that leads = down to his family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always welcomes = guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family to visit. = The views are spectacular. Would people be interested? -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* = ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your = setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: = http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com ------=_NextPart_000_0033_01C2CE30.5D45C200 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Include Jerry and Cindy, Team Offtrail, = in the=20 Canyon de Chelly event cache if/when it becomes a reality.  Thanks = to you=20 both.
 
 
On a side note, Mike and I have been talking = about=20 doing an event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a homestead = ranch in=20 the Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a = trail that=20 leads down to his family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always = welcomes=20 guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family to visit. = The views=20 are spectacular. Would people be interested?


STOP MORE SPAM with the new = MSN 8=20 and get 2 months FREE*=20 ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching=20 mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe = or=20 unsubscribe visit:=20 http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's=20 Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com = ------=_NextPart_000_0033_01C2CE30.5D45C200-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 7 14:24:34 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 07:24:34 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation References: Message-ID: <01a701c2ceb4$a728cfa0$319c4094@BILLPC> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_019D_01C2CE79.F6D71290 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Your post does a good job of making the point that the reservation = system is failing the people it is alleged to be trying to help. They = must overcome high odds, get an education, and leave the reservation or = else be caught in third world conditions making $2000 a year. The = reservation system was adopted so many years ago out of prejudice by = people who didn't want the Indigenous Americans living among them. It = has served its real purpose of isolating the native population and = preventing them from joining society at large. The reservation system = was wrong when adopted, and is still wrong today. Bill ----- Original Message -----=20 From: mike and gale jett=20 Take a good look at the abject poverty they live in and tell me they = have a free ride. The average yearly income on the Navajo Reservation is = $2000 a year. Yes I meant two thousand dollars per year. The average = life expectancy for Native Americans is far lower than it is for other = Americans. Infant mortality rates are higher... I could go on. The = conditions they live in are like that of a third world country. As far = as assimilation goes... My husband's family all went to college. Mike is = a pharmacist, one brother an urban planner, another works at UMC in = Tucson. His two surviving sisters are 1) physician's assistant and 2) a = data management specialist with a cancer treatment center. My in laws = are all upstanding and hardworking people who did not get a free ride. = In fact, they all had to overcome the kind of racism that unfortunately = many people still exhibit towards Native Americans. ------=_NextPart_000_019D_01C2CE79.F6D71290 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Your post does a good job = of making=20 the point that the reservation system is failing the people it = is alleged=20 to be trying to help.  They must overcome high odds, get = an=20 education, and leave the reservation or else be caught in third world = conditions=20 making $2000 a year.  The reservation system was adopted so many = years ago=20 out of prejudice by people who didn't want the Indigenous Americans = living among=20 them.  It has served its real purpose of isolating the native = population=20 and preventing them from joining society at large.  The reservation = system=20 was wrong when adopted, and is still wrong today.
 
Bill
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 mike and gale jett =

Take a good look at the abject poverty they live in and tell me = they have a=20 free ride. The average yearly income on the Navajo Reservation is = $2000 a=20 year. Yes I meant two thousand dollars per year. The average life = expectancy=20 for Native Americans is far lower than it is for other Americans. = Infant=20 mortality rates are higher... I could go on. The conditions they live = in are=20 like that of a third world country. As far as assimilation goes... My=20 husband's family all went to college. Mike is a pharmacist, one = brother an=20 urban planner, another works at UMC in Tucson. His two surviving = sisters are=20 1) physician's assistant and 2) a data management specialist with a = cancer=20 treatment center. My in laws are all upstanding and hardworking people = who did=20 not get a free ride. In fact, they all had to overcome the kind of = racism that=20 unfortunately many people still exhibit towards Native=20 Americans.

------=_NextPart_000_019D_01C2CE79.F6D71290-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 7 14:24:32 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mimi Philpott) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 07:24:32 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation In-Reply-To: <002d01c2c36c$d18ae420$08f9bed8@teamcbx2> Message-ID: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C2CE79.F58CB840 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Team Trail Gypsy is definitely interested. -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Cody Brown Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2003 10:53 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Bill Burkett Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 7:00 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation > On a side note, Mike and I have been talking about doing an event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a > homestead ranch in the Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail that leads down to his > family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family to >visit. The views are spectacular. Would people be interested? Cody & Cheryl TeamCBx2 are interested. Let us know. ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C2CE79.F58CB840 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Team=20 Trail Gypsy is definitely interested.
-----Original Message-----
From:=20 az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20 [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of = Cody=20 Brown
Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2003 10:53 = PM
To:=20 listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] = Navajo=20 Nation

 

 

-----Original=20 Message-----
From:=20 az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20 [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Bill = Burkett
Sent: Thursday, February 06,=20 2003 = 7:00=20 PM
To: = listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] = Navajo=20 Nation

 

> On a side note, Mike and I = have been=20 talking about doing an event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has = a=20

> homestead ranch in the = Canyon del=20 Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail that = leads down=20 to his

> family's cabin (not a = hogan). His=20 family always welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends = of the=20 family to

>visit. The views are spectacular. Would people = be=20 interested?

Cody &=20 Cheryl   TeamCBx2 = are=20 interested.  Let us=20 = know.

_________________________________= ___________________________=20 Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your = setting,=20 subscribe or unsubscribe visit:=20 http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's=20 Geocaching Resource = http://www.azgeocaching.com
------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C2CE79.F58CB840-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 7 16:24:27 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 11:24:27 -0500 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation Message-ID: --0__=0ABBE655DFC9A7568f9e8a93df938690918c0ABBE655DFC9A756 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Bill, I am interested in your offer. It is very, very kind of you. Please add me to your list. Thank you so very much Barry "Bill Burkett" To: Sent by: cc: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching. Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation com Thursday February 6, 2003 07:00 PM Please respond to listserv > On a side note, Mike and I have been talking about doing an event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a > homestead ranch in the Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail that leads down to his > family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family to >visit. The views are spectacular. Would people be interested? Deb and I would be interested. ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com (See attached file: C.htm) --0__=0ABBE655DFC9A7568f9e8a93df938690918c0ABBE655DFC9A756 Content-type: text/html; name="C.htm" Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="C.htm" Content-transfer-encoding: base64 PGh0bWwgeG1sbnM6bz0idXJuOnNjaGVtYXMtbWljcm9zb2Z0LWNvbTpvZmZpY2U6b2ZmaWNlIiB4 bWxuczp3PSJ1cm46c2NoZW1hcy1taWNyb3NvZnQtY29tOm9mZmljZTp3b3JkIiB4bWxucz0iaHR0 cDovL3d3dy53My5vcmcvVFIvUkVDLWh0bWw0MCI+DQoNCjxoZWFkPg0KPG1ldGEgaHR0cC1lcXVp dj1Db250ZW50LVR5cGUgY29udGVudD0idGV4dC9odG1sOyBjaGFyc2V0PWlzby04ODU5LTEiPg0K PG1ldGEgbmFtZT1Qcm9nSWQgY29udGVudD1Xb3JkLkRvY3VtZW50Pg0KPG1ldGEgbmFtZT1HZW5l cmF0b3IgY29udGVudD0iTWljcm9zb2Z0IFdvcmQgOSI+DQo8bWV0YSBuYW1lPU9yaWdpbmF0b3Ig 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X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f Xw0KQXotR2VvY2FjaGluZyBtYWlsaW5nIGxpc3QgbGlzdHNlcnZAYXpnZW9jYWNoaW5nLmNvbQ0K VG8gZWRpdCB5b3VyIHNldHRpbmcsIHN1YnNjcmliZSBvciB1bnN1YnNjcmliZSB2aXNpdDoNCmh0 dHA6Ly9saXN0c2Vydi5hemdlb2NhY2hpbmcuY29tL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vYXotZ2VvY2Fj aGluZw0KDQpBcml6b25hJ3MgR2VvY2FjaGluZyBSZXNvdXJjZQ0KaHR0cDovL3d3dy5hemdlb2Nh Y2hpbmcuY29t --0__=0ABBE655DFC9A7568f9e8a93df938690918c0ABBE655DFC9A756-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 7 17:49:33 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Burkett) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 10:49:33 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Whoa! Not my offer! It's Mike and Gale's. -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of barry.neely@prudential.com Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 9:24 AM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation << File: C.htm >> Bill, I am interested in your offer. It is very, very kind of you. Please add me to your list. Thank you so very much Barry "Bill Burkett" To: Sent by: cc: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching. Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation com Thursday February 6, 2003 07:00 PM Please respond to listserv > On a side note, Mike and I have been talking about doing an event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a > homestead ranch in the Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail that leads down to his > family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family to >visit. The views are spectacular. Would people be interested? Deb and I would be interested. ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com (See attached file: C.htm) From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 7 19:08:59 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2003 11:08:59 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation Message-ID: <20030207110900.21521.h018.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> What's this? Bill and Deb and having a PARTY?? I'm in!! Trisha Prescott "Bill Burkett" wrote: > > Whoa! Not my offer! It's Mike and Gale's. > > -----Original Message----- > From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com > [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of > barry.neely@prudential.com > Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 9:24 AM > To: listserv@azgeocaching.com > Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation > > << File: C.htm >> > Bill, > > I am interested in your offer. It is very, very kind of you. Please > add me > to your list. > > Thank you so very much > > Barry > > > > > > "Bill Burkett" > To: > > Sent by: cc: > az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching. > Subject: > RE: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation > com > > > > Thursday February 6, 2003 07:00 PM > Please respond to listserv > > > > > > > > On a side note, Mike and I have been talking about doing an event > cache > in > Canyon de Chelly. His family has a > > homestead ranch in the Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the > tourists > go. There is a trail that leads down to his > > family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always welcomes guests and > permits are not needed for friends of the family to > >visit. The views are spectacular. Would people be interested? > > Deb and I would be interested. > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching > mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe > or > unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > Arizona's > Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com > > (See attached file: C.htm) > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 7 19:37:23 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2003 11:37:23 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto revisited Message-ID: <20030207113729.11281.h018.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Hi List! I'm kinda getting into this discussion a couple days down the road, but I wanted to point out/clarify one point. First, thanks to Ken and Libby for representing geocaching. Libby, did you get to do any Prescott caches? Anyway, my point....Ken brought out that the "officials" should check the website and email owners of any caches that were too near the restricted sites that they oversee. Libby mentioned we should police ourselves. I have no problem with either or both approaches (to make sure we are not putting caches in "bad" places) but my question is, and maybe Libby can answer this as she said we should police ourselves....if the archeological sites are UN-published, how can we find out where we can NOT put caches?? Maybe this has already been answered in the past few months, if so, I missed it and need to know. I just placed a couple new caches this month near Prescott (PNF) and I have no idea is I was near a sensitive site or not (that's why they are unpublished, right, so people won't go there?) Did the site stewards give us any direction as to how we are supposed to find out where we can't place caches? I'm happy to comply with any request or law, but I can't be expected to read minds. Thanks Trisha "Lightning" Prescott I swear, it's getting to the point where I feel like archiving all my caches and shutting off the computer!! "Ken" wrote: > > Libby and I went as land stewards to the conservation law enforcement > seminar held in Prescott Today. Approximately 100-150 officers from > Game & > Fish, and various park rangers from the state attended.While there the > instructors began discussing Geocaching and how it has had a negative > impact > on some archeological sites. My belief is that they formed these > opinions > based upon the poorly written article in the Arizona Repulsive. > > During this seminar I was able to speak to the various instructors and > educate them about our hobby. As a result they gave me some time to > speak to > the group and give an impromptu presentation about Geocaching. I > encouraged > the members to check the website and address any of their concerns > through > the internet. After making my presentation I had several members > approach me > and said that they had changed their minds and do not consider it as > serious > a threat as they had been led to believe. I think I left them with a > positive impression. > > The archeological community does have legitimate concerns about placing > caches in archeological sites.The consensus of the archeologists is > that > placing caches near these sites is extremely damaging. I have learned > that > moving objects, i.e.rocks & stuff while hunting for a cache, can > destroy the > historical significance of the site. There are severe criminal and > civil > penalties that can be assessed if damage is done to these sites. Since > there > are many unpublished archeological sites throughout the state I > encouraged > the members of the Conservation Law Enforcement community to log on the > Geocaching web site to check there respective areas for caches that > may be > placed, or near unknown archeological sites. If you happen to get an > e-mail > from one of them requesting you remove a cache, please do so. I > believe the > majority of them left with a more positive outlook about our hobby. > > Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the Navajo > Nation > Police Department. He told me that they will not allow any geocaches on > their lands. If you are caught on their lands without a permit you can > be > arrested. This is just a reminder to please not place any caches on > tribal > lands. > > It still amazes me how much damage one poorly written and researched > newspaper article can cause. > > Ken > WhereRwee? > A.K.A. > Geocaching Land Steward ;) > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Team Tierra Buena" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, February 05, 2003 5:41 PM > Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto revisited > > > > > My point is why hasn't like anyone who knows the complete list of > > caches in > > > the Wilderness Area done that????? or why didn't the Rangers do > that > > when > > > they got the Coords for the Caches??? > > > > Most cachers would rather be caching than playing Cache Cop. And I > doubt > > anyone knows the "complete list of caches in the Wilderness Area". > And > > even if they did, someone else will come along and place a new one, > just > > as happened here. > > > > Understandably, I think, the Rangers couldn't care less whether > anyone > > mistakenly goes to the cache site or not, as long as there's no cache > > there when they arrive. They don't understand how the game is played, > > nor do they want to or have the time to. It's not their job. Granted, > > they're probably not thinking about the potential for extra traffic > or > > someone tramping about in the site area looking for something that > isn't > > there. More likely they figure if they just remove it, word will get > out > > quickly enough and people will stop going to the site. That strategy > > worked rather well in the case of the original Superstition caches > they > > confiscated. > > > > Steve > > Team Tierra Buena > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 7 20:08:08 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 13:08:08 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation Message-ID: Well then Thank you Mike and Dale. Barry "Bill Burkett" To: Sent by: cc: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching. Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation com Friday February 7, 2003 10:49 AM Please respond to listserv Whoa! Not my offer! It's Mike and Gale's. -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of barry.neely@prudential.com Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 9:24 AM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation << File: C.htm >> Bill, I am interested in your offer. It is very, very kind of you. Please add me to your list. Thank you so very much Barry "Bill Burkett" To: Sent by: cc: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching. Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation com Thursday February 6, 2003 07:00 PM Please respond to listserv > On a side note, Mike and I have been talking about doing an event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a > homestead ranch in the Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail that leads down to his > family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family to >visit. The views are spectacular. Would people be interested? Deb and I would be interested. ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com (See attached file: C.htm) ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 7 20:27:23 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (WOLFB8) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 13:27:23 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto revisited References: <20030207113729.11281.h018.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Message-ID: <003701c2cee7$57699660$bfd36844@ph.cox.net> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0034_01C2CEAC.A64483C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi List! First, thanks to Ken and Libby for representing geocaching. Libby, did you get to do any Prescott caches? Nope it was like very COLD up = there. Anyway, my point....Ken brought out that the "officials" should check the website and email owners of any caches that were too near the restricted sites that they oversee. Libby mentioned we should police ourselves. I have no problem with either or both approaches (to make sure we are not putting caches in "bad" places) but my question is, and maybe Libby can answer this as she said we should police ourselves....if the archeological sites are UN-published, how can we find out where we can NOT put caches?? If we talk to the land manager = and ask for permission when we have a area in mind. They can tell you if = the area is ok. From my personal experence I ask about a site with state = trust land. The guys asked me to please consider a different location. = Since I have never made it to that location I have not hidden the cache. = Once people start asking they will know if it's a "good"area.or a "bad" = area. Remenber that parts of the forest may be closed during different = times of the year for different reasons " fire, birthing, errosion ect" Maybe this has already been answered in the past few months, if so, I missed it and need to know.=20 I just placed a couple new caches this month near Prescott (PNF) and I have no idea is I was near a sensitive site or not (that's why they are unpublished, right, so people won't go there?) ask your local = ranger they will be glad to help you or get a hold of the site stewart = manger in the area and ask her. To find the name of the site stewart = manage in your area contact the program or myself and i will act as a go = between.=20 Did the site stewards give us any direction as to how we are supposed to find out where we can't place caches? I'm happy to comply with any request or law, but I can't be expected to read minds. If we just = follow the rule for the game and ask first there will not be any = problems. We will be known by the tracks we leave behind ------=_NextPart_000_0034_01C2CEAC.A64483C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
 
 
Hi List!

<snip>
First, thanks=20 to Ken and Libby for representing geocaching. Libby, did
you get to = do any=20 Prescott caches? Nope it was like very COLD up=20 there.

Anyway, my point....Ken brought out that the = "officials"=20 should check
the website and email owners of any caches that were = too near=20 the
restricted sites that they oversee. Libby mentioned we should=20 police
ourselves. I have no problem with either or both approaches = (to=20 make
sure we are not putting caches in "bad" places) but my = question=20 is,
and maybe Libby can answer this as she said we should=20 police
ourselves....if the archeological sites are UN-published, = how can=20 we
find out where we can NOT put caches?? If = we talk to=20 the land manager and ask for permission when we have a area in mind. = They can=20 tell you if the area is ok. From my personal experence I ask about a = site with=20 state trust land. The guys asked me to please consider a different = location.=20 Since I have never made it to that location I have not hidden the = cache. Once=20 people start asking they will know if  it's a "good"area.or a = "bad" area.=20 Remenber that parts of the forest may be closed during different times = of the=20 year for different reasons " fire, birthing, errosion = ect"
Maybe this has already been
answered in the past few months, = if so, I=20 missed it and need to know.

I just placed a couple new caches = this=20 month near Prescott (PNF) and I
have no idea is I was near a = sensitive site=20 or not (that's why they
are unpublished, right, so people won't go = there?)=20 ask your local ranger they will be glad to help = you or get=20 a hold of the site stewart manger in the area and ask her.  To = find the=20 name of the site stewart manage in your area contact the program or = myself and=20 i will act as a go between.

Did the site stewards give = us any=20 direction as to how we are supposed
to find out where we can't = place=20 caches? I'm happy to comply with any
request or law, but I can't be = expected to read minds. If we just follow the = rule for the=20 game and ask first there will not be any = problems.


We will be known by the tracks we leave=20 behind


------=_NextPart_000_0034_01C2CEAC.A64483C0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 7 21:12:08 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Nicol) Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2003 13:12:08 -0800 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto revisited Message-ID: >From: trisha@brasher.com >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com >....if the archeological sites are UN-published, how can we >find out where we can NOT put caches?? Maybe this has already been >answered in the past few months, if so, I missed it and need to know. > >I just placed a couple new caches this month near Prescott (PNF) and I >have no idea is I was near a sensitive site or not (that's why they >are unpublished, right, so people won't go there?) > >Did the site stewards give us any direction as to how we are supposed >to find out where we can't place caches? I'm happy to comply with any >request or law, but I can't be expected to read minds. > >Thanks >Trisha "Lightning" I very much agree with Trisha on this one. I have contemplated posting this concern on the list as well. But, have held back until now! :) Some of these 'so-called' archeological sites are SO SUBTLE that they are not even remotely recognizable by your average Joe (me and 99.9% of the american population). Only an archeological scientist (or whatever they are called) would know what they are. Some are nothing more than a scattering of rocks in the area (by pictures I have seen) and look no different from the other nearby areas. There is NO WAY a site steward can expect us to know it is an archeological site. The plain and simple truth to all this is: IF THESE SITE STEWARDS DONT WANT US ON THIS GROUNDS.. THEY NEED TO POST SIGNS STATING THIS IS AN ARCHEOLOGICAL SITE. Period. I can simply be walking thru the forest/desert and accidentally kick a rock that was part of history and never even know it. I wouldnt intentionally do that obviously. Now, if I knew that 100x100' area had historical significance.. I would gladly walk around it. I dont beleive these areas should be off limits IF they are on public lands. However, there should be signs stating "this is an archeological site... please do not destroy or take anything and leave the area as you found it" or something to that extent. But, either way. If they want these areas protected.. they should be signed or simply fenced off to preserve them. By what I have been reading, I could be fined $100,000 for accidentally 'destroying' an archelogical site by doing nothing more than kicking a rock that I didn't even know was part of a historical site. I would, in no way, destroy or de-face in any way an historical site of any kind. I greatly respect the land and the historical value a piece of land may hold. I also greatly enjoy Arizona history and enjoy visiting sites and doing nothing more than standing back and taking it all in. But, as Trisha said.. we cant be expected to know where all these sites are. Yes, some are obvious (rock walls, etc) but some are very subtle and don't look any different than the terrain around them. The site stewards don't want to post the whereabouts of all these archeological sites.. but, they CAN at least put signs up around them at the sites. Scott Team Ropingthewind _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 7 22:12:59 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ben Dilcher) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 15:12:59 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Fw: Poem by Johny Cash Message-ID: ------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C2CEBB.667D9E70 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" This attachment is okay to open. I checked it ----- Original Message ----- From: Rancho Santa Ynez Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 9:04 AM To: Priscilla Phelps; Jacinda Johnson; Doryland; BJ Dilcher Subject: Fw: Poem by Johny Cash ----- Original Message ----- From: Warren & Vicki Webster To: undisclosed-recipients Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 8:13 AM Subject: Fw: Poem by Johny Cash > This is very good, wait for the sound. > > http://www.alighthouse.com/flag.htm> > > . ____________________________________________________ IncrediMail - Email has finally evolved - Click Here ------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C2CEBB.667D9E70 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This attachment is okay to open.  I = checked it
 
----- Original Message= -----
From: Rancho Santa Ynez
Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 9:04 AM
To: Priscilla Phelps; Jacinda Johnson; Doryland; BJ= Dilcher
Subject: Fw: Poem b= y Johny Cash
 
 
----- Original Message -----
To: undisclosed-recipients
Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 8:13 AM
Subje= ct: Fw: Poem by Johny Cash

=

  

> This is very good, wait for the sound.
>
> http://www.alighthouse.com/flag= .htm>
>
>




.
____________________________________________________3D""  IncrediMail - Email has finally = evolved - Click= Here
------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C2CEBB.667D9E70-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 7 22:32:00 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mike Ingoglia) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 15:32:00 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Fw: Poem by Johny Cash References: Message-ID: <2c4e01c2cef8$bb2412f0$cf98a8c0@Mike> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_2C4B_01C2CEBE.0EB70A20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable http://www.alighthouse.com/plord.htm ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Ben Dilcher=20 To: Carl Dilcher ; Azgaocaching ; Casie Mullin ; Jim Higuera ; Ken = Henson ; Eric and Melissa Stumpf ; Randy=20 Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 3:12 PM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Fw: Poem by Johny Cash This attachment is okay to open. I checked it ----- Original Message ----- From: Rancho Santa Ynez Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 9:04 AM To: Priscilla Phelps; Jacinda Johnson; Doryland; BJ Dilcher Subject: Fw: Poem by Johny Cash ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Warren & Vicki Webster=20 To: undisclosed-recipients=20 Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 8:13 AM Subject: Fw: Poem by Johny Cash =20 > This is very good, wait for the sound. >=20 > http://www.alighthouse.com/flag.htm> >=20 >=20 . =20 =20 =20 ____________________________________________________ IncrediMail - Email has finally evolved - Click Here ------=_NextPart_000_2C4B_01C2CEBE.0EB70A20 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
http://www.alighthouse.com/= plord.htm
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Ben = Dilcher=20
To: Carl Dilcher ; Azgaocaching ; Casie=20 Mullin ; Jim Higuera ; Ken = Henson ;=20 Eric and = Melissa=20 Stumpf ; Randy
Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 = 3:12=20 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Fw: = Poem by=20 Johny Cash

This attachment is okay to open.  I checked it
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Rancho Santa Ynez
Sent: Friday, February 07, = 2003 9:04=20 AM
To: Priscilla Phelps; Jacinda = Johnson;=20 Doryland; BJ Dilcher
Subject: Fw: Poem by Johny = Cash
 
 
----- Original Message -----=20
From: = Warren=20 & Vicki Webster
Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 8:13 AM
Subject: Fw: Poem by Johny Cash


  


> This is = very=20 good, wait for the sound.
>
> http://www.alighthouse.com/f= lag.htm>
>=20
>




.
____________________________________________________
  IncrediMail = - Email=20 has finally evolved - Click=20 Here=20
------=_NextPart_000_2C4B_01C2CEBE.0EB70A20-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 7 23:55:48 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 16:55:48 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000001c2cf04$70d65a30$c069dd18@OUR> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C2CEC9.C4778230 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mike and I have been talking about doing an event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a homestead ranch in the Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail that leads down to his family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family to visit. The views are spectacular. Would people be interested? About four years ago, Judi and I and another couple had the privilege of spending the day in both branches of the Canyon, driving with our guide, Genevieve. Canyon de Chelly is one of our favorite places in the country. I hope that we will be able to make the time and the wherewithal to join you on this event. Thank you both for considering this. Steve Team Tierra Buena ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C2CEC9.C4778230 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
 Mike and I have been talking about = doing an event=20 cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a homestead ranch in the = Canyon del=20 Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail that leads = down to=20 his family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always welcomes guests and = permits=20 are not needed for friends of the family to visit. The views are = spectacular.=20 Would people be interested? 
 
About four years ago, Judi and I and another = couple had=20 the privilege of spending the day in both branches of the Canyon, = driving with=20 our guide, Genevieve. Canyon de Chelly is one of our favorite places in = the=20 country. I hope that we will be able to make the time and the = wherewithal to=20 join you on this event. Thank you both for considering = this.
 
Steve
Team=20 Tierra Buena
------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C2CEC9.C4778230-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 7 23:55:48 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 16:55:48 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto revisited In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000501c2cf04$717cfa70$c069dd18@OUR> > The plain and simple truth to all this is: IF THESE SITE > STEWARDS DONT WANT > US ON THIS GROUNDS.. THEY NEED TO POST SIGNS STATING THIS IS AN > ARCHEOLOGICAL SITE. Period. The problem with that, Scott, is that once the location of an archaeological site is made public, by any medium, you are signing that site's death warrant. There are still plenty of pothunters and other unscrupulous people who will think nothing of devastating that site in hopes of finding saleable artifacts (and sadly, there is enough of a market for those artifacts to make the risks worthwhile to some). And that is the "Catch-22" of the site stewards. If the archaeological site locations are kept secret, they risk accidental damage by those of us who don't realize what we're walking on. If the site locations are made available, they risk deliberate destruction. The solution, as Libby so well stated earlier, is to get permission to place the cache. If we ask first, the land managers/site stewards have an opportunity to assess if the area we want to use is at risk, and tell us if it's a problem, without compromising the locations of specific archaeological sites. And if asking permission becomes the practice I believe Geocaching's detractors and any "controversy" surrounding our game would go away. Steve Team Tierra Buena From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 8 00:01:13 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 17:01:13 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] New Garmin Etrex Firmware Message-ID: <000601c2cf05$31f74530$c069dd18@OUR> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C2CECA.85986D30 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Garmin today announced version 3.10 of the firmware for the Etrex Legend and Vista models. By installing these upgrades you will get the following benefits: * Increased active track log to 10,000 points. * Increased saved track log to 750 points. * Increased user waypoints to 1,000 waypoints. (!) * Increased waypoints per route to 125 waypoints. * Added option on Map Setup page to specify the number of track points to plot. The most recent points will be plotted up to the specified number, not exceeding the size of the track log. * Improved South African grid. * Corrected problem where MapSource would give an error message after transferring a large number of map tiles. Note that these upgrades are for these two Etrex models only. You can download the upgrade at: http://www.garmin.com/support/download.jsp Steve Team Tierra Buena ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C2CECA.85986D30 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
Garmin = today=20 announced version 3.10 of the firmware for the Etrex Legend and Vista = models. By=20 installing these upgrades you will get the following=20 benefits:
 
  • Increased active track log to = 10,000=20 points.
  • Increased saved track log to 750 = points.=20
  • Increased user waypoints to 1,000 = waypoints. (!)
  • Increased waypoints per route to = 125=20 waypoints.
  • Added option on Map Setup page to = specify=20 the number of track points to plot. The most recent points will be = plotted up=20 to the specified number, not exceeding the size of the track log. =
  • Improved South African grid. =
  • Corrected problem where MapSource = would=20 give an error message after transferring a large number of map=20 tiles.
Note = that these=20 upgrades are for these two Etrex models only. You can download the = upgrade at:=20 http://www.garmin.com= /support/download.jsp
 
Steve
Team = Tierra=20 Buena
------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C2CECA.85986D30-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 8 00:24:25 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Nicol) Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2003 16:24:25 -0800 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto revisited Message-ID: >From: "Team Tierra Buena" >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com >To: >Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto revisited >Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 16:55:48 -0700 >The problem with that, Scott, is that once the location of an >archaeological site is made public, by any medium, you are signing that >site's death warrant. There are still plenty of pothunters and other >unscrupulous people who will think nothing of devastating that site in >hopes of finding saleable artifacts (and sadly, there is enough of a >market for those artifacts to make the risks worthwhile to some). And >that is the "Catch-22" of the site stewards. If the archaeological site >locations are kept secret, they risk accidental damage by those of us >who don't realize what we're walking on. If the site locations are made >available, they risk deliberate destruction. > >The solution, as Libby so well stated earlier, is to get permission to >place the cache. If we ask first, the land managers/site stewards have >an opportunity to assess if the area we want to use is at risk, and tell >us if it's a problem, without compromising the locations of specific >archaeological sites. And if asking permission becomes the practice I >believe Geocaching's detractors and any "controversy" surrounding our >game would go away. > >Steve >Team Tierra Buena Steve, I totally understand the thing about getting permission before placing a cache. I totally agree with that and I will indeed seek permission before ever placing a cache again. I would also like to find out if there is one of these sites anywhere's near my cache. My thoughts were what if I am simply out hiking one day (geocache seeking or otherwise) and I stumble upon one of these sites, which I dont know is a site. That is my concern. Scott Team RTW _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 8 00:27:38 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bob Renner) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 16:27:38 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] New Garmin Etrex Firmware In-Reply-To: <000601c2cf05$31f74530$c069dd18@OUR> Message-ID: <20030208002738.1334.qmail@web40703.mail.yahoo.com> Notes from the Garmin site for the Legend (similar ones exist for the Vista). Pay attention to item 3. Bob Renner 1. Reverting back to previously released versions will clear user memory. 2. Users are strongly urged to backup any user data they wish to save. 3. WARNING: If your current software version is 2.50 or lower, this software will clear all unit data including alamanac information. Backup all user data before upgrading. After installation is complete, place unit with a clear view of the sky for 15-30 minutes to re-acquire almanac data. 4. WARNING: If this software is uploaded to a device other than that for which it is designed, you will not be able to operate that device. 5. If attempts to upload software fail, you may need to return the device to GARMIN for service. --- Team Tierra Buena wrote: > Garmin today announced version 3.10 of the firmware > for the Etrex Legend > and Vista models. By installing these upgrades you > will get the > following benefits: > > > * Increased active track log to 10,000 points. > * Increased saved track log to 750 points. > * Increased user waypoints to 1,000 waypoints. (!) > * Increased waypoints per route to 125 waypoints. > * Added option on Map Setup page to specify the > number of track > points to plot. The most recent points will be > plotted up to the > specified number, not exceeding the size of the > track log. > * Improved South African grid. > * Corrected problem where MapSource would give an > error message > after transferring a large number of map tiles. > > Note that these upgrades are for these two Etrex > models only. You can > download the upgrade at: > http://www.garmin.com/support/download.jsp > > Steve > Team Tierra Buena > __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 8 00:29:52 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Nicol) Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2003 16:29:52 -0800 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] New Garmin Etrex Firmware Message-ID: >From: "Team Tierra Buena" >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com >To: >Subject: [Az-Geocaching] New Garmin Etrex Firmware >Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 17:01:13 -0700 > >Garmin today announced version 3.10 of the firmware for the Etrex Legend >and Vista models. By installing these upgrades you will get the >following benefits: > > >* Increased active track log to 10,000 points. >* Increased saved track log to 750 points. >* Increased user waypoints to 1,000 waypoints. (!) >* Increased waypoints per route to 125 waypoints. >* Added option on Map Setup page to specify the number of track >points to plot. The most recent points will be plotted up to the >specified number, not exceeding the size of the track log. >* Improved South African grid. >* Corrected problem where MapSource would give an error message >after transferring a large number of map tiles. > >Note that these upgrades are for these two Etrex models only. You can >download the upgrade at: http://www.garmin.com/support/download.jsp > >Steve >Team Tierra Buena WOW! 1,000 WAYPOINTS!? I will now be able to fit ALL the caches I dont yet have in Arizona into my Garmin Legend!!!!!!!! That is amazing. Is there any other GPS out there that will store 1,000 waypoints!? Very cool! I am downloading now! Scott Team Ropingthewind _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 8 00:33:58 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 17:33:58 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Our Day in Tonto revisited In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000f01c2cf09$c5dcea80$c069dd18@OUR> > I totally understand the thing about getting permission > before placing a > cache. I totally agree with that and I will indeed seek > permission before > ever placing a cache again. Thank you. > I would also like to find out if > there is one of > these sites anywhere's near my cache. If your cache is in Tonto NF, call the ranger station for the district in which your cache is located and tell them about the cache and where it is. They should be able to check into it for you. Tonto just happens to be one of the few public places where we don't really *need* permission, but as Forest Archaeologist Scott Wood said, "It doesn't hurt to stop in at the ranger station and let them know your plans". > My thoughts were what > if I am simply > out hiking one day (geocache seeking or otherwise) and I > stumble upon one of > these sites, which I dont know is a site. That is my concern. I'm speaking out of turn here, but I'd have a hard time believing that they'd prosecute anyone for accidentally damaging a site, particularly if it isn't obvious to the untrained eye. Steve Team Tierra Buena From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 8 00:40:41 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Joe Brekke) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 17:40:41 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation References: Message-ID: <003501c2cf0a$b5710220$5a32a8c0@default> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0032_01C2CED0.08AEFB80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On a side note, Mike and I have been talking about doing an event = cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a homestead ranch in the = Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail = that leads down to his family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always = welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family to = visit. The views are spectacular. Would people be interested? We would be very interested, thanks, this is very generous -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- ------=_NextPart_000_0032_01C2CED0.08AEFB80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
 
On a side note, = Mike and I=20 have been talking about doing an event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His = family=20 has a homestead ranch in the Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the = tourists go. There is a trail that leads down to his family's cabin = (not a=20 hogan). His family always welcomes guests and permits are not needed = for=20 friends of the family to visit. The views are spectacular. Would = people be=20 interested?
 
We would be very = interested,=20 thanks, this is very generous


------=_NextPart_000_0032_01C2CED0.08AEFB80-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 8 05:59:12 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 22:59:12 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation References: Message-ID: <001901c2cf37$342a8d30$91f50244@cx301817d> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C2CEFC.87AEB750 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable My message was not intended as an attack against the Navajo Nation. The = purpose for putting out the information was to inform our community of = their desires. Just like any other property owner they have an absolute = right to regulate what occurs on their lands. During my conversation = with the Sergeant I told him that I would do what I could to get the = message out. Ken WhereRwee?=20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: mike and gale jett=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 12:18 PM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation Two of you wrote Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the Navajo = Nation >Police Department. He told me that they will not allow any geocaches = on >their lands. If you are caught on their lands without a permit you = can be >arrested. This is just a reminder to please not place any caches on = tribal >lands.=20 The sergeant had a story to tell about a couple of cacher that wee = shot at while looking for a cache. When they reported it to him they = were sited for trespassing and told that if the people wanted to kill = them they would have. I feel the need to defend the Navajo Nation. Some of you may know that = Mike is Navajo born and raised. His family still lives on the = reservation. I lived there for 2 years while working for Indian Health = Service. Lately the tribe has been having a lot of trouble with gangs, a = lot more than you might think. Part of it has to do with the extreme = poverty up there as well as unemployment, alcoholism etc. There has also = been a huge push lately to return to ultra conservative traditional ways = which some older Navajos would like to take as far as cutting out the = outside world. That won't ever happen. There are still many rational = people up there. The upshot is, as long as you treat the Navajo, Hopi, = or any other tribe with great respect, including laws and their privacy, = you will be treated the same. Please don't read all of the above and be = discouraged from visiting the reservations of Arizona. I've done so for = over 20 years, with and without Mike, and have al! ! ways been treated = very well. On a side note, Mike and I have been talking about doing an = event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a homestead ranch in the = Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail = that leads down to his family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always = welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family to = visit. The views are spectacular. Would people be interested? -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* = ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your = setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: = http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C2CEFC.87AEB750 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
My message was not intended as an = attack against=20 the Navajo Nation. The purpose for putting out the information was = to=20 inform our community of their desires. Just like any other property = owner they=20 have an absolute right to regulate what occurs on their lands. During my = conversation with the Sergeant I told him that I would do what I could = to get=20 the message out.
 
Ken
WhereRwee? 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 mike and gale jett =
Sent: Thursday, February 06, = 2003 12:18=20 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo = Nation

Two of you wrote
 
Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the = Navajo=20 Nation
>Police Department. He told me that they will not allow = any=20 geocaches on
>their lands. If you are caught on their lands = without a=20 permit you can be
>arrested. This is just a reminder to please = not place=20 any caches on tribal
>lands.
 
The sergeant had a = story to tell=20 about a couple of cacher that wee shot at while looking for a cache. = When they=20 reported it to him they were sited for trespassing and told that if = the people=20 wanted to kill them they would have.

 

I feel the need to defend the Navajo Nation. = Some of=20 you may know that Mike is Navajo born and raised. His family still = lives on=20 the reservation. I lived there for 2 years while working for Indian = Health=20 Service. Lately the tribe has been having a lot of trouble with gangs, = a lot=20 more than you might think. Part of it has to do with the extreme = poverty up=20 there as well as unemployment, alcoholism etc. There has also been a = huge push=20 lately to return to ultra conservative traditional ways which some = older=20 Navajos would like to take as far as cutting out the outside world. = That won't=20 ever happen. There are still many rational people up there. The upshot = is, as=20 long as you treat the Navajo, Hopi, or any other tribe with great = respect,=20 including laws and their privacy, you will be treated the same. Please = don't=20 read all of the above and be discouraged from visiting the = reservations of=20 Arizona. I've done so for over 20 years, with and without Mike, and = have al! !=20 ways been treated very well. On a side note, Mike and I have been = talking=20 about doing an event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a = homestead=20 ranch in the Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. = There is a=20 trail that leads down to his family's cabin (not a hogan). His family = always=20 welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family = to visit.=20 The views are spectacular. Would people be interested?



STOP MORE SPAM with the new = MSN 8=20 and get 2 months FREE*=20 ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching=20 mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe = or=20 unsubscribe visit:=20 http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's=20 Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com = ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C2CEFC.87AEB750-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 8 16:47:49 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (WOLFB8) Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2003 09:47:49 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] laws References: <001901c2cf37$342a8d30$91f50244@cx301817d> Message-ID: <004501c2cf92$03419640$bfd36844@ph.cox.net> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_003E_01C2CF57.243431E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable you can check out the following laws your self I found them on the net = with a search on federal and state antiquity laws. HOPE THIS HELPS WITH = SOME OF YOUR QUESTION opps cap lock on sorry state http://www.azleg.state.az.us/search/ars.idq?UserRestriction=3Darchaeologi= cal+discoveries&CiScope=3D%2Fars&TemplateName=3Dars&CiSort=3Drank%5Bd%5D&= HTMLQueryForm=3D%2Fars%2Fars.htm 39-125. Information relating to location of archaeological discoveries = and places or objects included or eligible for inclusion on the Arizona = register of historic places; confidentiality Nothing in this chapter requires the disclosure of public records or = other matters in the office of any officer that relate to the location = of archaeological discoveries as described in section 41-841 or 41-844 = or places or objects that are included on or may qualify for inclusion = on the Arizona register of historic places as described in section = 41-511.04, subsection A, paragraph 9. An officer may decline to release = this information if the officer determines that the release of the = information creates a reasonable risk of vandalism, theft or other = damage to the archaeological discoveries or the places or objects that = are included on or may qualify for inclusion on the register. In making = a decision to disclose public records pursuant to this section, an = officer may consult with the director of the Arizona state museum or the = state historic preservation officer. ARS-41- 865 disturbing human remains or funeral objects ARS 13-3702 DEFACING OR DAMAGING PETROGLYPHS, PICTOGRAPHS,CAVE,CAVERNS ARS 41-841 ARCHAEOLOGICAL DISCOVERIES ARS 41-843 PROHIBITING UNNECCARY DEFACING OF SITE OR OBJECT ARS41-844 DUTY TO REPORT DISCOVERIES federal archaeological resources protection act of 1979 16U.S.C. 470aa-470mm http://archnet.asu.edu/archnet/topical/crm/usdocs/arpa79.html We will be known by the tracks we leave behind ------=_NextPart_000_003E_01C2CF57.243431E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

you can check out the following laws your self I = found them=20 on the net with a search on federal and state antiquity laws. HOPE THIS = HELPS=20 WITH SOME OF YOUR QUESTION opps cap lock on sorry

state

http://www.azle= g.state.az.us/search/ars.idq?UserRestriction=3Darchaeological+discoveries= &CiScope=3D%2Fars&TemplateName=3Dars&CiSort=3Drank%5Bd%5D&= ;HTMLQueryForm=3D%2Fars%2Fars.htm

39-125. Information relating=20 to location of archaeological discoveries and places or = objects=20 included or eligible for inclusion on the Arizona register of historic = places;=20 confidentiality

Nothing in this chapter requires the disclosure of public records or = other=20 matters in the office of any officer that relate to the location of=20 archaeological discoveries as described in section 41-841 = or=20 41-844 or places or objects that are included on or may qualify for = inclusion on=20 the Arizona register of historic places as described in section = 41-511.04,=20 subsection A, paragraph 9. An officer may decline to release this = information if=20 the officer determines that the release of the information creates a = reasonable=20 risk of vandalism, theft or other damage to the archaeological=20 discoveries or the places or objects that are included on or may = qualify=20 for inclusion on the register. In making a decision to disclose public = records=20 pursuant to this section, an officer may consult with the director of = the=20 Arizona state museum or the state historic preservation=20 officer.

ARS-41- 865  disturbing human = remains or=20 funeral objects
ARS 13-3702  DEFACING OR = DAMAGING=20 PETROGLYPHS, PICTOGRAPHS,CAVE,CAVERNS
ARS 41-841 ARCHAEOLOGICAL = DISCOVERIES
ARS 41-843 PROHIBITING UNNECCARY = DEFACING OF SITE=20 OR OBJECT
ARS41-844 DUTY TO REPORT = DISCOVERIES
 
federal
archaeological resources protection act = of=20 1979  16U.S.C. 470aa-470mm
ht= tp://archnet.asu.edu/archnet/topical/crm/usdocs/arpa79.html
 
 
We will be known by the tracks we leave behind
------=_NextPart_000_003E_01C2CF57.243431E0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 8 21:58:39 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2003 14:58:39 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] writers cramp and breakfast Message-ID: <005d01c2cfbd$3db2ece0$ba49b83f@fishkiller> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_005A_01C2CF82.906918A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I just posted a few archive this cache for the Superstitions Wilderness = area I would trust that others will join' then Howabout a get together at like a Perkins or the new IHOP if they have a = room and make it a event cache?? ------=_NextPart_000_005A_01C2CF82.906918A0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I just posted a few archive this cache = for the=20 Superstitions Wilderness area I would trust that others will = join'
 
 
 
then
 
Howabout a get together at like a = Perkins or the=20 new IHOP if they have a room and make it a event=20 cache??
------=_NextPart_000_005A_01C2CF82.906918A0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun Feb 9 17:35:35 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 10:35:35 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] writers cramp and breakfast References: <005d01c2cfbd$3db2ece0$ba49b83f@fishkiller> Message-ID: <003e01c2d061$a84fc380$5821b83f@fishkiller> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_003B_01C2D026.FAF52660 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thanks for all your input both public and private but I still think that Perkins on Warner and Az Avenue has the largest = private area of the restaurants I have been to. ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Regan Smith=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 2:58 PM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] writers cramp and breakfast I just posted a few archive this cache for the Superstitions = Wilderness area I would trust that others will join' then Howabout a get together at like a Perkins or the new IHOP if they have = a room and make it a event cache?? ------=_NextPart_000_003B_01C2D026.FAF52660 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thanks for all your input both public = and=20 private
 
but I still think that Perkins on Warner and Az Avenue has the largest private area of = the=20 restaurants I have been to.
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Regan=20 Smith
Sent: Saturday, February 08, = 2003 2:58=20 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] = writers cramp=20 and breakfast

I just posted a few archive this = cache for the=20 Superstitions Wilderness area I would trust that others will=20 join'
 
 
 
then
 
Howabout a get together at like a = Perkins or the=20 new IHOP if they have a room and make it a event=20 cache??
------=_NextPart_000_003B_01C2D026.FAF52660-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun Feb 9 20:29:39 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (mike and gale jett) Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2003 20:29:39 +0000 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation Message-ID:

I never interpreted your message, or Libby's, as an attack against the Navajo Nation. I lived in Chinle at the time Hantavirus was first identified and I remember how the news media warned people to stay away from the reservation. I saw how the few tourists who were there were in a near state of panic over Hantavirus. I just wanted to ensure that people recognize that while the two events listed below occured, most of the visits to the reservation are not unpleasant encounters. My later hot headed tirade was about someone else's comments which I felt were extreme, a personal attack,  and stated in a vitriolic manner.

>From: "Ken"
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To:
>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation
>Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 22:59:12 -0700
>
>My message was not intended as an attack against the Navajo Nation. The purpose for putting out the information was to inform our community of their desires. Just like any other property owner they have an absolute right to regulate what occurs on their lands. During my conversation with the Sergeant I told him that I would do what I could to get the message out.
>
>Ken
>WhereRwee?
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: mike and gale jett
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 12:18 PM
> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Navajo Nation
>
>
> Two of you wrote
>
> Also, I had the opportunity to speak to a Sergeant with the Navajo Nation
> >Police Department. He told me that they will not allow any geocaches on
> >their lands. If you are caught on their lands without a permit you can be
> >arrested. This is just a reminder to please not place any caches on tribal
> >lands.
>
> The sergeant had a story to tell about a couple of cacher that wee shot at while looking for a cache. When they reported it to him they were sited for trespassing and told that if the people wanted to kill them they would have.
>
>
>
> I feel the need to defend the Navajo Nation. Some of you may know that Mike is Navajo born and raised. His family still lives on the reservation. I lived there for 2 years while working for Indian Health Service. Lately the tribe has been having a lot of trouble with gangs, a lot more than you might think. Part of it has to do with the extreme poverty up there as well as unemployment, alcoholism etc. There has also been a huge push lately to return to ultra conservative traditional ways which some older Navajos would like to take as far as cutting out the outside world. That won't ever happen. There are still many rational people up there. The upshot is, as long as you treat the Navajo, Hopi, or any other tribe with great respect, including laws and their privacy, you will be treated the same. Please don't read all of the above and be discouraged from visiting the reservations of Arizona. I've done so for over 20 years, with and without Mike, and have al! ! ways been treated very well. On a side note, Mike and I have been talking about doing an event cache in Canyon de Chelly. His family has a homestead ranch in the Canyon del Muerto branch beyond where the tourists go. There is a trail that leads down to his family's cabin (not a hogan). His family always welcomes guests and permits are not needed for friends of the family to visit. The views are spectacular. Would people be interested?
>
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com

Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun Feb 9 21:31:38 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jason Poulter) Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2003 14:31:38 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] New Garmin Etrex Firmware In-Reply-To: <000601c2cf05$31f74530$c069dd18@OUR> References: <000601c2cf05$31f74530$c069dd18@OUR> Message-ID: <3E46C8BA.9000108@snaptek.com> DANG!!! when they going to do that for the other models like the V and III, etc... jason Team Tierra Buena wrote: > Garmin today announced version 3.10 of the firmware for the Etrex Legend > and Vista models. By installing these upgrades you will get the > following benefits: > > > * Increased active track log to 10,000 points. > * Increased saved track log to 750 points. > * Increased user waypoints to 1,000 waypoints. (!) > * Increased waypoints per route to 125 waypoints. > * Added option on Map Setup page to specify the number of track > points to plot. The most recent points will be plotted up to the > specified number, not exceeding the size of the track log. > * Improved South African grid. > * Corrected problem where MapSource would give an error message > after transferring a large number of map tiles. > > Note that these upgrades are for these two Etrex models only. You can > download the upgrade at: http://www.garmin.com/support/download.jsp > > Steve > Team Tierra Buena From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 10 00:04:32 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Clark Sann) Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 18:04:32 -0600 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] New into geocaching - need advice! Message-ID: <000001c2d097$fdc12d50$b0c956d1@DCY7KJ11> Hello all! My wife and I just discovered geocaching. Can someone suggest a good cache for a newby? Something not too far out of Mesa maybe with some 4-wheeling and hiking! I'm also going to purchase topo maps on CD. I'm considering both MapTech Terrain Navigator and Natl Geographic Topo. Which of these are better? Clark From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 10 01:22:12 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 17:22:12 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] George Freestone (1898-2003), world's oldest Boy Scout, dies Message-ID: <2490106.1044840132458.JavaMail.root@localhost> ------=_Part_15_3932167.1044840132453 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: INLINE *Please note, the sender's email address has not been verified. George E. Freestone, considered the world's oldest living Boy Scout, died Saturday at age 104. You can honor the memory of Mr. Freestone by visiting the exhibit dedicated to him at my virtual geocache, Gilbert Historical Museum. Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer) ******************** If you are having trouble with any of the links in this message, or if the URL's are not appearing as links, please follow the instructions at the bottom of this email. Title: World's oldest Boy Scout dies Copy and paste the following into your Web browser to access the sent link: http://www.emailthis.clickability.com/et/emailThis?clickMap=viewThis&etMailToID=1932132289&pt=Y Copy and paste the following into your Web browser to SAVE THIS link: http://www.savethis.clickability.com/st/saveThisPopupApp?clickMap=saveFromET&partnerID=940&etMailToID=1932132289&pt=Y Copy and paste the following into your Web browser to forward this link: http://www.emailthis.clickability.com/et/emailThis?clickMap=forward&etMailToID=1932132289&partnerID=940&pt=Y ******************** Email pages from any Web site you visit - add the EMAIL THIS button to your browser, copy and paste the following into your Web browser: http://www.emailthis.clickability.com/et/emailThis?clickMap=browserButtons&pt=Y" ********************* Instructions: ----------------------------------------- If your e-mail program doesn't recognize Web addresses: 1. With your mouse, highlight the Web Address above. Be sure to highlight the entire Web address, even if it spans more than one line in your email. 2. Select Copy from the Edit menu at the top of your screen. 3. Launch your Web browser. 4. Paste the address into your Web browser by selecting Paste from the Edit menu. 5. Click Go or press Enter or Return on your keyboard. ******************** ------=_Part_15_3932167.1044840132453 Content-Type: text/html Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: INLINE EMAIL THIS Email
 
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George E. Freestone, considered the world's oldest living Boy Scout, died Saturday at age 104. You can honor the memory of Mr. Freestone by visiting the exhibit dedicated to him at my virtual geocache, Gilbert Historical Museum.

Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)

  
   
   
  Click the following to access the sent link:
   
 
World's oldest Boy Scout dies*
     
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http://www.arizonarepublic.com/arizona/articles/0209life-freestone09.html

------=_Part_15_3932167.1044840132453-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 10 02:26:05 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson) Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 19:26:05 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] George Freestone (1898-2003), world's oldest Boy Scout, dies In-Reply-To: <2490106.1044840132458.JavaMail.root@localhost> Message-ID: <014601c2d0ab$c37adfb0$697ba8c0@speedy> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0147_01C2D071.171C07B0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thanks Ken. I hadn't seen this yet. Perhaps it will be the subject of my next Scoutmaster's Minute. Maybe I can even get my scouts down to the exhibit and pick up your virtual at the same time. I love dual purpose trips! CacheLess Bill Tomlinson -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Ken@Highpointer.com Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 6:22 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: [Az-Geocaching] George Freestone (1898-2003), world's oldest Boy Scout, dies ------=_NextPart_000_0147_01C2D071.171C07B0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
Thanks Ken.  I hadn't seen = this=20 yet.  Perhaps it will be the subject of my next Scoutmaster's = Minute. =20 Maybe I can even get my scouts down to the exhibit and pick up your = virtual at=20 the same time.  I love dual purpose trips!
 
CacheLess
Bill Tomlinson
-----Original Message-----
From:=20 az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20 [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of = Ken@Highpointer.com
Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 6:22 = PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: = [Az-Geocaching]=20 George Freestone (1898-2003), world's oldest Boy Scout,=20 dies
------=_NextPart_000_0147_01C2D071.171C07B0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 10 02:29:19 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jim Stamm) Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2003 19:29:19 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Century Mark Message-ID: <0HA200L2MMWEJR@mtaout07.icomcast.net> Congratulations to Wily Javelina for hitting the Century Mark! And a special thanks to Wily Javelina for making my Buster Springs Cache the 100th. >I decided to make this cache my century find, I am glad I did. A very >interesting location, I would sure like to know more about the history of >this area. Part of the land that Catalina State Park stands on was once the homestead ranch belonging to Francisco (I think) Romero. The Apaches kept picking off his livestock, until he finally abandoned the property and moved into town. Years later his son moved to the old homestead and began ranching it again. There are still remnants of the homestead and other buildings in the Park. At one time the park staff (with the help of Boy Scouts) attempted to remove the fence that was erected on the section lines. The country was too rough for them to get it all, and there remain a few remnants of that also; Including a few places where the old fence material was deposited for later pickup, which hasn't happened yet. My fascination with the springs began when I realized that all other springs that I had visited in the state had trails or roads leading to and from them. I wanted to find the trail to Buster Springs that didn't show on any map. The rangers told me that there weren't any because "Old Man Romero" ran a still at the springs, and he was careful not to leave any trails when going up there. If one looks carefully, one can find traces of a trace up the mountain. If one looks VERY carefully, one can find traces of the local history all over Catalina State Park. -Jim From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 10 03:53:16 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (GREGG OBUCH) Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 19:53:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] New into geocaching - need advice! In-Reply-To: <000001c2d097$fdc12d50$b0c956d1@DCY7KJ11> Message-ID: <20030210035316.20013.qmail@web80210.mail.yahoo.com> --0-1668944326-1044849196=:18995 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Clark, welcome to the adventure of geocaching. Since I'm from Tucson can't help you much on the caches around Mesa, but I'm sure someone will be along shortly who can. As for the mapping software, I have the National Geographic Arizona CDs and really like them. You may want to go to www.geocaching.com and checking out their discussion forums on mapping software. There are several map topics to review and you will certainly get a good idea or two. Gregg (GO of MO & GO) Clark Sann wrote:Hello all! My wife and I just discovered geocaching. Can someone suggest a good cache for a newby? Something not too far out of Mesa maybe with some 4-wheeling and hiking! I'm also going to purchase topo maps on CD. I'm considering both MapTech Terrain Navigator and Natl Geographic Topo. Which of these are better? Clark ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com --0-1668944326-1044849196=:18995 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

Clark, welcome to the adventure of geocaching.  Since I'm from Tucson can't help you much on the caches around Mesa, but I'm sure someone will be along shortly who can.

As for the mapping software, I have the National Geographic Arizona CDs and really like them.  You may want to go to www.geocaching.com and checking out their discussion forums on mapping software.  There are several map topics to review and you will certainly get a good idea or two.

Gregg  (GO of MO & GO)

 Clark Sann <csann@earthlink.net> wrote:

Hello all!

My wife and I just discovered geocaching. Can someone suggest a good
cache for a newby? Something not too far out of Mesa maybe with some
4-wheeling and hiking!

I'm also going to purchase topo maps on CD. I'm considering both
MapTech Terrain Navigator and Natl Geographic Topo. Which of these are
better?

Clark

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com
--0-1668944326-1044849196=:18995-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 10 03:58:08 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jim Scotti) Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 20:58:08 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Century Mark In-Reply-To: <0HA200L2MMWEJR@mtaout07.icomcast.net> Message-ID: Yeah, I know you Phoenix guys think 100 caches is a productive weekend up there, but I'd also like to congratulate Wily Javelina on their 100th geocache. They have only been geocaching since last November and have also placed 17 geocaches to go along with their first 100 finds. Way to go! Jim. Jim Scotti Lunar & Planetary Laboratory University of Arizona Tucson, AZ 85721 USA http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/~jscotti/ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 10 13:54:27 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 06:54:27 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] New into geocaching - need advice! References: <000001c2d097$fdc12d50$b0c956d1@DCY7KJ11> Message-ID: <002e01c2d10b$ee245880$7e10b83f@fishkiller> Um 4 wheeling and hiking that would be any cache by the Great team of Wyle E, um I know names real good not the GC numbers so names of some of the good caches Mission Looney Tunes, bit if a tougher puzzle type cache but is worth the trip Free Ammo Can, Great instructions on the Gate pass for the Bulldog canyon area Grampa Abes Hideaway, a nice short hike but well worth the view from the cache and top of hill Geocache, one of Arizona oldest caches Blue Ridge, pretty much all hiking again views are worth it for some good starter caches to help hone your searching skills Nearly in Harmony FRED visits Dana Ranch Friends Again a puzzle cache but the answer is at the bottom :) alright those caches are OURS :) Ye ol Boggin Trail Point of View both of these caches are located pretty much right on with what the GPS says Highline Flower Power Camelback View Pressed ham Hidden Valley Go Bucks That should get ya started Happy Hunting I really like my Delorme 3D Topoquads ver 2.0 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Clark Sann" To: Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 5:04 PM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] New into geocaching - need advice! > Hello all! > > My wife and I just discovered geocaching. Can someone suggest a good > cache for a newby? Something not too far out of Mesa maybe with some > 4-wheeling and hiking! > > I'm also going to purchase topo maps on CD. I'm considering both > MapTech Terrain Navigator and Natl Geographic Topo. Which of these are > better? > > Clark > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 10 14:51:21 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ford, Denny) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 07:51:21 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] New into geocaching - need advice! Message-ID: There are a number of good hiking ones in South Mountain Park, There are also some on 60 east past silly mountain that have some fourwheeling involved, or at least high clearance. Martinez Canyon Cache is one of the neatest places I have seen, and it is a good little four wheel drive trip. -----Original Message----- From: GREGG OBUCH [mailto:gobuch@prodigy.net] Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 8:53 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] New into geocaching - need advice! Clark, welcome to the adventure of geocaching. Since I'm from Tucson can't help you much on the caches around Mesa, but I'm sure someone will be along shortly who can. As for the mapping software, I have the National Geographic Arizona CDs and really like them. You may want to go to www.geocaching.com and checking out their discussion forums on mapping software. There are several map topics to review and you will certainly get a good idea or two. Gregg (GO of MO & GO) Clark Sann wrote: Hello all! My wife and I just discovered geocaching. Can someone suggest a good cache for a newby? Something not too far out of Mesa maybe with some 4-wheeling and hiking! I'm also going to purchase topo maps on CD. I'm considering both MapTech Terrain Navigator and Natl Geographic Topo. Which of these are better? Clark ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 10 16:30:32 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mike Ingoglia) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 09:30:32 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] New Garmin Etrex Firmware References: <000601c2cf05$31f74530$c069dd18@OUR> <3E46C8BA.9000108@snaptek.com> Message-ID: <1c4601c2d121$bb69bc30$cf98a8c0@Mike> Us Vista/Legend owners are a lot cooler than V and III owners. We're. . . shall we say... P O W E R U S E R S Sorry. :-) :-) :-) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jason Poulter" To: Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 2:31 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] New Garmin Etrex Firmware > DANG!!! when they going to do that for the other models like the V and > III, etc... > > jason > > Team Tierra Buena wrote: > > Garmin today announced version 3.10 of the firmware for the Etrex Legend > > and Vista models. By installing these upgrades you will get the > > following benefits: > > > > > > * Increased active track log to 10,000 points. > > * Increased saved track log to 750 points. > > * Increased user waypoints to 1,000 waypoints. (!) > > * Increased waypoints per route to 125 waypoints. > > * Added option on Map Setup page to specify the number of track > > points to plot. The most recent points will be plotted up to the > > specified number, not exceeding the size of the track log. > > * Improved South African grid. > > * Corrected problem where MapSource would give an error message > > after transferring a large number of map tiles. > > > > Note that these upgrades are for these two Etrex models only. You can > > download the upgrade at: http://www.garmin.com/support/download.jsp > > > > Steve > > Team Tierra Buena > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 10 19:09:01 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 12:09:01 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] New into geocaching - need advice! Message-ID: ------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C2D0FD.32CA0980 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello Clark, I just wanted to welcome you to geocaching. You're at the right place fo= r information - unfortunately I can't help you on the 4 wheeling informat= ion that you want. Regarding the "ye' ol' Boggin' Trail" cache that Rega= n listed below - it is no longer active. The cache was stolen on Feb 7th= of 8th. Rand (RandMan) ----- Original Message ----- From: Regan Smith Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 8:12 AM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] New into geocaching - need advice! . . . . =20 . . . . for some good starter caches to help hone your searching skills Nearly in Harmony FRED visits Dana Ranch Friends Again a puzzle cache but the answer is at the bottom :) alright those caches are OURS :) Ye ol Boggin Trail Point of View both of these caches are located pretty much right on wit= h what the GPS says Highline Flower Power Camelback View Pressed ham Hidden Valley Go Bucks . . . . =20 ------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C2D0FD.32CA0980 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hello Clark,
 
I just wanted to welcome you to geocaching.&n= bsp; You're at the right place for information - unfortunately I can't he= lp you on the 4 wheeling information that you want.  Regarding the "= ye' ol' Boggin' Trail" cache that Regan listed below - it is no longer ac= tive.  The cache was stolen on Feb 7th of 8th.
 
Rand (RandMan)
 
----- Orig= inal Message -----
From: Regan Smith
Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 8:12 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] New into geocachin= g - need advice!
 
. . . .
 <= /DIV>
. . . . for some good starter caches to help hone your searching= skills

Nearly in Harmony
FRED visits Dana Ranch
Friends Aga= in a puzzle cache but the answer is at the bottom :)

alright those= caches are OURS :)

Ye ol Boggin Trail
Point of View&nbs= p;  both of these caches are located pretty much right on with
wh= at the GPS says

Highline Flower Power
Camelback View
Pressed= ham
Hidden Valley
Go Bucks . . . .





------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C2D0FD.32CA0980-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 10 19:25:58 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (WOLFB8) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 12:25:58 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] BAD BAd Bad bad Legislature announced its proposed budgets References: Message-ID: <006401c2d13a$448b8da0$bfd36844@ph.cox.net> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0061_01C2D0FF.9111DCA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable To supporters of State Parks: This week the Legislature announced its proposed budgets for the = remainder of the 2003 fiscal year and the 2004 fiscal year. These budgets included taking $20 million for the Heritage Fund for 2003 = and $10 million for 2004 for a total of a $30 million dollar hit to the = Heritage Fund. For fiscal year 2002 the Heritage Fund only received $17.5 million. As soon as the Game & Fish and State Parks departments release = information as what affect this will have on their programs our web site at www.arizonaheritagealliance.org will be updated. However we already know that this will result in the closure of a number = of State Parks, the end of many educational and other programs, the loss = of matching Federal funds and heightened threats to our wildlife and other resources. We need you help on Monday & Tuesday! Please call or email your legislators and ask your members to call their legislators and request that the Heritage Fund not be swept into the = General Fund. The loss of this program will not only damage our State's resources but = its loss will cause additional damage to our current economy. To contact your Representatives or find your Legislator's name please click the link below http://www.azleg.state.az.us/MemberRoster.asp Please forgive me if you receive this message more than once. Suzanne Pfister - State Parks Board Chairman We will be known by the tracks we leave behind ------=_NextPart_000_0061_01C2D0FF.9111DCA0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
To supporters of State Parks:
This week the = Legislature=20 announced its proposed budgets for the remainder
of the 2003 fiscal = year and=20 the 2004 fiscal year.

These budgets included taking $20 million = for the=20 Heritage Fund for 2003 and
$10 million for 2004 for a total of a $30 = million=20 dollar hit to the Heritage
Fund.

For fiscal year 2002 the = Heritage=20 Fund only received $17.5 million.
As soon as the Game & Fish and = State=20 Parks departments release information
as what affect this will have = on their=20 programs our web site at
www.arizonaheritageallian= ce.org=20 will be updated.


However we already know that this will = result in the=20 closure of a number of
State Parks,  the end of many educational = and=20 other programs, the loss of
matching Federal funds and heightened = threats to=20 our wildlife and other
resources.


We need you help on = Monday &=20 Tuesday!

Please call or email your legislators and ask your = members to=20 call their
legislators and request that the Heritage Fund not be = swept into=20 the General
Fund.


The loss of this program will not only = damage=20 our State's resources but its
loss will cause additional damage to = our=20 current economy.


To contact your Representatives or find your = Legislator's name
please click the link below

http://www.azleg.s= tate.az.us/MemberRoster.asp

Please=20 forgive me if you receive this message more than once.  = Suzanne
Pfister=20 - State Parks Board Chairman

We will be known by the tracks we leave behind
------=_NextPart_000_0061_01C2D0FF.9111DCA0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 11 16:27:05 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Marc) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 09:27:05 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Congrats to Lazy K Message-ID: <3E492459.6030302@uccinc.net> Congrats to Lazy K on his 400+ find! - You are my hero... - Tamo From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 12 03:09:08 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 20:09:08 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Probable Moratorium on New Locationless Caches Message-ID: <001b01c2d244$1cb861d0$c069dd18@OUR> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001C_01C2D209.705989D0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit There's a Groundspeak forum thread in which Jeremy is polling the willingness of the readership to temporarily suspend the approval of new locationless caches (http://tinyurl.com/5mra). The logic behind it is that the approvers are becoming overloaded with trying to figure out if the new locationless caches meet the (sometimes nebulous) guidelines. When the new ".NET" version of the Web site is released in April or May, locationless caches will be moved into their own category, much as benchmarks are today. If they do this, it will mean only that there will be no new locationless caches approved until the new version of the Web site is rolled out. Currently, 86% of the respondents (including me) favor the moratorium. So if you were planning to author a locationless, don't be surprised if it gets rejected for the time being. Steve Team Tierra Buena ------=_NextPart_000_001C_01C2D209.705989D0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
There's a=20 Groundspeak forum thread in which Jeremy is polling the willingness of = the=20 readership to temporarily suspend the approval of new locationless = caches (http://tinyurl.com/5mra). The logic = behind it=20 is that the approvers are becoming overloaded with trying to figure out = if the=20 new locationless caches meet the (sometimes nebulous) guidelines. When = the new=20 ".NET" version of the Web site is released in April or May, locationless = caches=20 will be moved into their own category, much as benchmarks are=20 today.
 
If = they do this,=20 it will mean only that there will be no new locationless caches approved = until=20 the new version of the Web site is rolled out. Currently, 86% of the = respondents=20 (including me) favor the moratorium. So if you were planning to author a = locationless, don't be surprised if it gets rejected for the time=20 being.
 
Steve
Team = Tierra=20 Buena
------=_NextPart_000_001C_01C2D209.705989D0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 12 06:06:41 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Nicol) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 22:06:41 -0800 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Probable Moratorium on New Locationless Caches Message-ID: YEHAW! Down with locationless caches! :) :) :) I am with the huge majority on this one (I have read the forums and most all seem to favor a seperate category. I do beleive that there is a place for locationless caching.. however, I have always said it should be in it's own category... just like benchmarks. I have logged only ONE locationess cache... ever. That was way back when I first started geocaching. I didn't like the 'feel' of it. It just isnt geocaching. Geocaching is when the GPS takes you to a location... whether it be for a virtual or an actual container (I of course dont care for virtuals, but as long as the GPS takes you there.. I don't particularly have a problem with them. Heck, I have visited some really interesting virtuals and have learned alot about Arizona history and other history from them). Logging a locationless is like creating your own cache. You choose the location and post the coordinates. That is not geocaching. Where is the navigation, the use of the GPS to get you there, the hunt? I am pleased to see that geocaching.com is finally going to remove locationless caches from the system. Of course, It will not change my numbers any, cuz' I have only logged one! :) HA! Scott Team RTW _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 12 13:31:53 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 06:31:53 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Probable Moratorium on New Locationless Caches References: Message-ID: <002901c2d29b$1c08d560$8410b83f@fishkiller> that 1 cache will matter when Team Evil Fish passes you into the #1 spot :) and as you attempt to pass CHUMP to #2 :):):):) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Nicol" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 11:06 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Probable Moratorium on New Locationless Caches > > YEHAW! Down with locationless caches! :) :) :) > > I am with the huge majority on this one (I have read the forums and most all > seem to favor a seperate category. > > I do beleive that there is a place for locationless caching.. however, I > have always said it should be in it's own category... just like benchmarks. > > I have logged only ONE locationess cache... ever. That was way back when I > first started geocaching. I didn't like the 'feel' of it. It just isnt > geocaching. Geocaching is when the GPS takes you to a location... whether it > be for a virtual or an actual container (I of course dont care for virtuals, > but as long as the GPS takes you there.. I don't particularly have a problem > with them. Heck, I have visited some really interesting virtuals and have > learned alot about Arizona history and other history from them). Logging a > locationless is like creating your own cache. You choose the location and > post the coordinates. That is not geocaching. Where is the navigation, the > use of the GPS to get you there, the hunt? > > I am pleased to see that geocaching.com is finally going to remove > locationless caches from the system. > > Of course, It will not change my numbers any, cuz' I have only logged one! > :) HA! > > Scott > Team RTW > > _________________________________________________________________ > MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 12 19:51:25 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (mike and gale jett) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 19:51:25 +0000 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache goodies Message-ID:
We are planning 2 difficult regular caches and we would like to stock them with proper reward goodies. We'd like to know what kinds of things people like and don't like to find in regular caches. Keep in mind budget restraints. We can't place gift certificates for vacation getaways.

MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*. From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 12 20:10:03 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Ayre) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 13:10:03 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache goodies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C2D298.0E0D9BB0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Tennis balls for our dogs!! :) Andy -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of mike and gale jett Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 12:51 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache goodies We are planning 2 difficult regular caches and we would like to stock them with proper reward goodies. We'd like to know what kinds of things people like and don't like to find in regular caches. Keep in mind budget restraints. We can't place gift certificates for vacation getaways. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*. ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C2D298.0E0D9BB0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Tennis=20 balls for our dogs!! :)
 

Andy

 

-----Original Message-----
From:=20 az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20 [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of = mike=20 and gale jett
Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 12:51=20 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: = [Az-Geocaching]=20 Cache goodies

We are planning 2 difficult regular caches and we would like to = stock=20 them with proper reward goodies. We'd like to know what kinds of = things people=20 like and don't like to find in regular caches. Keep in mind budget = restraints.=20 We can't place gift certificates for vacation getaways.

MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE = E-MAIL VIRUSES.=20 Get 2 months FREE*.=20 ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching=20 mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe = or=20 unsubscribe visit:=20 http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's=20 Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com =
------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C2D298.0E0D9BB0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 12 21:04:17 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Chelby Geiss) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 14:04:17 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache goodies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <8CA21F52-3ECD-11D7-A5E2-000393545682@desertsol.com> Batteries are always a winner! I have taken advantage of batteries in a cache once, but have read countless logs of people who were quite thankful to find batteries! Geocaching.com goodies are fun to find, plus it supports the site. When putting together a cache or filling up my hiking pack with trade goodies, I like perusing the endcaps by the checkout stands at REI...fun outdoors-y trinkets. My favorite goodie I took from a cache was a purple anodized lizard keychain (probably from someplace like this). I carry it everywhere, reminds me that I made it to the top of Camelback without dying! Team desertSol Chelby & Kevin + Kiva and Lancer (German Shepherds) Apache Junction, AZ www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 12 21:20:47 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ben Dilcher) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 14:20:47 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache goodies Message-ID: ------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C2D2A1.EFE7AAE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable AZUC left a plastic cup in a cache named froggy located close to Yarnell = area and the person that found has made it their lucky cup when playing d= ice games with friends. Read the log for Froggy and see. I could not be= leive that a cheap little plastic cup could be such a good find. I think= everything is a good find as long as it is not broken "Mc toys". Oh mos= t don't like to see candy or foods in caches. Have fun and good luck. I find a lot of stuff at dollar sales or swap me= ets. ----- Original Message ----- From: mike and gale jett Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 1:09 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache goodies We are planning 2 difficult regular caches and we would like to stock the= m with proper reward goodies. We'd like to know what kinds of things peop= le like and don't like to find in regular caches. Keep in mind budget res= traints. We can't place gift certificates for vacation getaways. MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*. _______________= _____________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list = listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe = visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Ar= izona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com =20 ------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C2D2A1.EFE7AAE0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
AZUC left a pl= astic cup in a cache named froggy located close to Yarnell area and the p= erson that found has made it their lucky cup when playing dice games with= friends.  Read the log for Froggy and see.  I could not beleiv= e that a cheap little plastic cup could be such a good find.  I thin= k everything is a good find as long as it is not broken "Mc toys".  = Oh most don't like to see candy or foods in caches.
 
Have fun and good luck.  I find a lot of stuff at dollar sal= es or swap meets.
 
----- Original = Message -----
From: mike and gale jett
Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 1:09 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache goodies=
 
We are planning 2 difficult regular c= aches and we would like to stock them with proper reward goodies. We'd li= ke to know what kinds of things people like and don't like to find in reg= ular caches. Keep in mind budget restraints. We can't place gift certific= ates for vacation getaways.

MSN 8 helps = ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. = Get 2 months FREE*. _____________________________________________________= _______ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your= setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.co= m/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www= .azgeocaching.com
------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C2D2A1.EFE7AAE0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 12 21:41:05 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 14:41:05 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache goodies In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E4ABF71.6040407@snaptek.com> mike and gale jett wrote: > We can't place gift certificates for vacation getaways. Sure you could.... they would just have to say, "All you have to is sit though our 90 minute presentation on our ''vacation ownership''" Vaction ownership of course is a euphemism for time share, of course if you mention time share you will be corrected, this isn't a time share is a vacation ownership... or whatever they are calling it this year :) Anyway, I'm supprised that someone hasn't been going around putting coupons like that into caches already, and getting paid to do it :) Watch, someone will make the "free florida vacation cache" hehehe Brian Cluff Team Snaptek From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 12 21:43:26 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mike Ingoglia) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 14:43:26 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache goodies References: Message-ID: <111501c2d2df$c61f5f80$64d79ea8@Mike> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_1112_01C2D2A5.19AD74B0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Don't get me going on candy and food in caches... :-) ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Ben Dilcher=20 To: Azgaocaching=20 Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 2:20 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache goodies AZUC left a plastic cup in a cache named froggy located close to = Yarnell area and the person that found has made it their lucky cup when = playing dice games with friends. Read the log for Froggy and see. I = could not beleive that a cheap little plastic cup could be such a good = find. I think everything is a good find as long as it is not broken "Mc = toys". Oh most don't like to see candy or foods in caches. Have fun and good luck. I find a lot of stuff at dollar sales or swap = meets. ----- Original Message ----- From: mike and gale jett Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 1:09 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache goodies We are planning 2 difficult regular caches and we would like to = stock them with proper reward goodies. We'd like to know what kinds of = things people like and don't like to find in regular caches. Keep in = mind budget restraints. We can't place gift certificates for vacation = getaways. -------------------------------------------------------------------------= --- MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*. = ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your = setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: = http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com ------=_NextPart_000_1112_01C2D2A5.19AD74B0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Don't get me going on candy and food in = caches...=20 :-)
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Ben = Dilcher=20
Sent: Wednesday, February 12, = 2003 2:20=20 PM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] = Cache=20 goodies

AZUC left a plastic cup in a cache named froggy located close to = Yarnell=20 area and the person that found has made it their lucky cup when = playing dice=20 games with friends.  Read the log for Froggy and see.  I = could not=20 beleive that a cheap little plastic cup could be such a good = find.  I=20 think everything is a good find as long as it is not broken "Mc = toys". =20 Oh most don't like to see candy or foods in caches.
 
Have fun and good luck.  I find a lot of stuff at dollar = sales or=20 swap meets.
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 mike and gale jett
Sent: Wednesday, February 12, = 2003 1:09=20 PM
To: = listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] = Cache=20 goodies
 
We are planning 2 difficult regular caches and we would like to = stock=20 them with proper reward goodies. We'd like to know what kinds of = things=20 people like and don't like to find in regular caches. Keep in mind = budget=20 restraints. We can't place gift certificates for vacation=20 getaways.

MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE = E-MAIL=20 VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*.=20 ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching=20 mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, = subscribe or=20 unsubscribe visit:=20 http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's=20 Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com=20 ------=_NextPart_000_1112_01C2D2A5.19AD74B0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 12 21:50:57 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 14:50:57 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache goodies In-Reply-To: <3E4ABF71.6040407@snaptek.com> Message-ID: <003801c2d2e0$d3a4b7d0$c069dd18@OUR> > Anyway, I'm supprised that someone hasn't been going around putting > coupons like that into caches already, and getting paid to do it Unlike spam, that would require money, effort, and enough brains to be able to FIND caches. So it isn't likely to happen, thank goodness. Steve Team Tierra Buena From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 12 22:00:51 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mike Ingoglia) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 15:00:51 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache goodies References: <003801c2d2e0$d3a4b7d0$c069dd18@OUR> Message-ID: <115501c2d2e2$353e1c60$64d79ea8@Mike> It's not "spam", it's unsolicited bulk email. :-) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Team Tierra Buena" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 2:50 PM Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache goodies > > Anyway, I'm supprised that someone hasn't been going around putting > > coupons like that into caches already, and getting paid to do it > > Unlike spam, that would require money, effort, and enough brains to be > able to FIND caches. So it isn't likely to happen, thank goodness. > > Steve > Team Tierra Buena > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 13 01:06:16 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 18:06:16 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache goodies References: Message-ID: <002901c2d2fc$1d644fa0$9430b83f@fishkiller> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0026_01C2D2C1.6FF14880 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Um Greenbacks and .99 cent store then their is always the Party = place.... low cost and nice ----- Original Message -----=20 From: mike and gale jett=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 12:51 PM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache goodies We are planning 2 difficult regular caches and we would like to stock = them with proper reward goodies. We'd like to know what kinds of things = people like and don't like to find in regular caches. Keep in mind = budget restraints. We can't place gift certificates for vacation = getaways. -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*. = ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your = setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: = http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com ------=_NextPart_000_0026_01C2D2C1.6FF14880 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Um Greenbacks and .99 cent store  = then their=20 is always the Party place.... low cost and nice
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 mike and gale jett =
Sent: Wednesday, February 12, = 2003 12:51=20 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache=20 goodies

We are planning 2 difficult regular caches and we would like to = stock=20 them with proper reward goodies. We'd like to know what kinds of = things people=20 like and don't like to find in regular caches. Keep in mind budget = restraints.=20 We can't place gift certificates for vacation getaways.

MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE = E-MAIL VIRUSES.=20 Get 2 months FREE*.=20 ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching=20 mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe = or=20 unsubscribe visit:=20 http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's=20 Geocaching Resource = http://www.azgeocaching.com ------=_NextPart_000_0026_01C2D2C1.6FF14880-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 13 07:23:32 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 00:23:32 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Century Mark In-Reply-To: <0HA200L2MMWEJR@mtaout07.icomcast.net> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030213002307.01bdadd8@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 07:29 PM 2/9/2003 -0700, you wrote: >Congratulations to Wily Javelina for hitting the Century Mark! And a >special thanks to Wily Javelina for making my Buster Springs Cache the >100th. I'm always glad to see another Tucson geocacher reach 100. Welcome to the club Wily. In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 13 07:17:16 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 00:17:16 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] What would you do? In-Reply-To: <3E3FAAD2.CB0FDDB8@usa.net> References: <1073.206.228.113.56.1044339301.squirrel@www.myblueheaven.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030213001545.01bc7668@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 04:58 AM 2/4/2003 -0700, you wrote: >We got the same answer from Eric yesterday. We emailed a response to him >showing how each requirement from the rules page was met (a link to the rules >page should be in the email you received). The cache was approved shortly >after. Sorry for the delay in getting back to you, but I just got back to Tucson tonight after about 3 weeks in Idaho. It wasn't quite that easy. It took a few e-mails back and forth but I finally got it approved. I was told that the admin was just going to have to trust me about the cache and he still seemed somewhat hesitant to approve it. So far, all of the logs have been very favorable, and some of the private e-mail shows that people have really liked the cache. In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 13 07:18:07 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 00:18:07 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] What would you do? In-Reply-To: <02a701c2cc69$9b3bb8d0$cf98a8c0@Mike> References: <1073.206.228.113.56.1044339301.squirrel@www.myblueheaven.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030213001748.01bd02c0@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 09:22 AM 2/4/2003 -0700, you wrote: >Obviously moun10bike doesn't find the area interesting so (assuming of >course that your cache follows the rules) it appears it's his belief that if >he doesn't find the area interesting then no one will. This is >unfortunate... kind of like he's the geocache-Nazi. That is sort of where I thought it was going also, but he finally did approve the cache. In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 13 13:59:38 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 06:59:38 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Century Mark References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030213002307.01bdadd8@mail.myblueheaven.com> Message-ID: <003401c2d368$26a4f6c0$1310b83f@fishkiller> there is a nother Tucson cacher with the most finds so far for the month of Feb..... I still think that the daily record will be broken in Tucson :) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Wood" To: Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2003 12:23 AM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Century Mark > At 07:29 PM 2/9/2003 -0700, you wrote: > >Congratulations to Wily Javelina for hitting the Century Mark! And a > >special thanks to Wily Javelina for making my Buster Springs Cache the > >100th. > > I'm always glad to see another Tucson geocacher reach 100. Welcome to the > club Wily. > > > In liberty, > > Scott > > wood@myblueheaven.com > www.myblueheaven.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 13 16:28:27 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 11:28:27 -0500 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] cache trinkets Message-ID: <11838455.2F7D9352.00191F29@aol.com> Chelby & Kevin, Your comment about the lizard keychain made my morning..! :) I have a few cache trinkets found over the years that have a bit of special meaning behind them as well.. And, yes, I did find those at REI.. or was it Popular? I'm glad that you enjoyed the climb! -n4/c- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 14 19:04:19 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 11:04:19 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test Message-ID: <20030214110419.13346.h009.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> This is a test....the list servd has either 1) been Werry Werry Quiet...Shhhh!; or 2) something is wrong on my end or it's end and I am not getting any messages....jsut curious. I'm used to getting art least several messages a day from the list. Trisha "Lightning" Prescott Happy Valentine's Day everyone! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 14 19:12:16 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mike Ingoglia) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 12:12:16 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test References: <20030214110419.13346.h009.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Message-ID: <008601c2d45c$fd161dc0$cf98a8c0@Mike> Say something political or religious.... it should get the list going again. :-) 2 issues that always get people (in general) stirred up. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, February 14, 2003 12:04 PM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test > This is a test....the list servd has either 1) been Werry Werry > Quiet...Shhhh!; or 2) something is wrong on my end or it's end and I > am not getting any messages....jsut curious. I'm used to getting art > least several messages a day from the list. > > Trisha "Lightning" > Prescott > > Happy Valentine's Day everyone! > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > "Although no one can go back and > make a brand new start, > Anyone can start from now and > make a brand new ending." > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 14 19:16:28 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 12:16:28 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test In-Reply-To: <20030214110419.13346.h009.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.critica lpath.net> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030214121538.0297c910@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 11:04 AM 2/14/2003 -0800, you wrote: >This is a test....the list servd has either 1) been Werry Werry >Quiet...Shhhh!; or 2) something is wrong on my end or it's end and I >am not getting any messages....jsut curious. I'm used to getting art >least several messages a day from the list. I was wondering the same thing, but thought it might be because I just returned to Arizona after 3 weeks in Idaho. You know, one of those "be quiet, Scott's back." :-) In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 14 19:19:44 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 12:19:44 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test References: <20030214110419.13346.h009.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Message-ID: <000901c2d45e$095b7c00$0410b83f@fishkiller> I have noticed that as well, I was just commenting that I have been talking to myself :) oh well must go and find our 200th cache just 1000 more to go ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, February 14, 2003 12:04 PM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test > This is a test....the list servd has either 1) been Werry Werry > Quiet...Shhhh!; or 2) something is wrong on my end or it's end and I > am not getting any messages....jsut curious. I'm used to getting art > least several messages a day from the list. > > Trisha "Lightning" > Prescott > > Happy Valentine's Day everyone! > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > "Although no one can go back and > make a brand new start, > Anyone can start from now and > make a brand new ending." > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 14 19:21:02 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Coyote1022) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 12:21:02 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test In-Reply-To: <20030214110419.13346.h009.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Message-ID: Valentines Day and the newly wed is on the internet! Hmmmmmmmm...................................... Everyone else is obviously doing something else on this day! :-) -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of trisha@brasher.com Sent: Friday, February 14, 2003 12:04 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test This is a test....the list servd has either 1) been Werry Werry Quiet...Shhhh!; or 2) something is wrong on my end or it's end and I am not getting any messages....jsut curious. I'm used to getting art least several messages a day from the list. Trisha "Lightning" Prescott Happy Valentine's Day everyone! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 14 19:24:50 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 12:24:50 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test In-Reply-To: <008601c2d45c$fd161dc0$cf98a8c0@Mike> References: <20030214110419.13346.h009.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030214122248.029848e0@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 12:12 PM 2/14/2003 -0700, you wrote: >Say something political or religious.... it should get the list going again. >:-) 2 issues that always get people (in general) stirred up. When I was back in Idaho there was a letter to the editor that claims that god was a republican and Jesus would own a AK-47 if he were here today. I kid you not. How is that for politics and religion. :-) In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 14 19:32:42 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 12:32:42 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test References: <20030214110419.13346.h009.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> <5.1.0.14.2.20030214122248.029848e0@mail.myblueheaven.com> Message-ID: <001701c2d45f$d8a26c20$0410b83f@fishkiller> Really I would have thought about an American AR-15 Hummmmmmm ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Wood" To: Sent: Friday, February 14, 2003 12:24 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test > At 12:12 PM 2/14/2003 -0700, you wrote: > > >Say something political or religious.... it should get the list going again. > >:-) 2 issues that always get people (in general) stirred up. > > When I was back in Idaho there was a letter to the editor that claims that > god was a republican and Jesus would own a AK-47 if he were here today. > > I kid you not. > > How is that for politics and religion. :-) > > > In liberty, > > Scott > > wood@myblueheaven.com > www.myblueheaven.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 14 19:35:31 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mike Ingoglia) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 12:35:31 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test References: <20030214110419.13346.h009.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> <5.1.0.14.2.20030214122248.029848e0@mail.myblueheaven.com> Message-ID: <0d3f01c2d460$3c782190$cf98a8c0@Mike> Scott, that's a good start: :-) How about this: Knowing Your Political Parties !! A first grade teacher explained to her class that she was a liberal Democrat. She then asked her students to raise their hands if they were liberal Democrats, too. Not really knowing what a liberal Democrat was, but wanting to please their teacher, hands exploded into the air like fleshy Fireworks. There was, however, one exception. A girl named Lucy had not gone along with the crowd. The teacher asked Lucy why she decided to be different. "Because I'm not a liberal Democrat," Lucy said. The teacher asked, "Then what are you?" "I'm a proud conservative Republican" said the little girl. The teacher, a little perturbed and red-faced, asked Lucy why she was a conservative Republican? Lucy proclaimed, "Well, I was brought up to trust in myself and freedom, instead of relying on an intrusive government to care for me and do all of my thinking. My Dad and Mom are conservative Republicans, and I am a conservative Republican too." The teacher calmly pointed out, "That's no reason. What if your Mom and Dad were both morons? What would you be then?" Lucy answered, "Then, I'd be a liberal Democrat." ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Wood" To: Sent: Friday, February 14, 2003 12:24 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test > At 12:12 PM 2/14/2003 -0700, you wrote: > > >Say something political or religious.... it should get the list going again. > >:-) 2 issues that always get people (in general) stirred up. > > When I was back in Idaho there was a letter to the editor that claims that > god was a republican and Jesus would own a AK-47 if he were here today. > > I kid you not. > > How is that for politics and religion. :-) > > > In liberty, > > Scott > > wood@myblueheaven.com > www.myblueheaven.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 14 19:35:41 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 11:35:41 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test Message-ID: <20030214113542.15741.h009.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> My husband is at work!!! DARN! Just wait.....:-))))) Trisha "Lightning" Prescott - "Newlywed" PS...WOW....6 replies in less than an hour....it's like everyone is sitting out there staring at the screen just waiting for someone else to say something! ha ha ha On Fri, 14 Feb 2003, "Team Coyote1022" wrote: > > Valentines Day and the newly wed is on the internet! > Hmmmmmmmm...................................... > Everyone else is obviously doing something else on this day! :-) > > > -----Original Message----- > From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com > [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of > trisha@brasher.com > Sent: Friday, February 14, 2003 12:04 PM > To: listserv@azgeocaching.com > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test > > > This is a test....the list servd has either 1) been Werry Werry > Quiet...Shhhh!; or 2) something is wrong on my end or it's end and I > am not getting any messages....jsut curious. I'm used to getting art > least several messages a day from the list. > > Trisha "Lightning" > Prescott > > Happy Valentine's Day everyone! > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > "Although no one can go back and > make a brand new start, > Anyone can start from now and > make a brand new ending." > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 14 19:36:35 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 11:36:35 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test Message-ID: <20030214113638.20316.h009.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Ohhhh....don't get me started, Scott. :-) Trisha On Fri, 14 Feb 2003, Scott Wood wrote: > > At 12:12 PM 2/14/2003 -0700, you wrote: > > >Say something political or religious.... it should get the list going > again. > >:-) 2 issues that always get people (in general) stirred up. > > When I was back in Idaho there was a letter to the editor that claims > that > god was a republican and Jesus would own a AK-47 if he were here today. > > I kid you not. > > How is that for politics and religion. :-) > > > In liberty, > > Scott > > wood@myblueheaven.com > www.myblueheaven.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 14 19:40:34 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 11:40:34 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test Message-ID: <20030214114035.22622.h009.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Jesus with an American weapon? Hmmm....most likely, He would have had some kind of Israeli automatic rifle, don't you think? With a custom-made wooden stock, since He was a carpenter by trade..... Here we go! Something to do on a drizzley day! :) Trisha On Fri, 14 Feb 2003, "Regan Smith" wrote: > > Really I would have thought about an American AR-15 Hummmmmmm > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Scott Wood" > To: > Sent: Friday, February 14, 2003 12:24 PM > Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test > > > > At 12:12 PM 2/14/2003 -0700, you wrote: > > > > >Say something political or religious.... it should get the list > going > again. > > >:-) 2 issues that always get people (in general) stirred up. > > > > When I was back in Idaho there was a letter to the editor that > claims that > > god was a republican and Jesus would own a AK-47 if he were here > today. > > > > I kid you not. > > > > How is that for politics and religion. :-) > > > > > > In liberty, > > > > Scott > > > > wood@myblueheaven.com > > www.myblueheaven.com > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 14 19:42:45 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jim Scotti) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 12:42:45 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030214121538.0297c910@mail.myblueheaven.com> Message-ID: Ok guys, he's on to us! I guess we can start talking again. Jim. On Fri, 14 Feb 2003, Scott Wood wrote: > I was wondering the same thing, but thought it might be because I just > returned to Arizona after 3 weeks in Idaho. You know, one of those "be > quiet, Scott's back." :-) > > > In liberty, > > Scott > > wood@myblueheaven.com > www.myblueheaven.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > Jim Scotti Lunar & Planetary Laboratory University of Arizona Tucson, AZ 85721 USA http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/~jscotti/ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 14 19:47:26 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 12:47:26 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test In-Reply-To: <20030214113542.15741.h009.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.critica lpath.net> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030214124230.02982bd0@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 11:35 AM 2/14/2003 -0800, you wrote: >PS...WOW....6 replies in less than an hour....it's like everyone is >sitting out there staring at the screen just waiting for someone else >to say something! ha ha ha Actually I am sitting here catching up on paperwork and the such that I got behind on being away from my business for 3 weeks. The sad thing is that I will be sitting here most of the day tomorrow doing the exact same thing. Messages on the list are nice to see, I take a little break. In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 14 19:52:13 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 12:52:13 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test In-Reply-To: <20030214113542.15741.h009.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> References: <20030214113542.15741.h009.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Message-ID: <3E4D48ED.2090608@snaptek.com> trisha@brasher.com wrote: > PS...WOW....6 replies in less than an hour....it's like everyone is > sitting out there staring at the screen just waiting for someone else > to say something! ha ha ha Well just goes to show that the old saying that you have to send mail to get mail, is indeed true. Brian Cluff Team Snaptek From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 14 19:52:28 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 12:52:28 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test In-Reply-To: References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030214121538.0297c910@mail.myblueheaven.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030214125101.02980a20@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 12:42 PM 2/14/2003 -0700, you wrote: >Ok guys, he's on to us! I guess we can start talking again. Hey Jim, what time to do you want to meet for the hostage exchange? I also need to stop by my Tucson Bugport to drop off 5 or 6 of the travel bugs that I harvested on my Idaho trip. In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 14 20:00:18 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jim Scotti) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 13:00:18 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030214125101.02980a20@mail.myblueheaven.com> Message-ID: Ok, Scott, we gotta stop that! As you probably noticed by now, I sent you a private e-mail about exactly the same thing just now...... Jim. On Fri, 14 Feb 2003, Scott Wood wrote: > At 12:42 PM 2/14/2003 -0700, you wrote: > > >Ok guys, he's on to us! I guess we can start talking again. > > Hey Jim, what time to do you want to meet for the hostage exchange? I also > need to stop by my Tucson Bugport to drop off 5 or 6 of the travel bugs > that I harvested on my Idaho trip. > > > In liberty, > > Scott > > wood@myblueheaven.com > www.myblueheaven.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > Jim Scotti Lunar & Planetary Laboratory University of Arizona Tucson, AZ 85721 USA http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/~jscotti/ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 14 20:28:06 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Cody Ryan) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 20:28:06 +0000 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test Message-ID: test >From: trisha@brasher.com >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com >To: listserv@azgeocaching.com >Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test >Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 11:04:19 -0800 (PST) > >This is a test....the list servd has either 1) been Werry Werry >Quiet...Shhhh!; or 2) something is wrong on my end or it's end and I >am not getting any messages....jsut curious. I'm used to getting art >least several messages a day from the list. > >Trisha "Lightning" >Prescott > >Happy Valentine's Day everyone! > > >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >"Although no one can go back and >make a brand new start, >Anyone can start from now and >make a brand new ending." >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >____________________________________________________________ >Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com >To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: >http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > >Arizona's Geocaching Resource >http://www.azgeocaching.com _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 14 23:05:05 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 16:05:05 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test References: <20030214114035.22622.h009.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Message-ID: <001401c2d47d$844f8680$5611b83f@fishkiller> true the UZI is a fine battle proven crowd control device ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, February 14, 2003 12:40 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test > Jesus with an American weapon? Hmmm....most likely, He would have had > some kind of Israeli automatic rifle, don't you think? With a > custom-made wooden stock, since He was a carpenter by trade..... > Here we go! Something to do on a drizzley day! :) > Trisha > > > On Fri, 14 Feb 2003, "Regan Smith" wrote: > > > > > Really I would have thought about an American AR-15 Hummmmmmm > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Scott Wood" > > To: > > Sent: Friday, February 14, 2003 12:24 PM > > Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test > > > > > > > At 12:12 PM 2/14/2003 -0700, you wrote: > > > > > > >Say something political or religious.... it should get the list > > going > > again. > > > >:-) 2 issues that always get people (in general) stirred up. > > > > > > When I was back in Idaho there was a letter to the editor that > > claims that > > > god was a republican and Jesus would own a AK-47 if he were here > > today. > > > > > > I kid you not. > > > > > > How is that for politics and religion. :-) > > > > > > > > > In liberty, > > > > > > Scott > > > > > > wood@myblueheaven.com > > > www.myblueheaven.com > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > > > href="http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/ listinfo/az-geocaching">http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az -geocaching > > > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > > href="http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://www.azgeocaching.com">http://www.a zgeocaching.com > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > > href="http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/ listinfo/az-geocaching">http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az -geocaching > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > href="http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://www.azgeocaching.com">http://www.a zgeocaching.com > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > "Although no one can go back and > make a brand new start, > Anyone can start from now and > make a brand new ending." > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 14 23:33:32 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 18:33:32 -0500 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] List Serve Test Message-ID: <227466DC.4890DD96.0013DAD2@aol.com> How about a Galil? From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 14 23:51:56 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 16:51:56 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Team Evil FISH mascott Message-ID: <005c01c2d484$0f538aa0$5611b83f@fishkiller> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0058_01C2D449.62008EA0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0059_01C2D449.62008EA0" ------=_NextPart_001_0059_01C2D449.62008EA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Just wanted you all to see the mascot brought out for our 200th find and = making the first page top 25 :)=20 ------=_NextPart_001_0059_01C2D449.62008EA0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Just wanted you all to see the mascot = brought=20 out for our 200th find and making the first page top 25 :) =
 
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Message-ID: ------=_NextPart_001_0002_01C2D467.D08089C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Congrats' to Regan with "Team Evil Fish" on scoring number 200 today! Rand (RandMan) ------=_NextPart_001_0002_01C2D467.D08089C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Congrats' to R= egan with "Team Evil Fish" on scoring number 200 today!
 =
Rand (RandMan) 

------=_NextPart_001_0002_01C2D467.D08089C0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 15 08:20:33 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 01:20:33 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Oldest caches Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030215011911.0236f688@mail.myblueheaven.com> I was just thinking about old caches. I found this one while in Idaho: http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=38 It looks like it is something like the 10th of 11th oldest cache that is still active, and obviously the 38th cache posted. The great thing about this cache is that it is only a few miles from where I grew up. Anyone else have experience with really old caches? In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 15 16:27:41 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 08:27:41 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Oldest caches Message-ID: <20030215082742.1953.h006.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Wow, Scott, that is coming up on 3 years old (in June) and hardly any visits! Must be a remote area. Is it forested, mountains, hilly? Potato fields? Trisha On Fri, 14 Feb 2003, Scott Wood wrote: > > I was just thinking about old caches. I found this one while in Idaho: > > http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=38 > > It looks like it is something like the 10th of 11th oldest cache that > is > still active, and obviously the 38th cache posted. The great thing > about > this cache is that it is only a few miles from where I grew up. > > Anyone else have experience with really old caches? > > In liberty, > > Scott > > wood@myblueheaven.com > www.myblueheaven.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 15 16:33:04 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 08:33:04 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Evil Fish makes 200!!! Message-ID: <20030215083304.21815.h006.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Congrats Team Evil Fish! Which cache was it? Trisha "Lightning" Prescott On Fri, 14 Feb 2003, "RAND HARDIN" wrote: Congrats' to Regan with "Team Evil Fish" on scoring number 200 today!   Rand (RandMan)  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 15 16:37:36 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 09:37:36 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Wilderness Caches Message-ID: <000701c2d510$95ed5ff0$c069dd18@OUR> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C2D4D5.E98E87F0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thanks to the initiative of Regan Smith of Team Evil Fish (and congrats on reaching 200 finds, Regan!), an email correspondence was established between the geocaching.com admins responsible for approving caches in Arizona and our friend Scott Wood at Tonto National Forest. The result of that dialogue is that physical caches in designated wilderness areas will no longer be approved in Arizona. Tonto NF continues to "welcome" (Scott's word) Geocaching elsewhere within its land. We are also asked when placing caches to be sensitive to areas that may be or contain archaeological sites. If you want to place a cache and are unsure about an area, please contact the Ranger District office responsible for the area to obtain guidance. Both Scott and the admins recognize that not everyone who hides caches in the state reads this mailing list. At the same time we must remember that the admins are volunteers and certainly don't know our public lands as well as we do. So if you see a new physical cache get approved that you believe has been placed in a designated wilderness area, or if you discover a multi where the last stage turns out to be in wilderness, I suggest you email the hider directly about your concerns. Don't start by posting a "cache should be archived" log entry. If you then can't come to a resolution with the hider and you still believe the placement is inappropriate, at that point you should consider getting geocaching.com involved. If we employ this bit of self-policing, we should be able to ensure that everyone can continue to enjoy Geocaching on most of the three million acres that comprise the Tonto National Forest. Steve Team Tierra Buena ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C2D4D5.E98E87F0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
Thanks = to the=20 initiative of Regan Smith of Team Evil Fish (and congrats on reaching = 200 finds,=20 Regan!), an email correspondence was established between the = geocaching.com=20 admins responsible for approving caches in Arizona and our friend Scott = Wood at=20 Tonto National Forest. The result of that dialogue is that physical = caches in=20 designated wilderness areas will no longer be approved in Arizona. Tonto = NF=20 continues to "welcome" (Scott's word) Geocaching elsewhere within its=20 land.
 
We are = also asked=20 when placing caches to be sensitive to areas that may be or contain=20 archaeological sites. If you want to place a cache and are unsure = about an=20 area, please contact the Ranger District office responsible for the = area to obtain guidance.
 
Both = Scott and the=20 admins recognize that not everyone who hides caches in the state reads = this=20 mailing list. At the same time we must remember that the admins are = volunteers=20 and certainly don't know our public lands as well as we do. So if you = see a new=20 physical cache get approved that you believe has been placed in a = designated=20 wilderness area, or if you discover a multi where the last stage turns = out to be=20 in wilderness, I suggest you email the hider directly about your = concerns. Don't=20 start by posting a "cache should be  archived" log entry. If you = then can't=20 come to a resolution with the hider and you still believe the placement = is=20 inappropriate, at that point you should consider getting geocaching.com=20 involved.
 
If we = employ this=20 bit of self-policing, we should be able to ensure that everyone can = continue to=20 enjoy Geocaching on most of the three million acres that comprise the = Tonto=20 National Forest.
 
Steve
Team = Tierra=20 Buena
 
------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C2D4D5.E98E87F0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 15 17:07:17 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 10:07:17 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Oldest caches In-Reply-To: <20030215082742.1953.h006.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.critical path.net> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030215100528.0237ee50@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 08:27 AM 2/15/2003 -0800, you wrote: >Wow, Scott, that is coming up on 3 years old (in June) and hardly any >visits! Must be a remote area. Is it forested, mountains, hilly? >Potato fields? Not really. It is within 20 yards of a highway, along an old railroad that the tracks have been removed from for years. As far as I know, the nearest potato field is about 300 miles from here. :-) The only thing about this cache is that there are not a lot of people that live in this area. It is between 2 town, that have a total of about 400 people between them. In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 15 20:00:43 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Casteel) Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 13:00:43 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] WWJP? (What Would Jesus Pack?) Message-ID: <003e01c2d52c$ec246280$0500a8c0@fbidaemon> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_003B_01C2D4F2.3F961610 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ***DISCLAIMER*** This link is not intended to offend anyone. In this day in age, just = about everything offends someone, so I thought I'd get that out first. = :) According to this, Jesus would own a one-of-a-kind shotgun.. http://www.jesuschristsuperstore.net/lfigurespages/lfjesus.html The rest of the site of ROFL, so peruse at your own risk. Note: Side effects of continued viewing include, but is not limited to = a severe sideache, and difficulty breathing due to excessive laughter. Brian Team A.I. ------=_NextPart_000_003B_01C2D4F2.3F961610 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
***DISCLAIMER***
 
This link is not intended to offend = anyone. =20 In this day in age, just about everything offends someone, so I thought = I'd get=20 that out first.  :)
 
According to this, Jesus would own a = one-of-a-kind=20 shotgun..
 
= http://www.jesuschristsuperstore.net/lfigurespages/lfjesus.html
 
The rest of the site of ROFL, so peruse = at your own=20 risk.
 
Note:  Side effects of continued = viewing=20 include, but is not limited to a severe sideache, and difficulty = breathing due=20 to excessive laughter.
 
Brian
Team A.I.
------=_NextPart_000_003B_01C2D4F2.3F961610-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 15 20:33:11 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 12:33:11 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] WWJP? (What Would Jesus Pack?) Message-ID: <20030215123312.15418.h006.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Wellll....I guess that is an equal-opportunity offensive site, so I guess that makes it OK.....? Trisha On Sat, 15 Feb 2003, "Brian Casteel" wrote: ***DISCLAIMER***   This link is not intended to offend anyone.  In this day in age, just about everything offends someone, so I thought I'd get that out first.  :)   According to this, Jesus would own a one-of-a-kind shotgun..   http://www.jesuschristsuperstore.net/lfigurespages/lfjesus.html   The rest of the site of ROFL, so peruse at your own risk.   Note:  Side effects of continued viewing include, but is not limited to a severe sideache, and difficulty breathing due to excessive laughter.   Brian Team A.I. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun Feb 16 02:18:26 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 19:18:26 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Evil Fish makes 200!!! References: <20030215083304.21815.h006.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Message-ID: <003101c2d561$b39314e0$3e21b83f@fishkiller> The younger Team Member who is the Evil of Evil Fish located Fore! at 2 pm on Feb 14th I was proud of the little guy as he held the GPS and did all the directing, the best part was finding the old bones on our approach to the cache.... ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, February 15, 2003 9:33 AM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Evil Fish makes 200!!! > Congrats Team Evil Fish! Which cache was it? > Trisha "Lightning" > Prescott > > > > On Fri, 14 Feb 2003, "RAND HARDIN" wrote: > > Congrats' to Regan with "Team Evil Fish" on scoring number 200 today! > Rand (RandMan) > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > "Although no one can go back and > make a brand new start, > Anyone can start from now and > make a brand new ending." > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun Feb 16 02:48:35 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 18:48:35 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Evil Fish makes 200!!! Message-ID: <20030215184836.1740.h004.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> That is so cool, Regan, it is alot of fun when the family is involved! Trisha On Sat, 15 Feb 2003, "Regan Smith" wrote: > > The younger Team Member who is the Evil of Evil Fish located Fore! at > 2 pm > on Feb 14th I was proud of the little guy as he held the GPS and did > all the > directing, the best part was finding the old bones on our approach to > the > cache.... > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Saturday, February 15, 2003 9:33 AM > Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Evil Fish makes 200!!! > > > > Congrats Team Evil Fish! Which cache was it? > > Trisha "Lightning" > > Prescott > > > > > > > > On Fri, 14 Feb 2003, "RAND HARDIN" wrote: > > > > Congrats' to Regan with "Team Evil Fish" on scoring number 200 today! > > Rand (RandMan) > > > > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > "Although no one can go back and > > make a brand new start, > > Anyone can start from now and > > make a brand new ending." > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun Feb 16 01:38:25 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Barramus) Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 19:38:25 -0600 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] AZ vacation Message-ID: <000001c2d55c$4a0d7a60$c360550c@barry> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C2D529.CE9A7680 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable We are planning a trip to the desert in April. Looking at spending time = in Sedona and Tucson. Does any one have any recommendations for = reasonably priced hotels. Also looking for some outstanding caches in = these areas. Any ideas are greatly appreciated. Please respond to = barramus@att.net since I'm not subscribed to the list. Thanks! Barramus N 38=B0 25.081' W 90=B0 42.823' www.geostl.com dana soldiers of fortune ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C2D529.CE9A7680 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
We are planning a trip to the = desert in=20 April. Looking at spending time in Sedona and Tucson. Does any one have = any=20 recommendations for reasonably priced hotels. Also looking for some = outstanding=20 caches in these areas. Any ideas are greatly appreciated. Please respond = to barramus@att.net since I'm not = subscribed to=20 the list.
 
Thanks!

Barramus
N   = 38=B0=20 25.081'
W 90=B0 42.823'
 
dana
soldiers of fortune
 
 
 
------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C2D529.CE9A7680-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun Feb 16 04:07:17 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Ayre) Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 21:07:17 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] AZ vacation In-Reply-To: <000001c2d55c$4a0d7a60$c360550c@barry> Message-ID: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C2D536.38EE5950 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi Barramus, Check out The Oasis Bed and Breakfast. Its very well priced and run by a lovely lady! http://www.azres.com/prop/5512.html Groover -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Barramus Sent: Saturday, February 15, 2003 6:38 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: [Az-Geocaching] AZ vacation We are planning a trip to the desert in April. Looking at spending time in Sedona and Tucson. Does any one have any recommendations for reasonably priced hotels. Also looking for some outstanding caches in these areas. Any ideas are greatly appreciated. Please respond to barramus@att.net since I'm not subscribed to the list. Thanks! Barramus N 38° 25.081' W 90° 42.823' www.geostl.com dana soldiers of fortune ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C2D536.38EE5950 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi Barramus,

Check out The Oasis Bed and Breakfast. Its very well priced and run = by a=20 lovely lady!

http://www.azres.com/prop/5512.html

Groover
 

-----Original Message-----
From:=20 az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20 [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of=20 Barramus
Sent: Saturday, February 15, 2003 6:38 = PM
To:=20 listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] AZ=20 vacation

We are planning a trip to = the desert in=20 April. Looking at spending time in Sedona and Tucson. Does any one = have any=20 recommendations for reasonably priced hotels. Also looking for some=20 outstanding caches in these areas. Any ideas are greatly appreciated. = Please=20 respond to barramus@att.net = since I'm=20 not subscribed to the list.
 
Thanks!

Barramus
N   38=B0=20 25.081'
W 90=B0 42.823'
 
dana
soldiers of fortune
 
 
 
------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C2D536.38EE5950-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun Feb 16 13:57:00 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 06:57:00 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Wilderness Caches References: <000701c2d510$95ed5ff0$c069dd18@OUR> Message-ID: <008101c2d5c3$47f56a00$1c11b83f@fishkiller> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_007E_01C2D588.9A8A0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MessageI suggest you email the hider directly about your concerns. Don't = start by posting a "cache should be archived" log entry. If you then = can't come to a resolution with the hider and you still believe the = placement is inappropriate, at that point you should consider getting = geocaching.com involved. Yes I just want to reiterate that!!!=20 Now if we could just get the AZ Repug :\ Republic to do a follow up = article on how the Arizona caching community has come together to = prevent such disasters as had been previously stated things would be = well....=20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Team Tierra Buena=20 To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Saturday, February 15, 2003 9:37 AM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Wilderness Caches Thanks to the initiative of Regan Smith of Team Evil Fish (and = congrats on reaching 200 finds, Regan!), an email correspondence was = established between the geocaching.com admins responsible for approving = caches in Arizona and our friend Scott Wood at Tonto National Forest. = The result of that dialogue is that physical caches in designated = wilderness areas will no longer be approved in Arizona. Tonto NF = continues to "welcome" (Scott's word) Geocaching elsewhere within its = land. We are also asked when placing caches to be sensitive to areas that = may be or contain archaeological sites. If you want to place a cache and = are unsure about an area, please contact the Ranger District office = responsible for the area to obtain guidance. Both Scott and the admins recognize that not everyone who hides caches = in the state reads this mailing list. At the same time we must remember = that the admins are volunteers and certainly don't know our public lands = as well as we do. So if you see a new physical cache get approved that = you believe has been placed in a designated wilderness area, or if you = discover a multi where the last stage turns out to be in wilderness, I = suggest you email the hider directly about your concerns. Don't start by = posting a "cache should be archived" log entry. If you then can't come = to a resolution with the hider and you still believe the placement is = inappropriate, at that point you should consider getting geocaching.com = involved. If we employ this bit of self-policing, we should be able to ensure = that everyone can continue to enjoy Geocaching on most of the three = million acres that comprise the Tonto National Forest. Steve Team Tierra Buena ------=_NextPart_000_007E_01C2D588.9A8A0400 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
I suggest you email the = hider=20 directly about your concerns. Don't start by posting a "cache should = be =20 archived" log entry. If you then can't come to a resolution with the = hider and=20 you still believe the placement is inappropriate, at that point you = should=20 consider getting geocaching.com involved.
 
Yes I just want to = reiterate=20 that!!!
 
 
Now if we could just get the AZ Repug=20 :\ Republic to do a follow up article on how the Arizona = caching=20 community has come together to prevent such disasters as had been=20 previously stated things would be well.... 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Team Tierra Buena =
To: az-geocaching@lis= tserv.azgeocaching.com=20
Sent: Saturday, February 15, = 2003 9:37=20 AM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] = Wilderness=20 Caches

Thanks to the=20 initiative of Regan Smith of Team Evil Fish (and congrats on reaching = 200=20 finds, Regan!), an email correspondence was established between the=20 geocaching.com admins responsible for approving caches in Arizona and = our=20 friend Scott Wood at Tonto National Forest. The result of that = dialogue is=20 that physical caches in designated wilderness areas will no longer be = approved=20 in Arizona. Tonto NF continues to "welcome" (Scott's word) Geocaching=20 elsewhere within its land.
 
We = are also=20 asked when placing caches to be sensitive to areas that may be or = contain=20 archaeological sites. If you want to place a cache and are unsure = about=20 an area, please contact the Ranger District office = responsible for the=20 area to obtain guidance.
 
Both = Scott and=20 the admins recognize that not everyone who hides caches in the state = reads=20 this mailing list. At the same time we must remember that the admins = are=20 volunteers and certainly don't know our public lands as well as we do. = So if=20 you see a new physical cache get approved that you believe has been = placed in=20 a designated wilderness area, or if you discover a multi where the = last stage=20 turns out to be in wilderness, I suggest you email the hider directly = about=20 your concerns. Don't start by posting a "cache should be  = archived" log=20 entry. If you then can't come to a resolution with the hider and you = still=20 believe the placement is inappropriate, at that point you should = consider=20 getting geocaching.com involved.
 
If = we employ=20 this bit of self-policing, we should be able to ensure that everyone = can=20 continue to enjoy Geocaching on most of the three million acres that = comprise=20 the Tonto National Forest.
 
Steve
Team = Tierra=20 Buena
 
------=_NextPart_000_007E_01C2D588.9A8A0400-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun Feb 16 23:48:02 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (mike and gale jett) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 23:48:02 +0000 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] An important security message Message-ID:
We just found a nice cache Home Run Country, which apparently had a lot of visitors today. When we arrived, a very concerned security guard met us and asked us what we were doing. We explained geocaching and he seemed fine with it however he adamently explained how the fence of the water treatment facility was considered off-limits. The cache was placed on the back of a no trespassing sign on the fence. He asked us to remove the cache and let others know that we cannot place any caches on their fence especially in the light of today's heightened security. It seems that the previous few cachers who were talking by the fence after caching brought out the Mesa police helicopter, according to the security guard. (And you know who you are.) We know we are harmless, but you should have seen how nervous this security guard was. We removed the cache and apologized profusely for the cache placement. He was fine with that as long as we let other cachers know. Please don't place anything on a fence when there are no trespassing signs, especially if it is something as security conscious like a water treatment facility.

Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 17 00:14:10 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 17:14:10 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] An important security message References: Message-ID: <001e01c2d619$7fc8fcc0$1130b83f@fishkiller> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001B_01C2D5DE.D25D96C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I would hope that you personally contact the cache owner and return = their container. ----- Original Message -----=20 From: mike and gale jett=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2003 4:48 PM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] An important security message We just found a nice cache Home Run Country, which apparently had a = lot of visitors today. When we arrived, a very concerned security guard = met us and asked us what we were doing. We explained geocaching and he = seemed fine with it however he adamently explained how the fence of the = water treatment facility was considered off-limits. The cache was placed = on the back of a no trespassing sign on the fence. He asked us to remove = the cache and let others know that we cannot place any caches on their = fence especially in the light of today's heightened security. It seems = that the previous few cachers who were talking by the fence after = caching brought out the Mesa police helicopter, according to the = security guard. (And you know who you are.) We know we are harmless, but = you should have seen how nervous this security guard was. We removed the = cache and apologized profusely for the cache placement. He was fine with = that as long as we let other! cachers know. Please don't place anything = on a fence when there are no trespassing signs, especially if it is = something as security conscious like a water treatment facility. -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. = ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your = setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: = http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com ------=_NextPart_000_001B_01C2D5DE.D25D96C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I would hope that you personally = contact the cache=20 owner and return their container.
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 mike and gale jett =
Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2003 = 4:48=20 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] An = important=20 security message

We just found a nice cache Home Run Country, which apparently had = a lot=20 of visitors today. When we arrived, a very concerned security guard = met us and=20 asked us what we were doing. We explained geocaching and he seemed = fine with=20 it however he adamently explained how the fence of the water treatment = facility was considered off-limits. The cache was placed on the back = of a no=20 trespassing sign on the fence. He asked us to remove the cache and let = others=20 know that we cannot place any caches on their fence especially in the = light of=20 today's heightened security. It seems that the previous few cachers = who were=20 talking by the fence after caching brought out the Mesa police = helicopter,=20 according to the security guard. (And you know who you are.) We know = we are=20 harmless, but you should have seen how nervous this security guard = was. We=20 removed the cache and apologized profusely for the cache placement. He = was=20 fine with that as long as we let other! cachers know. Please don't = place=20 anything on a fence when there are no trespassing signs, especially if = it is=20 something as security conscious like a water treatment=20 facility.

Add photos to your messages with MSN=20 8. Get 2 months FREE*.=20 ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching=20 mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe = or=20 unsubscribe visit:=20 http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's=20 Geocaching Resource = http://www.azgeocaching.com ------=_NextPart_000_001B_01C2D5DE.D25D96C0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 17 02:35:55 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 18:35:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] An important security message and more Message-ID: <20030216183556.27644.h010.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Especially with the heightened Security Status, I am not at all surprised about this. "Orange", one level below "Red" carries ALOT of extra and specific security measures at all kinds of places that I never even thought of until I was watching CNN and stuff. "Red" alert will amount to a virtual lock-down of all government facilities, borders, transportation, etc. We all need to be very aware of OUR OWN actions (which may seem suspicious to others) as well as watching for suspicious activities of others. On a much lighter note, my husband and I just finished the first "phase" of a website for the Jeep Posse. If you are curious about it, visit www.ycjp.org and check it out! We will be building the site more in the future. Our Posse has a bi-monthly newsletter for which I write a geocaching column! Trisha "Lightning" Prescott On Sun, 16 Feb 2003, "mike and gale jett" wrote: We just found a nice cache Home Run Country, which apparently had a lot of visitors today. When we arrived, a very concerned security guard met us and asked us what we were doing. We explained geocaching and he seemed fine with it however he adamently explained how the fence of the water treatment facility was considered off-limits. The cache was placed on the back of a no trespassing sign on the fence. He asked us to remove the cache and let others know that we cannot place any caches on their fence especially in the light of today's heightened security. It seems that the previous few cachers who were talking by the fence after caching brought out the Mesa police helicopter, according to the security guard. (And you know who you are.) We know we are harmless, but you should have seen how nervous this security guard was. We removed the cache and apologized profusely for the cache placement. He was fine with that as long as we let other! cachers know. Please don't place anything on a fence when there are no trespassing signs, especially if it is something as security conscious like a water treatment facility.Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 17 20:06:40 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Casteel) Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 13:06:40 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] An important security message Message-ID: <001601c2d6c0$167ed170$0500a8c0@fbidaemon> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C2D685.6994F780 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Well, here's my .43 on the matter regarding Home Run Country.=20 I was one of the three people who were present at the time the Mesa PD = helicopter was 'called out'. First, they were on routine patrol, and = didn't even so much as go into a brief orbit over the area. They made a = casual flyover on their way to a call NE of our location. However, I = can understand the concern of the security guard. While out there, I = thought it humorous that the cache was on the back of a No Trespassing = sign, which was to indicate that the area BEHIND the fence was = off-limits. Until I read it on the listserv, I had no idea a water = treatment plant was behind it (wasn't really focusing on the area behind = the fenceline). We stood around and chatted for a few (the other = cachers), and got back into our vehicles and drove out of the field. = Apparently, Tsegi Mike (& Desert Viking?) were walking from the parking = lot as we all left, and called it a day. =20 I'm guessing the air unit thought we were pretty harmless, as no other = ground units showed up to question us regarding our intentions. But the = bottom line is that we all should be conscious of the area(s) in which = we place a cache. If an area is private property and a responsible = party tells you that the cache needs to be removed, it is up to us to = make that happen. =20 There is one cache in particular that popped up this past week that I = feel will become an issue once again and may lead to another black eye = for geocachers. After being told that the cache was unwanted in the = area, I e-mailed the cache owner. The cache was quickly archived, but = re-created a few days later on the same property, just 500' or so away. = The difference is, the cache container is in a location that the = security guards who raised a stink about the first location could no = longer see. While they are unable to see it, the people who drive into = the property surely do, and I'm sure more than a few of them will notify = the security guards. I visited the location, spent a few minutes there = and didn't feel right about being there, and don't plan on going back to = log a find...unless the security staff has granted permission. Brian Team A.I. ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C2D685.6994F780 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Well, here's my .43 on the matter = regarding Home=20 Run Country. 
 
I was one of the three people who were = present at=20 the time the Mesa PD helicopter was 'called out'.  First, they were = on=20 routine patrol, and didn't even so much as go into a brief orbit over = the=20 area.  They made a casual flyover on their way to a call NE of our=20 location.  However, I can understand the concern of the security=20 guard.  While out there, I thought it humorous that the cache was = on the=20 back of a No Trespassing sign, which was to indicate that the area = BEHIND the=20 fence was off-limits.  Until I read it on the listserv, I had no = idea a=20 water treatment plant was behind it (wasn't really focusing on the area = behind=20 the fenceline).  We stood around and chatted for a few (the other = cachers),=20 and got back into our vehicles and drove out of the field.  = Apparently,=20 Tsegi Mike (& Desert Viking?) were walking from the parking lot as = we all=20 left, and called it a day. 
 
I'm guessing the air unit thought we = were pretty=20 harmless, as no other ground units showed up to question us regarding = our=20 intentions.  But the bottom line is that we all should be conscious = of the=20 area(s) in which we place a cache.  If an area is private property = and a=20 responsible party tells you that the cache needs to be removed, it is up = to us=20 to make that happen. 
 
There is one cache in particular = that popped=20 up this past week that I feel will become an issue once again and = may lead=20 to another black eye for geocachers.  After being told that the = cache was=20 unwanted in the area, I e-mailed the cache owner.  The cache was = quickly=20 archived, but re-created a few days later on the same property, just = 500' or so=20 away.  The difference is, the cache container is in a location that = the=20 security guards who raised a stink about the first location could no = longer=20 see.  While they are unable to see it, the people who drive into = the=20 property surely do, and I'm sure more than a few of them will notify the = security guards.  I visited the location, spent a few minutes there = and=20 didn't feel right about being there, and don't plan on going back to log = a=20 find...unless the security staff has granted permission.
 
Brian
Team A.I.
------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C2D685.6994F780-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 17 20:39:45 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (mike and gale jett) Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 20:39:45 +0000 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] An important security message Message-ID:

Of course we did, even before posting the listserve.

>From: "Regan Smith"
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To:
>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] An important security message
>Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 17:14:10 -0700
>
>I would hope that you personally contact the cache owner and return their container.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: mike and gale jett
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2003 4:48 PM
> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] An important security message
>
>
> We just found a nice cache Home Run Country, which apparently had a lot of visitors today. When we arrived, a very concerned security guard met us and asked us what we were doing. We explained geocaching and he seemed fine with it however he adamently explained how the fence of the water treatment facility was considered off-limits. The cache was placed on the back of a no trespassing sign on the fence. He asked us to remove the cache and let others know that we cannot place any caches on their fence especially in the light of today's heightened security. It seems that the previous few cachers who were talking by the fence after caching brought out the Mesa police helicopter, according to the security guard. (And you know who you are.) We know we are harmless, but you should have seen how nervous this security guard was. We removed the cache and apologized profusely for the cache placement. He was fine with that as long as we let other! cachers know. Please don't place anything on a fence when there are no trespassing signs, especially if it is something as security conscious like a water treatment facility.
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com

MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*. From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 17 23:00:34 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 18:00:34 -0500 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache goodies Message-ID: <63EB4103.5E1ECA31.0013DAD2@aol.com> Mary and I love little knives and d-rings. I found a knife sharpener once and love it. I have it here at work with me. and my personal favorite PEZ. I would leave PEZ at every cache i find but I can't bring myself to part with one. Cameron from Budcam & Mary. From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 18 00:55:15 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mike Ingoglia) Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 17:55:15 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache goodies References: <63EB4103.5E1ECA31.0013DAD2@aol.com> Message-ID: <007e01c2d6e8$66293ad0$cf98a8c0@Mike> I don't mean to sound rude, but every cache I find PEZ in (and any other food product) I take and toss in the trash. I personally enjoy PEZ, but so do the wild animals that are attracted to it... ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, February 17, 2003 4:00 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache goodies > Mary and I love little knives and d-rings. I found a knife sharpener once and love it. I have it here at work with me. and my personal favorite PEZ. I would leave PEZ at every cache i find but I can't bring myself to part with one. > Cameron from Budcam & Mary. > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 18 01:01:57 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 20:01:57 -0500 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache goodies Message-ID: <6ABAF87E.2242DEC7.0013DAD2@aol.com> I meant the dispensers. I agree about the candy or any other food. From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 18 18:09:11 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN) Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 11:09:11 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Team Stats for "Home Run Country"!? Message-ID: ------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C2D73E.2A5430E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I just pulled up the Arizona Team Stat page and noticed that I, and every= one else who had found the "Home Run Country" cache (WP GCD548) didn't ge= t credit for an Arizona find! It appears that it came up as an "out of s= tate" cache. Can anyone explain why this happened? It's obvious that th= e cache is an Arizona cache. Rand (RandMan) ------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C2D73E.2A5430E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I just pulled = up the Arizona Team Stat page and noticed that I, and everyone = else who had found the "Home Run Country" cache (WP GCD548) did= n't get credit for an Arizona find!  It appears that it came up= as an "out of state" cache.  Can anyone explain why this happened?&= nbsp; It's obvious that the cache is an Arizona cache.
 <= /DIV>
Rand (RandMan)

------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C2D73E.2A5430E0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 18 18:33:45 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Tim Giron) Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 13:33:45 -0500 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Team Stats for "Home Run Country"!? Message-ID: <20030218183341.SSCN14657.fed1mtao08.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=____1045593225509_UWQRCdjn0m Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Possibly because it was listed and archived all on the same day? Tim Team AZFastFeet ============================================================ Can anyone explain why this happened? It's obvious that the cache is an Arizona cache. Rand (RandMan) ============================================================ ------=____1045593225509_UWQRCdjn0m Content-Type: text/html; name="reply" Content-Disposition: inline; filename="reply"
I just pulled up the Arizona Team Stat page and noticed that I, and everyone else who had found the "Home Run Country" cache (WP GCD548) didn't get credit for an Arizona find!  It appears that it came up as an "out of state" cache.  Can anyone explain why this happened?  It's obvious that the cache is an Arizona cache.
 
Rand (RandMan)

------=____1045593225509_UWQRCdjn0m-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 18 18:34:12 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jason Poulter) Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 11:34:12 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Team Stats for "Home Run Country"!? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E527CA4.2080008@snaptek.com> because it is now archived and we have not updated it yet into the archived section for it to download the latest update finds on it... should be done soon jason RAND HARDIN wrote: > I just pulled up the Arizona Team Stat page and noticed that I, > and everyone else who had found the "Home Run Country" cache (WP > GCD548) didn't get credit for an Arizona find! It appears that it came > up as an "out of state" cache. Can anyone explain why this happened? > It's obvious that the cache is an Arizona cache. > > Rand (RandMan) > From listserv@azgeocaching.com Wed Feb 19 18:40:27 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (mike and gale jett) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 18:40:27 +0000 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GPS Pioneer wins award Message-ID:
A friend sent me this.
 
GPS pioneer wins prestigious award
Stanford University's Bradford Parkinson, a pioneer of the navigation technology that now guides everything from military missiles to misguided motorists, was honored Tuesday with the Charles Stark Draper Prize, the engineering equivalent of the Nobel Prize.
The full article will be available on the Web for a limited time:
http://www.siliconvalley.com/mld/siliconvalley/5214069.htm

(c) 2003 Mercury News and wire service sources. All Rights Reserved.


Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 20 01:33:59 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (WOLFB8) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 18:33:59 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? References: Message-ID: <004901c2d880$96929ec0$bfd36844@aoldsl.net> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0033_01C2D845.78248EC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ok folks now there bitching at the rock art place.... I wonder if shelly = is behind this one too.... check this out....a another catcher sent me = the link thinking it was one of my caches but it is a virtual sign from = the past by wererwe ....ken you out there http://opentopic.groundspeak.com/0/OpenTopic?a=3Dtpc&s=3D1750973553&f=3D3= 000917383&m=3D9080924255 We will be known by the tracks we leave behind ------=_NextPart_000_0033_01C2D845.78248EC0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
ok folks now there bitching at the rock = art=20 place.... I wonder if shelly is behind this one too.... check this = out....a=20 another catcher sent me the link thinking it was one of my caches but it = is a=20 virtual sign from the past by wererwe ....ken you out there
 

http://opentopic.groundspea= k.com/0/OpenTopic?a=3Dtpc&s=3D1750973553&f=3D3000917383&m=3D9= 080924255

 
 
 
 
We will be known by the tracks we leave behind
  ------=_NextPart_000_0033_01C2D845.78248EC0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 20 01:58:00 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 18:58:00 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? In-Reply-To: <004901c2d880$96929ec0$bfd36844@aoldsl.net> References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030219185704.02475210@mail.myblueheaven.com> --=====================_416452707==_.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 06:33 PM 2/19/2003 -0700, you wrote: >ok folks now there bitching at the rock art place.... I wonder if shelly >is behind this one too.... check this out....a another catcher sent me the >link thinking it was one of my caches but it is a virtual sign from the >past by wererwe ....ken you out there > Well, isn't that an interesting exchange. One thing I know for certain is that I will NEVER visit the Deer Valley Rock Art Center, or what ever it is called. No way will I ever give them a dime to support that area if they don't want me there. In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com --=====================_416452707==_.ALT Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" At 06:33 PM 2/19/2003 -0700, you wrote:

ok folks now there bitching at the rock art place.... I wonder if shelly is behind this one too.... check this out....a another catcher sent me the link thinking it was one of my caches but it is a virtual sign from the past by wererwe ....ken you out there
 

Well, isn't that an interesting exchange.  One thing I know for certain is that I will NEVER visit the Deer Valley Rock Art Center, or what ever it is called.  No way will I ever give them a dime to support that area if they don't want me there.


In liberty,

Scott

wood@myblueheaven.com
--=====================_416452707==_.ALT-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 20 02:15:13 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Burkett) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 19:15:13 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? In-Reply-To: <004901c2d880$96929ec0$bfd36844@aoldsl.net> Message-ID: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C2D84B.3A7F4000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Whoever this complainer is, he or she strikes me as an obnoxious idiot. -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of WOLFB8 Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2003 6:34 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? ok folks now there bitching at the rock art place.... I wonder if shelly is behind this one too.... check this out....a another catcher sent me the link thinking it was one of my caches but it is a virtual sign from the past by wererwe ....ken you out there http://opentopic.groundspeak.com/0/OpenTopic?a=tpc&s=1750973553&f=3000917383 &m=9080924255 We will be known by the tracks we leave behind ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C2D84B.3A7F4000 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Wh= oever this complainer is, he or she strikes me as an obnoxious = idiot.

 

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of WOLFB8
Sent: Wednesday, February = 19, 2003 6:34 PM
To: = listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] = Is Shelly at it a again or what?????

 

ok folks now there bitching at the = rock art place.... I wonder if shelly is behind this one too.... check this = out....a another catcher sent me the link thinking it was one of my caches but it = is a virtual sign from the past by wererwe ....ken you out = there<= /p>

 <= /p>


http://opentopic.groundspea= k.com/0/OpenTopic?a=3Dtpc&s=3D1750973553&f=3D3000917383&m=3D9= 080924255<= /p>

 <= /p>

 <= /p>

 <= /p>

 <= /p>

We will be known by the tracks we = leave behind

 <= /p>

------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C2D84B.3A7F4000-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 20 02:28:45 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (WOLFB8) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 19:28:45 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? References: Message-ID: <007301c2d887$d270fd40$bfd36844@aoldsl.net> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0070_01C2D84D.1E3EAAA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable anyone up for a event cache at the rock art center We will be known by the tracks we leave behind ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Bill Burkett=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2003 7:15 PM Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? Whoever this complainer is, he or she strikes me as an obnoxious = idiot. =20 -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com = [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of = WOLFB8 Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2003 6:34 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? =20 ok folks now there bitching at the rock art place.... I wonder if = shelly is behind this one too.... check this out....a another catcher = sent me the link thinking it was one of my caches but it is a virtual = sign from the past by wererwe ....ken you out there =20 = http://opentopic.groundspeak.com/0/OpenTopic?a=3Dtpc&s=3D1750973553&f=3D3= 000917383&m=3D9080924255 =20 =20 =20 =20 We will be known by the tracks we leave behind =20 ------=_NextPart_000_0070_01C2D84D.1E3EAAA0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
anyone up for a event cache at the rock = art=20 center
 
 
 
We will be known by the tracks we leave behind
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Bill = Burkett=20
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, = 2003 7:15=20 PM
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Is = Shelly at=20 it a again or what?????

Whoever=20 this complainer is, he or she strikes me as an obnoxious=20 idiot.

 

-----Original=20 Message-----
From: = az-geocachi= ng-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20 [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of WOLFB8
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, = 2003 6:34=20 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.comSubject: [Az-Geocaching] Is = Shelly at it=20 a again or what?????

 

ok folks = now there=20 bitching at the rock art place.... I wonder if shelly is behind this = one=20 too.... check this out....a another catcher sent me the link thinking = it was=20 one of my caches but it is a virtual sign from the past by wererwe = ....ken you=20 out there

 


http://opentopic.groundspea= k.com/0/OpenTopic?a=3Dtpc&s=3D1750973553&f=3D3000917383&m=3D9= 080924255

 

 

 

 

We will be known by the tracks = we leave=20 behind

 

= ------=_NextPart_000_0070_01C2D84D.1E3EAAA0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 20 03:48:40 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Chelby Geiss) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 20:48:40 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? In-Reply-To: <007301c2d887$d270fd40$bfd36844@aoldsl.net> Message-ID: <33285157-4486-11D7-AA41-000393545682@desertsol.com> >>"anyone up for a event cache at the rock art center" I was JUST thinking the same thing! We're free this weekend! Team desertSol Chelby & Kevin + Kiva and Lancer (German Shepherds) Apache Junction, AZ www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 20 05:58:39 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Nicol) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 21:58:39 -0800 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? Message-ID: I drove by the DVRAC just yesterday while I was up in the NW valley doing some caches. I was going to hit that one. I looked at my PDA cache list and my GPS cache list and couldnt find it. I figured that mabye it was archived or something. Couldnt think why it would be since it is a virtual cache. Well, anyways.. I drove away and continued on to the next cache on my list. I personally would not pay $5.00 to go in there. But, since there was a geocache 'find' to be had, I would have. I do enjoy that kind of stuff (AZ history, rocks, nature, etc) but not enough to pay $5 bucks to see it. But, I WOULD go in there to get a cache find and would certainly enjoy the visit and leave with a greater knowledge of the exhibits and stuff. Basically, geocaching has taken me to many places and museums around Arizona that I would never have visited otherwise. Yea, I enjoyed all those museums and stuff and took the time to enjoy them and learn... and I do. I don't just run in, answer the questions for the cache find and leave... I enjoy the exhibits and stuff and learn something while I am there. But, simply put.. I wouldnt have ever gone in there otherwise. Geocaching is what brought me to those places. Anyways, since they don't want me there, I guess they will not be getting my business (and I certainly would not recommend it to visiting relatives or anyone else). I do beleive that the cache owner should have gotten permission to 'place' this virtual cache first though, even if it was only a virtual. (or did he?) By posting the coordinates, we are asking the geocaching community to go to a given location and if there was something of archeological significance there, then the traffic generated by the posting of the coordinates would be potentially damaging (whether it is a virtual cache or a physical cache container). However, since this is a museum of sorts and it is open to the public AND the fact that it is a virtual cache.. there is nothing damaging about our being there. However, We need to put ourselves in a non-cachers shoes and think the way they might think (a rational non cacher that is!) when placing a cache, physical or virtual. But... What really irritates me about this whole thing.... All these site stewards and archeological site folks want us (geocachers) to learn more about these sites and to respect these sites... here we have an opportunity to visit the DVRAC (thru this virtual cache) and learn more about these sites and petroglyphs and stuff... and thru the center, we learn to respect what is left of these fragile sites around Arizona as well as learn to better identify them... BUT, they don't want us there! Scott Team Ropingthewind _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 20 07:39:17 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 00:39:17 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? In-Reply-To: <004901c2d880$96929ec0$bfd36844@aoldsl.net> References: <004901c2d880$96929ec0$bfd36844@aoldsl.net> Message-ID: <3E548625.3030909@Snaptek.com> WOLFB8 wrote: >ok folks now there bitching at the rock art place.... I wonder if shelly is behind this one too.... check this out....a another catcher sent me the link thinking it was one of my caches but it is a virtual sign from the past by wererwe ....ken you out there > I absolutly love Ken's 2 cents on this matter, it really puts things into perspective. I would have probably taken a similar "offensive" photograph and used the exact same logic. To me it's like being at the grocery store... we all know not to eat the food that we haven't paid for, and they put protective wrappers and such so that we can't touch the food, or eat it without violating the wrapping... but sometimes the stores will take an item and put small pieces of it on a plate so that you can more closely examin it and taste it for yourself. They don't always have someone there offering it to you, it's just a given that you can partake of whats on the plate. If they want to put up a sign that says, don't eat what's on the plate, I would be happy to not try it, otherwise I'm probably going to try it. It's the same with displays, you rope off everything but one and they don't remind you about their policy with a sign when they have made one item comepletely different for all the rest and also put it right in someone's face like that, you have to expect them to have a closer look and probably touch it. With that said... you have to wonder if they truely don't want ANYTHING to happen to ancient stuff like that, why they continue to leave it out in the elements to erode (I'm assuming this rock museum is outdoors.. they all seem to be)... not to mention the damage that acid rain can do to rocks in just a couple of years. It would take a hell of a lot of body oil to equal a little bit of acid rain. Brian Cluff Team Snaptek From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 20 06:40:11 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 23:40:11 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? References: <004901c2d880$96929ec0$bfd36844@aoldsl.net> Message-ID: <005401c2d8aa$eb23b120$91f50244@cx301817d> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0050_01C2D870.3EADF5C0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0051_01C2D870.3EADF5C0" ------=_NextPart_001_0051_01C2D870.3EADF5C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This is my response to the Geocahing forum. Along with the offensive = photo. Hello, =20 I would like to introduce myself as the owner of the virtual cache that = has become the center of this controversy. The reason that I created the = cache was to share with others some of the beauty and history that our = state has to offer. =20 I clearly posted on the cache page the hours that the museum is open and = there was never a need for a visitor to "trespass". In order to find = the answers to the questions you never had to leave the public access = paths that are maintained at the site. =20 As far as the "offensive" photograph it consists of my daughter leaning = up against a boulder with her arm above the petroglyph. This boulder is = located directly in the walking path that a visitor takes to view the = various petroglyphs at the site. Since this is a museum and this = particular boulder was directly in the walking path I did not believe it = was "off limits" The rest of the boulders are separated from visitors by = short tubular fencing that clearly define restricted space. Since this = boulder was directly in the visitors pathway, not separated by fencing, = with no signs stating do not touch I did not believe there was any = problem with my daughter posing by the glyph. My impression of the = placement of the boulder directly in the walking path was that it was = put there exactly for that purpose. This boulder is also clearly = separated from main rock panels giving me the impression that it was = there for public inspection. Many museums have similar displays that the = public is allowed to touch and examine. We are sorry if we violated the = museum rules but it was an honest mistake and this particular boulder = should have been clearly marked, or fenced off.=20 =20 Whiling visiting the site, we spoke with the park ranger who happened to = be Native American. During our conversation he explained how many of = the local Arizona tribes once considered this site as a primary sacred = location to them. He explained to us that many of these tribes felt = betrayed and offended by the academic community taking over this sacred = site and believed these people demonstrated little compassion, = understanding or respect for their cultural heritage. Many of these = tribes consider this site desecrated and will no longer visit this area = because of the interference of the academic community. =20 =20 Is there a double standard that the museum is offended about a picture = of a child touching "their" boulder, yet have no difficulty alienating = entire tribes of Native Americans in order to conduct their research? = The attitude we've derived appears to be elitist, encouraging academia = but forgoing anyone else's learning. =20 The museum is run by Arizona State University, which is a publicly = funded school. They lease the site from the Maricopa County Flood = Control district, which is also publicly funded. I find the following = statement interesting. =20 " I appreciate the removal of the Center from your website. It has = attracted=20 some visitors. However, we do not think your website is the kind of PR = the=20 Center is seeking" =20 It interesting that they want to be selective in who can visit this = publicly funded site. Who else is not welcome? The handicapped? Anglos'? = Blacks? Hispanic's? Hunters? Fishermen? 4x4 enthusiasts? Dog lovers? I = do not recall seeing the sign on what they consider "acceptable" = visitors. =20 What is acceptable P.R.? National Geographic Magazine? Readers Digest? = Playboy? Since when do they get to control freedom of speech regarding = this publicly supported site? =20 I also find this statement interesting: =20 "Please remove the Deer Valley Rock Art Center from your website. I hope this request will not turn into a legal matter" =20 What legal matter? There never, ever, was anything placed on this = publicly owned property. This site is listed a "Phoenix Points of = Pride" and "The National Register Of Historic Places". Are they also = going to be sued? Do a Web Search on "Deer Valley Rock Art Center" and = see how many hits you get. Are they going to threaten legal action = against all these sites? I seem to remember a little article called the = 1st amendment that maybe they should read about. =20 The sad thing is that as an educational institution they have missed an = opportunity to help educated the Geocaching community about the = importance of not touching petroglyphs. After learning of their concern = I could have posted on the cache page about how the oils in fingerprints = can actually harm a petroglyph. This opportunity is now lost because of = their narrow minded thinking. =20 Ken WhereRWee? ------=_NextPart_001_0051_01C2D870.3EADF5C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This is my response to the Geocahing = forum. Along=20 with the offensive photo.
 
 
 

Hello,

 

I would like to introduce myself as the owner of the virtual = cache that=20 has become the center of this controversy. The reason that I created the = cache=20 was to share with others some of the beauty and history that our state = has to=20 offer.

 

I clearly posted on the cache page the hours that the museum is = open and=20 there was never a need for a visitor to =93trespass=94.  In order to find the answers = to the=20 questions you never had to leave the public access paths that are = maintained at=20 the site.

 

As far as the =93offensive=94 photograph it consists of my = daughter leaning=20 up against a boulder with her arm above the petroglyph. This boulder is = located=20 directly in the walking path that a visitor takes to view the various=20 petroglyphs at the site. Since this is a museum and this particular = boulder was=20 directly in the walking path I did not believe it was =93off limits=94 = The rest of=20 the boulders are separated from visitors by short tubular fencing that = clearly=20 define restricted space. Since this boulder was directly in the visitors = pathway, not separated by fencing, with no signs stating do not touch I = did not=20 believe there was any problem with my daughter posing by the glyph. My=20 impression of the placement of the boulder directly in the walking path = was that=20 it was put there exactly for that purpose. This boulder is also clearly=20 separated from main rock panels giving me the impression that it was = there for=20 public inspection. Many museums have similar displays that the public is = allowed=20 to touch and examine. We are sorry if we violated the museum rules but = it was an=20 honest mistake and this particular boulder should have been clearly = marked, or=20 fenced off.

 

Whiling visiting the site, we spoke with the = park ranger=20 who happened to be Native American. =20 During our conversation he explained how many of the local = Arizona tribes=20 once considered this site as a primary sacred location to them.  He explained to us that many = of these=20 tribes felt betrayed and offended by the academic community taking over = this=20 sacred site and believed these people demonstrated little compassion,=20 understanding or respect for their cultural heritage.  Many of these tribes consider = this site=20 desecrated and will no longer visit this area because of the = interference of the=20 academic community. =20

 

Is there a double standard that the museum is offended about a = picture of=20 a child touching =93their=94 boulder, yet have no difficulty alienating = entire=20 tribes of Native Americans in order to conduct their research? The = attitude=20 we=92ve derived appears to be elitist, encouraging academia but forgoing = anyone=20 else=92s learning.

 

The museum is run by Arizona State University, which is a = publicly funded=20 school. They lease the site from the Maricopa County Flood Control = district,=20 which is also publicly funded. I find the following statement=20 interesting.

 

=93 I appreciate the = removal of the=20 Center from your website. It has attracted
some visitors. However, we do not think your = website is=20 the kind of PR the
Center is=20 seeking=94

 

It interesting that they want to be selective in who can visit = this=20 publicly funded site. Who else is not welcome? The handicapped? = Anglos=92? Blacks?=20 Hispanic=92s? Hunters? Fishermen? 4x4 enthusiasts? Dog lovers? I do not = recall=20 seeing the sign on what they consider =93acceptable=94 = visitors.

 

What is acceptable P.R.? National Geographic Magazine? Readers = Digest?=20 Playboy? Since when do they get to control freedom of speech regarding = this=20 publicly supported site?

 

I also find this = statement=20 interesting:

 

=93Please remove the = Deer Valley=20 Rock Art Center from your website. I hope
this request will not turn into a legal=20 matter=94

 

What legal matter? = There never,=20 ever, was anything placed on this publicly owned property. This site is = listed=20 a  =93Phoenix Points of = Pride=94 and=20 =93The National Register Of Historic Places=94. Are they also going to = be sued? Do a=20 Web Search on =93Deer Valley Rock Art Center=94 and see how many hits = you get. Are=20 they going to threaten legal action against all these sites? I seem to = remember=20 a little article called the 1st amendment that maybe they = should read=20 about.

 

The sad thing is that = as an=20 educational institution they have missed an opportunity to help educated = the=20 Geocaching community about the importance of not touching petroglyphs. = After=20 learning of their concern I could have posted on the cache page about = how the=20 oils in fingerprints can actually harm a petroglyph. This opportunity is = now=20 lost because of their narrow minded = thinking.

 

Ken

WhereRWee? =20
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/9k= ------=_NextPart_000_0050_01C2D870.3EADF5C0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 20 15:38:04 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Chelby Geiss) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 08:38:04 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? In-Reply-To: <004901c2d880$96929ec0$bfd36844@aoldsl.net> Message-ID: <4D086D55-44E9-11D7-AA41-000393545682@desertsol.com> OK, IMO it is the wrong this to do to boycott the DVRAC until we know the whole story. I am not convinced that this letter to geocaching.com is truly from the "higher ups." I can't imagine that any of our local struggling museums would bash something so severely that brings in support! I know from working with people at the Pueblo Grande Museum that they greatly appreciate the traffic from the virtual cache placed there by Libby. May I suggest that when you do go to one of these museum virtuals, sign the guest book and if there is a "How did you hear about us?" make sure you put www.geocaching.com! They actually read those!!! I have emailed Kristy, my friend at the Pueblo Grande (who is an archeologist and has absolutely nothing against geocaching), to see if she knows any of the people at DVRAC (she's involved with a lot of the city wide museum meetings and such, so hopefully she does). I'm still waiting to hear back from her. And just like with the recent issues with Mesa Ranger District, PLEASE remember that if you do contact DVRAC, remember to be level headed and EDUCATION, EDUCATION, EDUCATION! Team desertSol Chelby & Kevin + Kiva and Lancer (German Shepherds) Apache Junction, AZ www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 20 16:57:16 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 09:57:16 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? In-Reply-To: <4D086D55-44E9-11D7-AA41-000393545682@desertsol.com> References: <004901c2d880$96929ec0$bfd36844@aoldsl.net> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030220095010.01c62be0@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 08:38 AM 2/20/2003 -0700, you wrote: >OK, IMO it is the wrong this to do to boycott the DVRAC until we know the >whole story. I am not convinced that this letter to geocaching.com is >truly from the "higher ups." I can't imagine that any of our local >struggling museums would bash something so severely that brings in >support! I know I strongly disagree. It doesn't matter what the higher ups really feel, they are not the ones that people are interacting with. If the people that you are going to interact with when you visit the area don't want you there, then you are not going to have a good time. Let me give you a real example that happened to me. When I was still on active duty and was travelling a lot, I would make it a point to visit any and all National Parks and Monuments that I would be near. I spend a month in Alamagordo, New Mexico and spent a lot of time out in White Sands. I never had a single friendly ranger approach me while I was there. Most of them were very indifferent, which is actually very different that most of my other experiences in NPs and NMs. I even had one of them tell me how disgusted she was that the government would allow "you people" such open access to "their" park. She then went on to tell me how my visiting the park was going to destroy the area forever. Needless to say, I wasn't very happy about that, and it has really jaded me about the NPS. I doubt that I will EVER visit White Sands again. Same goes for this Deer Valley place. If the "worker bees" don't want me there, then I doubt that I will have a good time visiting that museum. Remember, I would have to come up from Tucson to visit it so it would be a special trip, and there is no reason I make a special trip if I have a pre-concieved notion about the place. I might as well just go over the the IMAX and see a movie. In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 20 17:11:12 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brent Milner) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 10:11:12 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? In-Reply-To: <005401c2d8aa$eb23b120$91f50244@cx301817d> Message-ID: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0087_01C2D8C8.6552A8D0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Ken, your response hit it exactly. I'd suggest doing some research to find out who (as in a specific person) manages the DVRAC, and seeing how they would respond to the original complaint as well as your retort. I'm especially curious as to their stance on the Native American reaction to their center desecrating their sacred land. Some of those quotes from the original letter just seem too preposterous to have come from the management team of this facility. I almost want to assume it's a hoax of some kind. FroBro Q-Tip -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Ken Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2003 11:40 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? This is my response to the Geocahing forum. Along with the offensive photo. Hello, I would like to introduce myself as the owner of the virtual cache that has become the center of this controversy. The reason that I created the cache was to share with others some of the beauty and history that our state has to offer. I clearly posted on the cache page the hours that the museum is open and there was never a need for a visitor to “trespass”. In order to find the answers to the questions you never had to leave the public access paths that are maintained at the site. As far as the “offensive” photograph it consists of my daughter leaning up against a boulder with her arm above the petroglyph. This boulder is located directly in the walking path that a visitor takes to view the various petroglyphs at the site. Since this is a museum and this particular boulder was directly in the walking path I did not believe it was “off limits” The rest of the boulders are separated from visitors by short tubular fencing that clearly define restricted space. Since this boulder was directly in the visitors pathway, not separated by fencing, with no signs stating do not touch I did not believe there was any problem with my daughter posing by the glyph. My impression of the placement of the boulder directly in the walking path was that it was put there exactly for that purpose. This boulder is also clearly separated from main rock panels giving me the impression that it was there for public inspection. Many museums have similar displays that the public is allowed to touch and examine. We are sorry if we violated the museum rules but it was an honest mistake and this particular boulder should have been clearly marked, or fenced off. Whiling visiting the site, we spoke with the park ranger who happened to be Native American. During our conversation he explained how many of the local Arizona tribes once considered this site as a primary sacred location to them. He explained to us that many of these tribes felt betrayed and offended by the academic community taking over this sacred site and believed these people demonstrated little compassion, understanding or respect for their cultural heritage. Many of these tribes consider this site desecrated and will no longer visit this area because of the interference of the academic community. Is there a double standard that the museum is offended about a picture of a child touching “their” boulder, yet have no difficulty alienating entire tribes of Native Americans in order to conduct their research? The attitude we’ve derived appears to be elitist, encouraging academia but forgoing anyone else’s learning. The museum is run by Arizona State University, which is a publicly funded school. They lease the site from the Maricopa County Flood Control district, which is also publicly funded. I find the following statement interesting. “ I appreciate the removal of the Center from your website. It has attracted some visitors. However, we do not think your website is the kind of PR the Center is seeking” It interesting that they want to be selective in who can visit this publicly funded site. Who else is not welcome? The handicapped? Anglos’? Blacks? Hispanic’s? Hunters? Fishermen? 4x4 enthusiasts? Dog lovers? I do not recall seeing the sign on what they consider “acceptable” visitors. What is acceptable P.R.? National Geographic Magazine? Readers Digest? Playboy? Since when do they get to control freedom of speech regarding this publicly supported site? I also find this statement interesting: “Please remove the Deer Valley Rock Art Center from your website. I hope this request will not turn into a legal matter” What legal matter? There never, ever, was anything placed on this publicly owned property. This site is listed a “Phoenix Points of Pride” and “The National Register Of Historic Places”. Are they also going to be sued? Do a Web Search on “Deer Valley Rock Art Center” and see how many hits you get. Are they going to threaten legal action against all these sites? I seem to remember a little article called the 1st amendment that maybe they should read about. The sad thing is that as an educational institution they have missed an opportunity to help educated the Geocaching community about the importance of not touching petroglyphs. After learning of their concern I could have posted on the cache page about how the oils in fingerprints can actually harm a petroglyph. This opportunity is now lost because of their narrow minded thinking. Ken WhereRWee? ******************************************************************************* The contents of this email and any attachments are confidential. It is intended for the named recipient(s) only. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager or the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any one or make copies. ** eSafe scanned this email for viruses, vandals and malicious content ** ******************************************************************************* ------=_NextPart_000_0087_01C2D8C8.6552A8D0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Ken,=20 your response hit it exactly. I'd suggest doing some research to find out= who=20 (as in a specific person) manages the DVRAC, and seeing how they would re= spond=20 to the original complaint as well as your retort. I'm especially curious = as to=20 their stance on the Native American reaction to their center desecrating = their=20 sacred land.
 
Some=20 of those quotes from the original letter just seem too preposterous to ha= ve come=20 from the management team of this facility. I almost want to assume it's a= hoax=20 of some kind.
 
FroBro=20 Q-Tip
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From:=20 az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20 [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of=20 Ken
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2003 11:40 PM
To:=20 listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shell= y at it=20 a again or what?????

This is my response to the Geocahing for= um. Along=20 with the offensive photo.
 
 
 

Hello,

 

I would like to introduce myself as the owner of the virtual cac= he that=20 has become the center of this controversy. The reason that I created the = cache=20 was to share with others some of the beauty and history that our state ha= s to=20 offer.

 

I clearly posted on the cache page the hours that the museum is = open and=20 there was never a need for a visitor to =93trespass=94.  In order to find the answers to= the=20 questions you never had to leave the public access paths that are maintai= ned at=20 the site.

 

As far as the =93offensive=94 photograph it consists of my daugh= ter leaning=20 up against a boulder with her arm above the petroglyph. This boulder is l= ocated=20 directly in the walking path that a visitor takes to view the various=20 petroglyphs at the site. Since this is a museum and this particular bould= er was=20 directly in the walking path I did not believe it was =93off limits=94 Th= e rest of=20 the boulders are separated from visitors by short tubular fencing that cl= early=20 define restricted space. Since this boulder was directly in the visitors=20 pathway, not separated by fencing, with no signs stating do not touch I d= id not=20 believe there was any problem with my daughter posing by the glyph. My=20 impression of the placement of the boulder directly in the walking path w= as that=20 it was put there exactly for that purpose. This boulder is also clearly=20 separated from main rock panels giving me the impression that it was ther= e for=20 public inspection. Many museums have similar displays that the public is = allowed=20 to touch and examine. We are sorry if we violated the museum rules but it= was an=20 honest mistake and this particular boulder should have been clearly marke= d, or=20 fenced off.

 

Whiling visiting the site, we spoke with the par= k ranger=20 who happened to be Native American.&nbs= p;=20 During our conversation he explained how many of the local Arizona= tribes=20 once considered this site as a primary sacred location to them.  He explained to us that many of= these=20 tribes felt betrayed and offended by the academic community taking over t= his=20 sacred site and believed these people demonstrated little compassion,=20 understanding or respect for their cultural heritage.  Many of these tribes consider t= his site=20 desecrated and will no longer visit this area because of the interference= of the=20 academic community. =20

 

Is there a double standard that the museum is offended about a p= icture of=20 a child touching =93their=94 boulder, yet have no difficulty alienating e= ntire=20 tribes of Native Americans in order to conduct their research? The attitu= de=20 we=92ve derived appears to be elitist, encouraging academia but forgoing = anyone=20 else=92s learning.

 

The museum is run by Arizona State University, which is a public= ly funded=20 school. They lease the site from the Maricopa County Flood Control distri= ct,=20 which is also publicly funded. I find the following statement=20 interesting.

 

=93 I appreciate the removal= of the=20 Center from your website. It has attracted
some visitors. However, we do not think your webs= ite is=20 the kind of PR the
Center is=20 seeking=94

 

It interesting that they want to be selective in who can visit t= his=20 publicly funded site. Who else is not welcome? The handicapped? Anglos=92= ? Blacks?=20 Hispanic=92s? Hunters? Fishermen? 4x4 enthusiasts? Dog lovers? I do not r= ecall=20 seeing the sign on what they consider =93acceptable=94 visitors.

 

What is acceptable P.R.? National Geographic Magazine? Readers D= igest?=20 Playboy? Since when do they get to control freedom of speech regarding th= is=20 publicly supported site?

 

I also find this stateme= nt=20 interesting:

 =

=93Please remove the Dee= r Valley=20 Rock Art Center from your website. I hope
this request will not turn into a legal=20 matter=94

 =

What legal matter? There= never,=20 ever, was anything placed on this publicly owned property. This site is l= isted=20 a  =93Phoenix Points of Pri= de=94 and=20 =93The National Register Of Historic Places=94. Are they also going to be= sued? Do a=20 Web Search on =93Deer Valley Rock Art Center=94 and see how many hits you= get. Are=20 they going to threaten legal action against all these sites? I seem to re= member=20 a little article called the 1st amendment that maybe they shou= ld read=20 about.

 =

The sad thing is that as= an=20 educational institution they have missed an opportunity to help educated = the=20 Geocaching community about the importance of not touching petroglyphs. Af= ter=20 learning of their concern I could have posted on the cache page about how= the=20 oils in fingerprints can actually harm a petroglyph. This opportunity is = now=20 lost because of their narrow minded thinking.

 =

Ken

Wher= eRWee? =20 
******=
*************************************************************************
The contents of this email and any attachments are confidential.
It is intended for the named recipient(s) only.
If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager=
 or=20
the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any one or mak=
e=20
copies.

** eSafe scanned this email for viruses, vandals and malicious content **
*************************************************************************=
******
------=_NextPart_000_0087_01C2D8C8.6552A8D0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 20 17:19:43 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Nicol) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 09:19:43 -0800 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? Message-ID: >From: Chelby Geiss >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com >To: listserv@azgeocaching.com >Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? >Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 08:38:04 -0700 > >OK, IMO it is the wrong this to do to boycott the DVRAC until we know the >whole story. I am not convinced that this letter to geocaching.com is >truly from the "higher ups." I can't imagine that any of our local >struggling museums would bash something so severely that brings in support! > I know from working with people at the Pueblo Grande Museum that they >greatly appreciate the traffic from the virtual cache placed there by >Libby. May I suggest that when you do go to one of these museum virtuals, >sign the guest book and if there is a "How did you hear about us?" make >sure you put www.geocaching.com! They actually read those!!! > >I have emailed Kristy, my friend at the Pueblo Grande (who is an >archeologist and has absolutely nothing against geocaching), to see if she >knows any of the people at DVRAC (she's involved with a lot of the city >wide museum meetings and such, so hopefully she does). I'm still waiting >to hear back from her. > >And just like with the recent issues with Mesa Ranger District, PLEASE >remember that if you do contact DVRAC, remember to be level headed and >EDUCATION, EDUCATION, EDUCATION! > > >Team desertSol >Chelby & Kevin I agree with Chelby on not 'boycotting' the DVRAC. I don't think she was refering to my post (as I only said I wouldnt go simply because it doesnt interest me enough; I am more into it for the cache 'find'). I was thinking about that last night and thought that perhaps some of us should talk with the DVRAC's highest up people and see if they even know anything about this. I would show them all the printouts of the forum messages and such as well as the cache web page. Perhaps we can get this idiot volunteer worker (or whoever it was) brought forward. On the other note: I always sign the guest logs at the virtual cache museums as 'team ropingthewind' and make mention of geocaching. I have talked with a few of the attendants at the museums and they have been very happy with the 'virtual' cache at their museums. The attendants usually ask where I am from and what brought me to the museum and of course I tell them all about geocaching and the virtual that is at the museum and how it all works. They usually say "yea, we have had several people come in for that, sounds like fun!" and "Thanks for choosing our museum". Overall, they seem very pleased by the response. Scott Team Ropingthewind _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 20 17:43:14 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 10:43:14 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030220103819.029142e0@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 09:19 AM 2/20/2003 -0800, you wrote: >I was thinking about that last night and thought that perhaps some of us >should talk with the DVRAC's highest up people and see if they even know >anything about this. I would show them all the printouts of the forum >messages and such as well as the cache web page. Perhaps we can get this >idiot volunteer worker (or whoever it was) brought forward. Look at this from a little different angle. If we continue to go to places like this even though the "worker bees" don't want us there, there is no reason for the "higher ups" to take any action, people are still visiting the museum. If the management knows nothing about this, and they find out that people like me will no longer visit their museum, and they actually want people like me to visit, they will then make an effort to correct the problem so that people like me will decide that we should visit. If on the other hand the management is aware of this, and they are the ones that made all these statements, then it is clear that they don't want people like me there, and there is no way that I will go there. I'm all for writing a letter to the management, and am considering doing just that, but as it stands now, I will have a personal boycott against them. In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 20 21:01:36 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 14:01:36 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] the adventures caching today Message-ID: <003601c2d923$4292e0c0$a330b83f@fishkiller> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0033_01C2D8E8.94F6A6C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >From the third cache of the morning: Now after turning down the road that lead to the cache, I was greeted by = a couple of rather annoying dogs, as they were chasing my front tires, = and well I sure didn't want these barking critters near me when I went = for the find, so drove a little to the right and sure enough the darker = dog wasn't watching for bushes, then started to the left and sure enough = the white/brown dog was very intent upon eating my front tire that when = he ran into the bush knocked him for a flip... proceeded to the cache = with no further company... spotted a dead bird of prey a hawk I = think...traded for the blue fish and drove for the next cache, the dogs = got a late start chasing me so it was a short effort... >From the Sixth: Parked in the trailhead parking lot right next to a couple of older = gentlemen in a out of state car, I re-read the cache page and noticed = that the cache was only 505 feet away, grabbed my bag and got out of the = car. The Gentleman closest to me asked 'Are you a Geocacher?' I = hesitated, then thought of several responses, then replied "only when I = am not fishing", he responded I thought so as you were reading from a = notebook. When I told him there was a cache only 500 feet away he and = his friend who hadn't heard about Geocaching decided they could make the = short hike, I felt pretty great caching with another cacher from out of = state and caching with someone on their first cache hunt.. We made the walk to the cache and signed the log, I Traded a happy meal = toy for uh uh uh something then as we headed back, the group of hikers = they were waiting for walked the rest of the way with us.. I have no idea their name and the way he signed the log with a cute = little figure I hope to find that signature again in another cache.. A very nice day caching the only thing better would be uh uh uh Yes does it get any better?? ------=_NextPart_000_0033_01C2D8E8.94F6A6C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
 
From the third cache of the = morning:
 
Now after turning down the road that = lead to the=20 cache, I was greeted by a couple of rather annoying dogs, as they were = chasing=20 my front tires, and well I sure didn't want these barking critters near = me when=20 I went for the find, so drove a little to the right and sure enough the = darker=20 dog wasn't watching for bushes, then started to the left and sure enough = the=20 white/brown dog was very intent upon eating my front tire that when he = ran into=20 the bush knocked him for a flip... proceeded to the cache with no = further=20 company... spotted a dead bird of prey a hawk I think...traded for the = blue fish=20 and drove for the next cache, the dogs got a late start chasing me so it = was a=20 short effort...
 
 
From the Sixth:
 
Parked in the trailhead parking lot = right next to a=20 couple of older gentlemen in a out of state car, I re-read the cache = page and=20 noticed that the cache was only 505 feet away, grabbed my bag and got = out of the=20 car. The Gentleman closest to me asked 'Are you a Geocacher?' I = hesitated, then=20 thought of several responses, then replied "only when I am not fishing", = he=20 responded I thought so as you were reading from a notebook. When I told = him=20 there was a cache only 500 feet away he and his friend who hadn't heard = about=20 Geocaching decided they could make the short hike, I felt pretty great = caching=20 with another cacher from out of state and caching with someone on their = first=20 cache hunt..
 
We made the walk to the cache and = signed the log, I=20 Traded a happy meal toy for uh uh uh something then as we headed back, = the group=20 of hikers they were waiting for walked the rest of the way with=20 us..
 
I have no idea their name and the way = he signed the=20 log with a cute little figure I hope to find that signature again in = another=20 cache..
 
A very nice day caching the only thing = better would=20 be uh uh uh
 
 
Yes does it get any=20 better??
 
 
------=_NextPart_000_0033_01C2D8E8.94F6A6C0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 20 21:19:14 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:19:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] what????? To Ken..... Message-ID: <20030220131918.28291.h003.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Hi Ken, Just to let you know that I (and probably many here) have read all the entries on the forum, and I lend my support to you. I think a "virtual" in a PUBLIC place is entirely appropriate. The directions to this Rock place are posted in many public forums and a "virtual" geocache is NO different than another type of directions. Geez! And I understand your explanation about why the pic of your daughter and the rock was taken. Sounds like somebody got their undies in a bunch....has anybody spoken with somebody in charge there? If there is anything I can do help, let me know. I'm pretty good at writing pointed, yet relatively polite, letters and emails. Hang in there! Trisha "Lightning" Prescott PS your daughter is darling!! On Wed, 19 Feb 2003, "Ken" wrote: This is my response to the Geocahing forum. Along with the offensive photo.       Hello,   I would like to introduce myself as the owner of the virtual cache that has become the center of this controversy. The reason that I created the cache was to share with others some of the beauty and history that our state has to offer.   I clearly posted on the cache page the hours that the museum is open and there was never a need for a visitor to “trespass”.  In order to find the answers to the questions you never had to leave the public access paths that are maintained at the site.   As far as the “offensive” photograph it consists of my daughter leaning up against a boulder with her arm above the petroglyph. This boulder is located directly in the walking path that a visitor takes to view the various petroglyphs at the site. Since this is a museum and this particular boulder was directly in the walking path I did not believe it was “off limits” The rest of the boulders are separated from visitors by short tubular fencing that clearly define restricted space. Since this boulder was directly in the visitors pathway, not separated by fencing, with no signs stating do not touch I did not believe there was any problem with my daughter posing by the glyph. My impression of the placement of the boulder directly in the walking path was that it was put there exactly for that purpose. This boulder is also clearly separated from main rock panels giving me the impression that it was there for public inspection. Many museums have similar displays that the public is allowed to touch and examine. We are sorry if we violated the museum rules but it was an honest mistake and this particular boulder should have been clearly marked, or fenced off.   Whiling visiting the site, we spoke with the park ranger who happened to be Native American.  During our conversation he explained how many of the local Arizona tribes once considered this site as a primary sacred location to them.  He explained to us that many of these tribes felt betrayed and offended by the academic community taking over this sacred site and believed these people demonstrated little compassion, understanding or respect for their cultural heritage.  Many of these tribes consider this site desecrated and will no longer visit this area because of the interference of the academic community.    Is there a double standard that the museum is offended about a picture of a child touching “their” boulder, yet have no difficulty alienating entire tribes of Native Americans in order to conduct their research? The attitude we’ve derived appears to be elitist, encouraging academia but forgoing anyone else’s learning.   The museum is run by Arizona State University, which is a publicly funded school. They lease the site from the Maricopa County Flood Control district, which is also publicly funded. I find the following statement interesting.   “ I appreciate the removal of the Center from your website. It has attracted some visitors. However, we do not think your website is the kind of PR the Center is seeking”   It interesting that they want to be selective in who can visit this publicly funded site. Who else is not welcome? The handicapped? Anglos’? Blacks? Hispanic’s? Hunters? Fishermen? 4x4 enthusiasts? Dog lovers? I do not recall seeing the sign on what they consider “acceptable” visitors.   What is acceptable P.R.? National Geographic Magazine? Readers Digest? Playboy? Since when do they get to control freedom of speech regarding this publicly supported site?   I also find this statement interesting:   “Please remove the Deer Valley Rock Art Center from your website. I hopethis request will not turn into a legal matter”   What legal matter? There never, ever, was anything placed on this publicly owned property. This site is listed a  “Phoenix Points of Pride” and “The National Register Of Historic Places”. Are they also going to be sued? Do a Web Search on “Deer Valley Rock Art Center” and see how many hits you get. Are they going to threaten legal action against all these sites? I seem to remember a little article called the 1st amendment that maybe they should read about.   The sad thing is that as an educational institution they have missed an opportunity to help educated the Geocaching community about the importance of not touching petroglyphs. After learning of their concern I could have posted on the cache page about how the oils in fingerprints can actually harm a petroglyph. This opportunity is now lost because of their narrow minded thinking.   KenWhereRWee?  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 20 21:21:56 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:21:56 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] what????? Ken again.... Message-ID: <20030220132158.4582.h003.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Hi Ken again, I added the PS about your darling daughter and hit "send" before thanking you for putting up that "offensive" photo. I was curious as to the content of the pic and from all the broo-ha ha was expecting something closer to pornographic. Hardly! Trisha On Wed, 19 Feb 2003, "Ken" wrote: This is my response to the Geocahing forum. Along with the offensive photo.       Hello,   I would like to introduce myself as the owner of the virtual cache that has become the center of this controversy. The reason that I created the cache was to share with others some of the beauty and history that our state has to offer.   I clearly posted on the cache page the hours that the museum is open and there was never a need for a visitor to “trespass”.  In order to find the answers to the questions you never had to leave the public access paths that are maintained at the site.   As far as the “offensive” photograph it consists of my daughter leaning up against a boulder with her arm above the petroglyph. This boulder is located directly in the walking path that a visitor takes to view the various petroglyphs at the site. Since this is a museum and this particular boulder was directly in the walking path I did not believe it was “off limits” The rest of the boulders are separated from visitors by short tubular fencing that clearly define restricted space. Since this boulder was directly in the visitors pathway, not separated by fencing, with no signs stating do not touch I did not believe there was any problem with my daughter posing by the glyph. My impression of the placement of the boulder directly in the walking path was that it was put there exactly for that purpose. This boulder is also clearly separated from main rock panels giving me the impression that it was there for public inspection. Many museums have similar displays that the public is allowed to touch and examine. We are sorry if we violated the museum rules but it was an honest mistake and this particular boulder should have been clearly marked, or fenced off.   Whiling visiting the site, we spoke with the park ranger who happened to be Native American.  During our conversation he explained how many of the local Arizona tribes once considered this site as a primary sacred location to them.  He explained to us that many of these tribes felt betrayed and offended by the academic community taking over this sacred site and believed these people demonstrated little compassion, understanding or respect for their cultural heritage.  Many of these tribes consider this site desecrated and will no longer visit this area because of the interference of the academic community.    Is there a double standard that the museum is offended about a picture of a child touching “their” boulder, yet have no difficulty alienating entire tribes of Native Americans in order to conduct their research? The attitude we’ve derived appears to be elitist, encouraging academia but forgoing anyone else’s learning.   The museum is run by Arizona State University, which is a publicly funded school. They lease the site from the Maricopa County Flood Control district, which is also publicly funded. I find the following statement interesting.   “ I appreciate the removal of the Center from your website. It has attracted some visitors. However, we do not think your website is the kind of PR the Center is seeking”   It interesting that they want to be selective in who can visit this publicly funded site. Who else is not welcome? The handicapped? Anglos’? Blacks? Hispanic’s? Hunters? Fishermen? 4x4 enthusiasts? Dog lovers? I do not recall seeing the sign on what they consider “acceptable” visitors.   What is acceptable P.R.? National Geographic Magazine? Readers Digest? Playboy? Since when do they get to control freedom of speech regarding this publicly supported site?   I also find this statement interesting:   “Please remove the Deer Valley Rock Art Center from your website. I hopethis request will not turn into a legal matter”   What legal matter? There never, ever, was anything placed on this publicly owned property. This site is listed a  “Phoenix Points of Pride” and “The National Register Of Historic Places”. Are they also going to be sued? Do a Web Search on “Deer Valley Rock Art Center” and see how many hits you get. Are they going to threaten legal action against all these sites? I seem to remember a little article called the 1st amendment that maybe they should read about.   The sad thing is that as an educational institution they have missed an opportunity to help educated the Geocaching community about the importance of not touching petroglyphs. After learning of their concern I could have posted on the cache page about how the oils in fingerprints can actually harm a petroglyph. This opportunity is now lost because of their narrow minded thinking.   KenWhereRWee?  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 20 21:38:28 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:38:28 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email List-Serve, Search Engines, and YOU.... Message-ID: <20030220133829.22391.h010.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Hi all, Maybe everybody already knows this, but I found it curious and interesting (and a bit wierd).... I was messing around on Google the other day and put my name in and was surprised !!!!! to get a bunch of hits that were entries to this list serve.....somehow, the search engine has access to the emails here? Hmmmm? Anybody else find this strange? Trisha "Lightning" Prescott ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 20 21:46:05 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 14:46:05 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email List-Serve, Search Engines, and YOU.... In-Reply-To: <20030220133829.22391.h010.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.critica lpath.net> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030220144449.01ba2bb8@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 01:38 PM 2/20/2003 -0800, you wrote: >was surprised !!!!! to get a bunch of hits that were entries to this >list serve.....somehow, the search engine has access to the emails >here? Hmmmm? >Anybody else find this strange? Not at all. The list archives are available from the azgeocaching.com webpage. Since the messages can be accessed via a web browser, then the robots that the search engines use to crawl the webpages to update their databases will also see those messages, and then inlude them into the database. In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 20 21:48:58 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brent Milner) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 14:48:58 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email List-Serve, Search Engines, and YOU.... In-Reply-To: <20030220133829.22391.h010.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Message-ID: Trisha, I am guessing that the emails are also posted on the azgeocaching site, which google probably crawls to satisfy its searches. -FroBro Q-Tip -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of trisha@brasher.com Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2003 2:38 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email List-Serve, Search Engines, and YOU.... Hi all, Maybe everybody already knows this, but I found it curious and interesting (and a bit wierd).... I was messing around on Google the other day and put my name in and was surprised !!!!! to get a bunch of hits that were entries to this list serve.....somehow, the search engine has access to the emails here? Hmmmm? Anybody else find this strange? Trisha "Lightning" Prescott ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com ******************************************************************************* The contents of this email and any attachments are confidential. It is intended for the named recipient(s) only. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager or the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any one or make copies. ** eSafe scanned this email for viruses, vandals and malicious content ** ******************************************************************************* From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 20 22:36:35 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 14:36:35 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Search Engines Question Message-ID: <20030220143637.23328.h012.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Scott, Brent...thanks for the reply....(s)....I kinda figgered it was that way, it was just a surprise! I also find my "geocaching" pages when I searched under "Yavapai Jeep Posse" to see if our new website pops up yet. I used to post my cache pages with "Yavapai Co Jeep Posse" in the name/title until one of our Search/Sheriff deputies up here suggested I (and Flash) remove the Jeep Posse reference, since it was not an official mission of the Posse and he didn't want any of the recent "negative" impressions about geocaching and the land managers issues linked to the Posse. (He attended the recent land managers meeting up here in Prescott, and he geocaches...it was not a slam, it was a good idea.) Question, to the "puter gurus".....do you have to do anything special to get your website to pop up on Google or a similar search engine? We already put in keywords and categories when we built the site, but so far it does not come up when I search under "Search and Rescue" "Jeep Posse" "Yavapai SAR" etc.... Trisha On Thu, 20 Feb 2003, "Brent Milner" wrote: > > Trisha, > > I am guessing that the emails are also posted on the azgeocaching site, > which google probably crawls to satisfy its searches. > > -FroBro Q-Tip > > -----Original Message----- > From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com > [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of > trisha@brasher.com > Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2003 2:38 PM > To: listserv@azgeocaching.com > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email List-Serve, Search Engines, and YOU.... > > > Hi all, > Maybe everybody already knows this, but I found it curious and > interesting (and a bit wierd).... > I was messing around on Google the other day and put my name in and > was surprised !!!!! to get a bunch of hits that were entries to this > list serve.....somehow, the search engine has access to the emails > here? Hmmmm? > Anybody else find this strange? > Trisha "Lightning" > Prescott > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > "Although no one can go back and > make a brand new start, > Anyone can start from now and > make a brand new ending." > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > ******************************************************************************* > The contents of this email and any attachments are confidential. > It is intended for the named recipient(s) only. > If you have received this email in error please notify the system > manager or > the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any one or > make > copies. > > ** eSafe scanned this email for viruses, vandals and malicious content > ** > ******************************************************************************* > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 20 22:47:40 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 15:47:40 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Search Engines Question In-Reply-To: <20030220143637.23328.h012.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.critica lpath.net> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030220154534.01d63890@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 02:36 PM 2/20/2003 -0800, you wrote: >Question, to the "puter gurus".....do you have to do anything special >to get your website to pop up on Google or a similar search engine? We >already put in keywords and categories when we built the site, but so >far it does not come up when I search under "Search and Rescue" "Jeep >Posse" "Yavapai SAR" etc.... Most search engines have a means to submit a website to them. Even with that it usually takes time before the bots get out to crawl the page and add them to the database. There are companies that will be happy to take your money to do it, but there are a number of good tools out there that allow you to submit a site to multiple search engines for free. Check out www.tucows.com and look around for search engine submission tools, you should find many. After you get them submitted, you just have to wait, sometimes for a long time. In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 00:34:05 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 16:34:05 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Search Engines Question Message-ID: <20030220163407.7644.h012.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Thanks Scott, I will look into that! Trisha On Thu, 20 Feb 2003, Scott Wood wrote: > > At 02:36 PM 2/20/2003 -0800, you wrote: > > > >Question, to the "puter gurus".....do you have to do anything special > >to get your website to pop up on Google or a similar search engine? We > >already put in keywords and categories when we built the site, but so > >far it does not come up when I search under "Search and Rescue" "Jeep > >Posse" "Yavapai SAR" etc.... > > Most search engines have a means to submit a website to them. Even > with > that it usually takes time before the bots get out to crawl the page > and > add them to the database. There are companies that will be happy to > take > your money to do it, but there are a number of good tools out there > that > allow you to submit a site to multiple search engines for free. Check > out > www.tucows.com and look around for search engine submission tools, you > should find many. > > After you get them submitted, you just have to wait, sometimes for a > long time. > > > In liberty, > > Scott > > wood@myblueheaven.com > www.myblueheaven.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 04:25:45 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Steven Stringham) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 21:25:45 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Placement rules Message-ID: <3093.172.30.1.10.1045801545.squirrel@www.stringham-family.org> Ok, being relatively new to this wonderful sport, I have a couple of questions from the more experianced out there. I am planning on placing my first set of caches. Still very much in the planning stage, but I am getting the stuff together. My kids and I are really looking forward to our first hide. Has anybody written a summary of rules and contacts for Arizona lands and posted it anywhere. I know that there are the overarching geocaching.com rules, but what about specific rules for Arizona? I have really enjoyed the urban multicache sites. Everything from looking for labels on lightpoles, to number of items in a park playground. Good stuff. But, ultimately the caches are hidden in City of Phoenix park lands, or generally public parks. So, I place a cache in a bush in a park (lets say encanto park, just for grins - no I am not planning one there presently). Who do I ask for permission, or do I need to because it is a city park? What about Glendale, Peoria, etc.? What about a neighborhood park (like in a subdivision, not next to a school)? Or in a neighborhood flood control park? What about having clues on school property? Not the caches, but clues? I know that there are rules for visitors on school properties, are we to ask them to put a sticker or label on one of their light poles? National forest lands have been discussed since I have been on the thread, and are generally ok, but contact the ranger before/after the hide? Be careful not to place it near a archiological site. Reservation lands are off limits. I also see that they exist on state trust lands as well. What about the stuff just a few miles out of town? Do I need permission from somebody? I know that I need a permit to travel on these lands. But, what about hidding something out there? I have seen some of the junk left about out there (abandoned cars, wheels, beer cans, etc). I see that the general group tries to be good and clean up where possible. But, are we adding to it by putting our caches out there? I don't think so, but I want to get some opinions. Thanks, Steve, Team SteveJS From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 05:22:53 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Steven Stringham) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 22:22:53 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Caching Preferences Message-ID: <3125.172.30.1.10.1045804973.squirrel@www.stringham-family.org> Ok, second question. I am planning my first hides with my kids. We want to do something What are the preferences on finding caches out there. More specifically, with the urban caches. (I just tried to get my first off road cache today, with my minivan. Until I get another vehicle, the off road stuff is probably out). Do people prefer: 1) The "quick find", in and out type (micros, under the bench, by the whatever). 2) Microcaches, with a little bit of thought, maybe a small multicache. 3) Full sized caches, in and out. 4) Full sized, with some thought, small multicache. 5) Real puzzlers, with plenty of previous planning. You know the ones, decrypting a message (Valentoid), math problems (like the triangle problem in Tucson), knowledge of a foreign language (Li Ting), 6) Something that makes you hike a while to get there (out of the car, over the hill, through the woods, to grandmothers house we go....) 7) Virtuals, that take you someplace different (ie. the petroglyphs place, or the monuments by the state capitol). In other words, what kind of caches are your favorites? What makes you think that a found cache has been really enjoyable? Glad that you took the time? Thank you Steve, Team SteveJS From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 06:02:30 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 23:02:30 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Caching Preferences In-Reply-To: <3125.172.30.1.10.1045804973.squirrel@www.stringham-family.org> Message-ID: <00a401c2d96e$d1968dd0$697ba8c0@sbjr.com> Yes, those are all my favorites. ;-) Seriously, I tend to prefer either the full sized cache (where I can exchange trinkets) or a challenging puzzle. The realities of life have driven me to do more urban micro caches and even some virtuals lately. For me, above all else, I enjoy originality. You know, the one that makes you stand there shaking your head and chuckling. It doesn't really matter if it's a unique location or container or whatever, just not the same old same old. Many in your category 1 are like that and they get old fast. Bill Tomlinson CacheLess -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Steven Stringham Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2003 10:23 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Caching Preferences Ok, second question. I am planning my first hides with my kids. We want to do something What are the preferences on finding caches out there. More specifically, with the urban caches. (I just tried to get my first off road cache today, with my minivan. Until I get another vehicle, the off road stuff is probably out). Do people prefer: 1) The "quick find", in and out type (micros, under the bench, by the whatever). 2) Microcaches, with a little bit of thought, maybe a small multicache. 3) Full sized caches, in and out. 4) Full sized, with some thought, small multicache. 5) Real puzzlers, with plenty of previous planning. You know the ones, decrypting a message (Valentoid), math problems (like the triangle problem in Tucson), knowledge of a foreign language (Li Ting), 6) Something that makes you hike a while to get there (out of the car, over the hill, through the woods, to grandmothers house we go....) 7) Virtuals, that take you someplace different (ie. the petroglyphs place, or the monuments by the state capitol). In other words, what kind of caches are your favorites? What makes you think that a found cache has been really enjoyable? Glad that you took the time? Thank you Steve, Team SteveJS ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 06:12:08 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 23:12:08 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Caching Preferences In-Reply-To: <3125.172.30.1.10.1045804973.squirrel@www.stringham-family.org> Message-ID: <003e01c2d970$2ab9f630$c069dd18@OUR> > Do people prefer: You left out "all of the above". That gets my vote. > In other words, what kind of caches are your favorites? What > makes you think that a found cache has been really enjoyable? > Glad that you took the time? My favorites tend to fall into either of two categories. First is a cache where either the route or the destination is itself worth discovering (scenic beauty, interesting art, historical, unusual, or noteworthy in some way). The other is a cache where the fun is in figuring out how to get to it. That could be some kind of quiz or puzzle, or it could be something about the way the cache is hidden (camouflage, where it's been placed) that is clever or original. Steve Team Tierra Buena From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 06:12:08 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 23:12:08 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Placement rules In-Reply-To: <3093.172.30.1.10.1045801545.squirrel@www.stringham-family.org> Message-ID: <004701c2d970$2bbc23f0$c069dd18@OUR> > Has anybody written a summary of rules and contacts for > Arizona lands and posted it anywhere. The short answer is "No". One of the problems is that many agencies either have no policy, or have never published any policy they do have, which is effectively the same thing. > So, I place a cache in a bush in a park (lets say encanto > park, just for grins - no I am not planning one there > presently). Who do I ask for permission, or do I need to > because it is a city park? What about Glendale, Peoria, etc.? Phoenix Parks and Recreation is very aware of Geocaching, but that is because of their concern about the city mountain preserves. I don't know anything about the other cities you mentioned; perhaps someone else does. I have no idea how they would react to the idea of a cache in "let's say encanto park". There was one there that has since been archived. I doubt that the owner asked for permission. I confess that we placed "roadrunners" in a Phoenix city park without asking for permission. It was also the last cache we hid. My opinion now is you SHOULD ask for permission before placing any physical cache, but you should be prepared, depending on the agency involved and for any one of a number of reasons, for the fact that you may not get that consent. > > What about a neighborhood park (like in a subdivision, not > next to a school)? Or in a neighborhood flood control park? If the neighborhood park is HOA property, you probably won't get permission, even if you live there. > What about having clues on school property? Not the caches, > but clues? I know that there are rules for visitors on school > properties, are we to ask them to put a sticker or label on > one of their light poles? In this day and age there are some places you should simply avoid, and I would put schools on that list, along with airports, railroad tracks, and any "public" area that isn't freely open to the general public. > National forest lands have been discussed since I have been > on the thread, and are generally ok, but contact the ranger > before/after the hide? Be careful not to place it near a > archiological site. Contact the rangers before, unless you're willing to go back and retrieve it if you discover there is a problem. You may be placing a cache near an archaeological site without even realizing it. > Reservation lands are off limits. Absolutely. > I also see that they exist on state trust lands as well. What > about the stuff just a few miles out of town? Do I need > permission from somebody? I know that I need a permit to > travel on these lands. But, what about hidding something out > there? State Land Trust has been pretty clear that as long as you have a permit, they don't care what you're doing as long as you're not violating any posted rules. It's important to remember that the State Land Trust has no conservation mandate, so they can afford to be easygoing. Their only job is to sell the land, not to preserve or maintain it. > I have seen some of the junk left about out there > (abandoned cars, wheels, beer cans, etc). I see that the > general group tries to be good and clean up where possible. > But, are we adding to it by putting our caches out there? If you're talking about State Trust land specifically, nothing we do can possibly harm that land any more than the thoughtless people who have been harming it since long before civilians could even buy a GPS. But there are lots of other people and agencies who would consider your ammo can or plasticware as offensive as beer cans and shotgun shells. Steve Team Tierra Buena From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 06:14:30 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 23:14:30 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Caching Preferences In-Reply-To: <3125.172.30.1.10.1045804973.squirrel@www.stringham-family.org> References: <3125.172.30.1.10.1045804973.squirrel@www.stringham-family.org> Message-ID: <3E55C3C6.1020009@Snaptek.com> Steven Stringham wrote: >Has anybody written a summary of rules and contacts for Arizona lands and >posted it anywhere. I know that there are the overarching geocaching.com >rules, but what about specific rules for Arizona? > There isn't an all encompasing document as of yet that I know of, but it sounds like you pretty much have the jist of the idea. It basicly boils down to using your brain when hiding a cache and not puting it somethere that might cause a problem like the recent water treatment plant thing. Get permission first. If the land needs a permit, make sure you have one (the fines are VERY high if you dont). Avoid archeology sites, and just to be save, don't cover your cache with rocks since it just might accidentally be an arch site. Basically just follow short list of rules that are on geocaching.com and you should be allright... Now on to your next message... >In other words, what kind of caches are your favorites? What makes you >think that a found cache has been really enjoyable? Glad that you took the >time? > > This question pops up from time to time on the list, and what it amounts to is everyone likes different kinds of caches, some will ONLY do caches that have to be hiked to, some will only do caches that are within 200 feet of a road. Some like puzzles, some just want to find the darn thing with out any games. Basicly what it amount to is... Hide caches in a way that you would enjoy finding them. Put them in a special place that you like to go and introduce the rest of it to us. Twist our brains with a puzzle... put a cache below your window at work so you can see us find it... whatever makes you happy will make some other geocachers happy as well, it might not be the majority of cachers, but thats not really whats important. Brian Cluff Team Snaptek From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 06:28:55 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 23:28:55 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Log Volume I Message-ID: <004d01c2d972$83240430$c069dd18@OUR> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_004E_01C2D937.D6C52C30 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit For a change I have a question. We currently have "Dogcacher" on the Disabled List. It was reported that the container was rusting and the log book was filled, both of which are true. When we replace the cache, do we get to keep the full log book at home, or should we return it to the cache along with a new book? I'm inclined to keep it. Why? Imperial Eagle's first find of the cache at 2 in the morning (Darren, we hope you're well). Or how about this excerpt, just a year and three days ago: "1st of many, hopefully!" You got that right, RopingTheWind! Why would I want to risk notes like that to theft or plunder? At the same time, returning the log book to the cache lets other finders share them as well. But do finders read all the log entries? I don't think that's the case. And inevitably, someone will find a blank page in the old book, and post their now-out-of-sequence entry there. I don't think I've ever seen the issue discussed before. I'm open to anyone's thoughts. Steve Team Tierra Buena ------=_NextPart_000_004E_01C2D937.D6C52C30 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
For a = change I=20 have a question.
 
We = currently have=20 "Dogcacher" on the Disabled List. It was reported that the container was = rusting=20 and the log book was filled, both of which are true. When we replace the = cache,=20 do we get to keep the full log book at home, or should we return it to = the cache=20 along with a new book?
 
I'm = inclined=20 to keep it. Why? Imperial Eagle's first find of the cache at 2 = in the=20 morning (Darren, we hope you're well). Or how about this excerpt, just a = year=20 and three days ago: "1st of many, hopefully!" You got that right, = RopingTheWind!=20 Why would=20 I want to risk notes like that to theft or plunder?
 
At the = same time,=20 returning the log book to the cache lets other finders share them as = well.=20  But do finders read all the log entries? I don't think that's the = case.=20 And inevitably, someone will find a blank page in the old book, and post = their=20 now-out-of-sequence entry there.
 
I = don't think I've=20 ever seen the issue discussed before. I'm open to anyone's=20 thoughts.
 
Steve
Team = Tierra=20 Buena
------=_NextPart_000_004E_01C2D937.D6C52C30-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 06:46:43 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 23:46:43 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Log Volume I In-Reply-To: <004d01c2d972$83240430$c069dd18@OUR> References: <004d01c2d972$83240430$c069dd18@OUR> Message-ID: <3E55CB53.9080904@Snaptek.com> Team Tierra Buena wrote: >For a change I have a question. > >We currently have "Dogcacher" on the Disabled List. It was reported that >the container was rusting and the log book was filled, both of which are >true. When we replace the cache, do we get to keep the full log book at >home, or should we return it to the cache along with a new book? > We have always kept the ones we got out of our caches, we consider it our only reward for hiding the cache in the first place, plus there is just too great a risk that someone might take a picture of that little piece of history with their daughters arm over it, or more seriously it could get destroyed, or stolen. I have the log book from arizona's 12th cache, fremont saddle, all scanned. I can put it online if anyone is interested in reading it. I hope people continue to find that cache as a virtual, because in it's case the view is what made it worth it. Brian Cluff Team Snaptek From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 13:17:24 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 06:17:24 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Log Volume I References: <004d01c2d972$83240430$c069dd18@OUR> Message-ID: <002d01c2d9ab$93bd7fe0$8a10b83f@fishkiller> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_002A_01C2D970.E65219E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MessageWe kept the first log from our First cache and intend to continue = doing so with the caches that allow us too, that is the ones that are = not removed by non cachers :/. =20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Team Tierra Buena=20 To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2003 11:28 PM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Log Volume I For a change I have a question. We currently have "Dogcacher" on the Disabled List. It was reported = that the container was rusting and the log book was filled, both of = which are true. When we replace the cache, do we get to keep the full = log book at home, or should we return it to the cache along with a new = book? I'm inclined to keep it. Why? Imperial Eagle's first find of the cache = at 2 in the morning (Darren, we hope you're well). Or how about this = excerpt, just a year and three days ago: "1st of many, hopefully!" You = got that right, RopingTheWind! Why would I want to risk notes like that = to theft or plunder? At the same time, returning the log book to the cache lets other = finders share them as well. But do finders read all the log entries? I = don't think that's the case. And inevitably, someone will find a blank = page in the old book, and post their now-out-of-sequence entry there. I don't think I've ever seen the issue discussed before. I'm open to = anyone's thoughts. Steve Team Tierra Buena ------=_NextPart_000_002A_01C2D970.E65219E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
We kept the first log from our First = cache and=20 intend to continue doing so with the caches that allow us too, that = is the=20 ones that are not removed by non cachers :/.
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Team Tierra Buena =
To: az-geocaching@lis= tserv.azgeocaching.com=20
Sent: Thursday, February 20, = 2003 11:28=20 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Log = Volume=20 I

For = a change I=20 have a question.
 
We = currently=20 have "Dogcacher" on the Disabled List. It was reported that the = container was=20 rusting and the log book was filled, both of which are true. When we = replace=20 the cache, do we get to keep the full log book at home, or should we = return it=20 to the cache along with a new book?
 
I'm = inclined=20 to keep it. Why? Imperial Eagle's first find of the cache at = 2 in=20 the morning (Darren, we hope you're well). Or how about this excerpt, = just a=20 year and three days ago: "1st of many, hopefully!" You got that right, = RopingTheWind! Why would I want to risk notes like that to = theft or=20 plunder?
 
At = the same=20 time, returning the log book to the cache lets other finders share = them as=20 well.  But do finders read all the log entries? I don't think = that's the=20 case. And inevitably, someone will find a blank page in the old book, = and post=20 their now-out-of-sequence entry there.
 
I = don't think=20 I've ever seen the issue discussed before. I'm open to anyone's=20 thoughts.
 
Steve
Team = Tierra=20 Buena
------=_NextPart_000_002A_01C2D970.E65219E0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 13:27:46 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 06:27:46 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Placement rules References: <3093.172.30.1.10.1045801545.squirrel@www.stringham-family.org> Message-ID: <003c01c2d9ad$06550540$8a10b83f@fishkiller> I think it is important to keep in mind is, what will be the effect of my cache?? in other words when people start showing up and act elusive about why they are there.... with one cache it caused a security guard to actually work.. with another it caused a person in the neighborhood to block the access road... still one that made you stop and look at something that you have been driving past for months and not knowing it was there.. then another that was so public that people thought drugs were being hid and taken.. it boils down to common sense and honesty ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steven Stringham" To: Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2003 9:25 PM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Placement rules > Ok, being relatively new to this wonderful sport, I have a couple of > questions from the more experianced out there. I am planning on placing my > first set of caches. Still very much in the planning stage, but I am > getting the stuff together. My kids and I are really looking forward to > our first hide. > > Has anybody written a summary of rules and contacts for Arizona lands and > posted it anywhere. I know that there are the overarching geocaching.com > rules, but what about specific rules for Arizona? > > I have really enjoyed the urban multicache sites. Everything from looking > for labels on lightpoles, to number of items in a park playground. Good > stuff. But, ultimately the caches are hidden in City of Phoenix park > lands, or generally public parks. > > So, I place a cache in a bush in a park (lets say encanto park, just for > grins - no I am not planning one there presently). Who do I ask for > permission, or do I need to because it is a city park? What about > Glendale, Peoria, etc.? > > What about a neighborhood park (like in a subdivision, not next to a > school)? Or in a neighborhood flood control park? > > What about having clues on school property? Not the caches, but clues? I > know that there are rules for visitors on school properties, are we to ask > them to put a sticker or label on one of their light poles? > > National forest lands have been discussed since I have been on the thread, > and are generally ok, but contact the ranger before/after the hide? Be > careful not to place it near a archiological site. > Reservation lands are off limits. > > I also see that they exist on state trust lands as well. What about the > stuff just a few miles out of town? Do I need permission from somebody? I > know that I need a permit to travel on these lands. But, what about > hidding something out there? I have seen some of the junk left about out > there (abandoned cars, wheels, beer cans, etc). I see that the general > group tries to be good and clean up where possible. But, are we adding to > it by putting our caches out there? I don't think so, but I want to get > some opinions. > > Thanks, > Steve, > Team SteveJS > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 16:51:54 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jason Poulter) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 09:51:54 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email List-Serve, Search Engines, and YOU.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E56592A.9000008@snaptek.com> YUP!!! jason Brent Milner wrote: > Trisha, > > I am guessing that the emails are also posted on the azgeocaching site, > which google probably crawls to satisfy its searches. > > -FroBro Q-Tip > > -----Original Message----- > From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com > [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of > trisha@brasher.com > Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2003 2:38 PM > To: listserv@azgeocaching.com > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email List-Serve, Search Engines, and YOU.... > > > Hi all, > Maybe everybody already knows this, but I found it curious and > interesting (and a bit wierd).... > I was messing around on Google the other day and put my name in and > was surprised !!!!! to get a bunch of hits that were entries to this > list serve.....somehow, the search engine has access to the emails > here? Hmmmm? > Anybody else find this strange? > Trisha "Lightning" > Prescott > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > "Although no one can go back and > make a brand new start, > Anyone can start from now and > make a brand new ending." > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > ******************************************************************************* > The contents of this email and any attachments are confidential. > It is intended for the named recipient(s) only. > If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager or > the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any one or make > copies. > > ** eSafe scanned this email for viruses, vandals and malicious content ** > ******************************************************************************* > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 17:00:31 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 10:00:31 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Log Volume I In-Reply-To: <3E55CB53.9080904@Snaptek.com> References: <004d01c2d972$83240430$c069dd18@OUR> <3E55CB53.9080904@Snaptek.com> Message-ID: <3E565B2F.7020907@Snaptek.com> Brian Cluff wrote: > I have the log book from arizona's 12th cache, fremont saddle, all > scanned. I can put it online if anyone is interested in reading it. > I hope people continue to find that cache as a virtual, because in > it's case the view is what made it worth it. I went ahead and posted the log book to the photo album section of AzGeocaching.com for anyone the is interested. http://azgeocaching.com/photos/ Brian Cluff Team Snaptek From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 17:04:21 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jerry Nelson) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 10:04:21 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Log Volume I References: <004d01c2d972$83240430$c069dd18@OUR> Message-ID: <004501c2d9cb$4729b7a0$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0042_01C2D990.9A90E3E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MessageI see how this is a difficult choice. We all know that one of = the enjoyments of finding a cache is to read old logs. I'd say that most = of the time it would be better to leave old log books in the cache = except where the chance of losing them is unusually high or they have = unusual value. Mark them as "Archived--write logs in other book" or = something like that. Even if it was eventually plundered at least a few = more would be able to read it. There certainly are exceptions and the = final choice should be with the cache owner. He or she has a right to = preserve the history of his own efforts. At minimum a note might be = placed at the beginning of the new book indicating the first had been = removed. Cindy suggested that we someday hold an event cache where everyone = brings old log books to view. Maybe after many years there will be a = National Museum of Geocaching. Shelly could be invited to be curator. Jerry Offtrail ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Team Tierra Buena=20 To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2003 11:28 PM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Log Volume I For a change I have a question. We currently have "Dogcacher" on the Disabled List. It was reported = that the container was rusting and the log book was filled, both of = which are true. When we replace the cache, do we get to keep the full = log book at home, or should we return it to the cache along with a new = book? I'm inclined to keep it. Why? Imperial Eagle's first find of the cache = at 2 in the morning (Darren, we hope you're well). Or how about this = excerpt, just a year and three days ago: "1st of many, hopefully!" You = got that right, RopingTheWind! Why would I want to risk notes like that = to theft or plunder? At the same time, returning the log book to the cache lets other = finders share them as well. But do finders read all the log entries? I = don't think that's the case. And inevitably, someone will find a blank = page in the old book, and post their now-out-of-sequence entry there. I don't think I've ever seen the issue discussed before. I'm open to = anyone's thoughts. Steve Team Tierra Buena ------=_NextPart_000_0042_01C2D990.9A90E3E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
I see how this is a difficult = choice.  We=20 all know that one of the enjoyments of finding a cache is to read old = logs. I'd=20 say that most of the time it would be better to leave old log books in = the cache=20 except where the chance of losing them is unusually high or = they have=20 unusual value.  Mark them as "Archived--write logs in other book" = or=20 something like that. Even if it was eventually plundered at least a few = more=20 would be able to read it.  There certainly are exceptions and the = final=20 choice should be with the cache owner.  He or she has a right to = preserve=20 the history of his own efforts.  At minimum a note might be placed = at the=20 beginning of the new book indicating the first had been = removed.
 
Cindy suggested that we someday hold an = event cache=20 where everyone brings old log books to view.  Maybe after many = years there=20 will be a National Museum of Geocaching.  Shelly could be invited = to be=20 curator.
 
Jerry
Offtrail
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Team Tierra Buena =
To: az-geocaching@lis= tserv.azgeocaching.com=20
Sent: Thursday, February 20, = 2003 11:28=20 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Log = Volume=20 I

For = a change I=20 have a question.
 
We = currently=20 have "Dogcacher" on the Disabled List. It was reported that the = container was=20 rusting and the log book was filled, both of which are true. When we = replace=20 the cache, do we get to keep the full log book at home, or should we = return it=20 to the cache along with a new book?
 
I'm = inclined=20 to keep it. Why? Imperial Eagle's first find of the cache at = 2 in=20 the morning (Darren, we hope you're well). Or how about this excerpt, = just a=20 year and three days ago: "1st of many, hopefully!" You got that right, = RopingTheWind! Why would I want to risk notes like that to = theft or=20 plunder?
 
At = the same=20 time, returning the log book to the cache lets other finders share = them as=20 well.  But do finders read all the log entries? I don't think = that's the=20 case. And inevitably, someone will find a blank page in the old book, = and post=20 their now-out-of-sequence entry there.
 
I = don't think=20 I've ever seen the issue discussed before. I'm open to anyone's=20 thoughts.
 
Steve
Team = Tierra=20 Buena
------=_NextPart_000_0042_01C2D990.9A90E3E0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 17:08:06 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 10:08:06 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Placement rules In-Reply-To: <003c01c2d9ad$06550540$8a10b83f@fishkiller> References: <3093.172.30.1.10.1045801545.squirrel@www.stringham-family.org> <003c01c2d9ad$06550540$8a10b83f@fishkiller> Message-ID: <3E565CF6.5010807@Snaptek.com> Regan Smith wrote: >then another that was so public that people thought drugs were being hid and >taken.. > > I really wonder if the above is the reason that metro pecan gto plundered, our very first, and I think out coolest, urban cache. (It was bolted to pecan tree in plain sight with a padlock on it). I wonder if the person that destroyed it was after the drugs and money they they were sure that were in there. They must have been very dissappointed to find a couple of pocket games and business cards in there, I wonder if they tried to smoke what was inside it anyway just to make their effort worth it. :) Does anyone know if the bent up amo can shell is still bolted to the tree? Brian Cluff Team Snaptek From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 17:04:21 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 10:04:21 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Log Volume I In-Reply-To: <004d01c2d972$83240430$c069dd18@OUR> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030221100200.02a18ac0@mail.myblueheaven.com> --=====================_3574179==_.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 11:28 PM 2/20/2003 -0700, you wrote: >I'm inclined to keep it. Why? Imperial Eagle's first find of the cache at >2 in the morning (Darren, we hope you're well). Or how about this excerpt, >just a year and three days ago: "1st of many, hopefully!" You got that >right, RopingTheWind! Why would I want to risk notes like that to theft or >plunder? I would not hesitate to keep it. I enjoy reading past logs when visiting a cache, but I do limit myself to the logs in the current log book. I have found caches that have the old books also, but I tend to not spend the large amount of time that would be required to read multiple books. I saw it also posted that someone has scanned their old log entries, and I think that is what I will do when I get to that point. In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com --=====================_3574179==_.ALT Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" At 11:28 PM 2/20/2003 -0700, you wrote:

I'm inclined to keep it. Why? Imperial Eagle's first find of the cache at 2 in the morning (Darren, we hope you're well). Or how about this excerpt, just a year and three days ago: "1st of many, hopefully!" You got that right, RopingTheWind! Why would I want to risk notes like that to theft or plunder?

I would not hesitate to keep it.  I enjoy reading past logs when visiting a cache, but I do limit myself to the logs in the current log book.  I have found caches that have the old books also, but I tend to not spend the large amount of time that would be required to read multiple books.

I saw it also posted that someone has scanned their old log entries, and I think that is what I will do when I get to that point.


In liberty,

Scott

wood@myblueheaven.com
--=====================_3574179==_.ALT-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 17:12:34 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 10:12:34 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Log Volume I In-Reply-To: <004501c2d9cb$4729b7a0$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net> References: <004d01c2d972$83240430$c069dd18@OUR> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030221101154.02a221e0@mail.myblueheaven.com> --=====================_3574209==_.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 10:04 AM 2/21/2003 -0700, you wrote: >Cindy suggested that we someday hold an event cache where everyone brings >old log books to view. Maybe after many years there will be a National >Museum of Geocaching. Shelly could be invited to be curator. I think that bringing old log books to even caches is a great idea. In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com --=====================_3574209==_.ALT Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" At 10:04 AM 2/21/2003 -0700, you wrote:

Cindy suggested that we someday hold an event cache where everyone brings old log books to view.  Maybe after many years there will be a National Museum of Geocaching.  Shelly could be invited to be curator.

I think that bringing old log books to even caches is a great idea.



In liberty,

Scott

wood@myblueheaven.com
--=====================_3574209==_.ALT-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 17:22:42 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jason Poulter) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 10:22:42 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Log Volume I In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030221100200.02a18ac0@mail.myblueheaven.com> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030221100200.02a18ac0@mail.myblueheaven.com> Message-ID: <3E566062.3000801@snaptek.com> maybe we could start a arizona cache log museum here on the azgeocaching web site... people would bring their old log books to us and we could scan them and put them on line!!! for everyone to enjoy... i also have LoneMountains first log book also that i need to scan!! jason Scott Wood wrote: > At 11:28 PM 2/20/2003 -0700, you wrote: > >> I'm inclined to keep it. Why? Imperial Eagle's first find of the cache >> at 2 in the morning (Darren, we hope you're well). Or how about this >> excerpt, just a year and three days ago: "1st of many, hopefully!" You >> got that right, RopingTheWind! Why would I want to risk notes like >> that to theft or plunder? > > > I would not hesitate to keep it. I enjoy reading past logs when > visiting a cache, but I do limit myself to the logs in the current log > book. I have found caches that have the old books also, but I tend to > not spend the large amount of time that would be required to read > multiple books. > > I saw it also posted that someone has scanned their old log entries, and > I think that is what I will do when I get to that point. > > > In liberty, > > Scott > > wood@myblueheaven.com > www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 17:30:58 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 10:30:58 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Log Volume I In-Reply-To: <004501c2d9cb$4729b7a0$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net> References: <004d01c2d972$83240430$c069dd18@OUR> <004501c2d9cb$4729b7a0$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net> Message-ID: <3E566252.9050004@Snaptek.com> Jerry Nelson wrote: >Cindy suggested that we someday hold an event cache where everyone brings old log books to view. Maybe after many years there will be a National Museum of Geocaching. Shelly could be invited to be curator. > > I wonder if geocaching will get old enough that you can't place a geocache near another geocaching because you might disturb the area around the first geocache. Cache stewards does have a nice ring to it. I also wonder if the govt or someone would someday put a well marked trial leading to the site of a historical geocache. Hopefully I will still be alive and I can tell my great grandkids about how we went out of our way NOT to make a trail to that cache, and now someone was paid to put one in. OK... gotta get my mind out of the sarcastic humor zone..... Brian Cluff Team Snaptek From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 17:30:42 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 10:30:42 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Log Volume I In-Reply-To: <3E566062.3000801@snaptek.com> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030221100200.02a18ac0@mail.myblueheaven.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20030221100200.02a18ac0@mail.myblueheaven.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030221102915.028b65e0@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 10:22 AM 2/21/2003 -0700, you wrote: >maybe we could start a arizona cache log museum here on the azgeocaching >web site... people would bring their old log books to us and we could scan >them and put them on line!!! for everyone to enjoy... > >i also have LoneMountains first log book also that i need to scan!! I have the initial logs for What "A" Cache that I will be happy scan and contribute. In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 17:47:37 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jason Poulter) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 10:47:37 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Log Volume I In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030221102915.028b65e0@mail.myblueheaven.com> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030221100200.02a18ac0@mail.myblueheaven.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20030221100200.02a18ac0@mail.myblueheaven.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20030221102915.028b65e0@mail.myblueheaven.com> Message-ID: <3E566639.6020702@snaptek.com> sounds good!!! go for it!!! anyone with old log books they want to scan and send to us to add to the AZ Geocaching Museum.... scan them up and send them to us!!! scan at 150 DPI or if you want to contatct us about some other method of getting the logs to us email them to us at logscans@azgeocaching.com jason Scott Wood wrote: > At 10:22 AM 2/21/2003 -0700, you wrote: > >> maybe we could start a arizona cache log museum here on the >> azgeocaching web site... people would bring their old log books to us >> and we could scan them and put them on line!!! for everyone to enjoy... >> >> i also have LoneMountains first log book also that i need to scan!! > > > I have the initial logs for What "A" Cache that I will be happy scan and > contribute. > > > In liberty, > > Scott > > wood@myblueheaven.com > www.myblueheaven.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 17:51:13 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 10:51:13 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] gasoline and caches Message-ID: <006e01c2d9d1$d3fa8c80$9911b83f@fishkiller> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_006B_01C2D997.26B9E000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Here are some interesting facts about the companies that import oil that eventually ends up in our cars' fuel tanks. Major companies that import Middle Eastern oil > > Shell........................... ... 205,742,000 barrels > Chevron/Texaco......... .......144,332,000 barrels > Exxon/Mobil.............. ...... 130,082,000 barrels > Marathon/Speedway... .......117,740,000 barrels > Amoco................... .......... ...62,231,000 barrels > If you do the math at $30/barrel, these imports > amount to over $18 BILLION aid to the terrorist. > > Here are some large companies that do not import Middle Eastern oil: > Citgo............... 0 barrels > Sunoco............ 0 barrels > Conoco........... 0 barrels > Sinclair............. 0 barrels > BP/Phillips..... 0 barrels > Hess................. 0 barrels My friend then added: A friend sent me these facts in an e-mail that was intended to make us all aware of the connection between Middle East oil, the "gas stations" that we fill up at, and financing terrorism. Here is the question: Can I have an effect on the dependence of Middle Eastern imported oil by choosing a filling station that does not import Middle Eastern oil? after spending a quarter of a tank on a few finds I thought I was glad = that I used Phillips gas. ------=_NextPart_000_006B_01C2D997.26B9E000 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Here are some interesting facts about the companies
that import = oil that=20 eventually ends up in our cars'
fuel tanks.

Major companies = that=20 import Middle Eastern oil
>
> = Shell...........................=20 ...  205,742,000
barrels
> Chevron/Texaco.........=20 .......144,332,000 barrels
> Exxon/Mobil..............  = ......=20 130,082,000
barrels
> Marathon/Speedway... .......117,740,000=20 barrels
> Amoco................... .......... =20 ...62,231,000
barrels
> If you do the math at $30/barrel, these = imports
> amount to over $18 BILLION aid to the=20 terrorist.
>

> Here are some large companies that do not = import
Middle Eastern oil:
> Citgo............... 0 = barrels
>=20 Sunoco............ 0 barrels
> Conoco........... 0 barrels
> = Sinclair............. 0 barrels
> BP/Phillips..... 0 = barrels
>=20 Hess................. 0 barrels
 
My friend then added:
 
A friend sent me these facts in an e-mail that was
intended to = make us=20 all aware of the connection
between Middle East oil, the "gas = stations" that=20 we
fill up at, and financing terrorism.
Here is the = question:
Can I=20 have an effect on the dependence of Middle
Eastern imported oil by = choosing a=20 filling station
that does not import Middle Eastern oil?
 
 
after spending a quarter of a tank on a = few finds I=20 thought I was glad that I used Phillips gas.
------=_NextPart_000_006B_01C2D997.26B9E000-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 18:04:37 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 11:04:37 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Log Volume I References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030221100200.02a18ac0@mail.myblueheaven.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20030221100200.02a18ac0@mail.myblueheaven.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20030221102915.028b65e0@mail.myblueheaven.com> <3E566639.6020702@snaptek.com> Message-ID: <009501c2d9d3$b34ba080$9911b83f@fishkiller> Is it ok to stop by today? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jason Poulter" To: Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 10:47 AM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Log Volume I > sounds good!!! go for it!!! anyone with old log books they want to scan > and send to us to add to the AZ Geocaching Museum.... > > scan them up and send them to us!!! > > scan at 150 DPI > > or if you want to contatct us about some other method of getting the > logs to us > > email them to us at logscans@azgeocaching.com > > > > jason > > Scott Wood wrote: > > At 10:22 AM 2/21/2003 -0700, you wrote: > > > >> maybe we could start a arizona cache log museum here on the > >> azgeocaching web site... people would bring their old log books to us > >> and we could scan them and put them on line!!! for everyone to enjoy... > >> > >> i also have LoneMountains first log book also that i need to scan!! > > > > > > I have the initial logs for What "A" Cache that I will be happy scan and > > contribute. > > > > > > In liberty, > > > > Scott > > > > wood@myblueheaven.com > > www.myblueheaven.com > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 18:36:57 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mark Heitowit) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 11:36:57 -0700 Subject: [Re: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what?????] Message-ID: <700HBusK64176S18.1045852617@uwdvg018.cms.usa.net> Last spring we took our Cub Scout den there for a tour. The Park Ranger told the boys to "touch this rock all you want and get it out of your system". The rock apparently was placed where it is for people to touch, so they don't touch the protected ones behind the fence. Why should anyone who works there be offended by the picture in question? > --------------------------------------------- > Attachment: Circle Of Life.JPG > MIME Type: image/jpeg > --------------------------------------------- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 18:42:40 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 10:42:40 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Log Volume I Message-ID: <20030221104241.29197.h012.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> I enjoyed *trying* to read the old logs that are scanned in, a great idew, but maybe it is my computer that made it difficult to read the pages, I did make out that Bob Renner was first to the Fremont Saddle cache, unless one of the two pages before his was a log and not instructions.....maybe I need new glasses or did anybody else have trouble reading it? I have the old log books from my original Mingus/Take My breath Away and Unity caches (both relocated). I felt that as cache owner it was my right to keep the logs, it is one of the only rewards cache hiders get ( along with the online logs) for the effort of putting out a cache. The number of "full log books removed" is very small relative to the much larger number of caches that have plenty of logs to read. Keeping the logs preserved (scanned in, bring to an event) are all good ideas. I keep the old log pages with a print out of the full cache page and all the logs at the time I archived the caches. Trisha On Fri, 21 Feb 2003, Jason Poulter wrote: > > maybe we could start a arizona cache log museum here on the > azgeocaching > web site... people would bring their old log books to us and we could > scan them and put them on line!!! for everyone to enjoy... > > i also have LoneMountains first log book also that i need to scan!! > > jason > > > Scott Wood wrote: > > At 11:28 PM 2/20/2003 -0700, you wrote: > > > >> I'm inclined to keep it. Why? Imperial Eagle's first find of the > cache > >> at 2 in the morning (Darren, we hope you're well). Or how about > this > >> excerpt, just a year and three days ago: "1st of many, hopefully!" > You > >> got that right, RopingTheWind! Why would I want to risk notes like > >> that to theft or plunder? > > > > > > I would not hesitate to keep it. I enjoy reading past logs when > > visiting a cache, but I do limit myself to the logs in the current > log > > book. I have found caches that have the old books also, but I tend > to > > not spend the large amount of time that would be required to read > > multiple books. > > > > I saw it also posted that someone has scanned their old log entries, > and > > I think that is what I will do when I get to that point. > > > > > > In liberty, > > > > Scott > > > > wood@myblueheaven.com > > www.myblueheaven.com <http://www.myblueheaven.com/>; > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 18:59:22 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Tim Giron) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:59:22 -0500 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Log Volume I Message-ID: <20030221185920.VNAY22316.fed1mtao05.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net> They look very readable to me. The full size pics are very clear. This is a great idea... I will be looking into scanning the books that I have pulled from our caches as well... Trisha - are you trying to read the thumbnails? Click on the file name at the bottom of the thumbnail and you'll get a full size pic (with next and previous links to follow)... Tim Team AZFastFeet From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 19:09:07 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 11:09:07 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Log Volume I Message-ID: <20030221110908.6989.h009.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Ohhh.....DUH....thanks Tim! (It's been a rough day already....) Trisha On Fri, 21 Feb 2003, Tim Giron wrote: > > They look very readable to me. The full size pics are very clear. > This is a great idea... I will be looking into scanning the books that > I have pulled from our caches as well... > > Trisha - are you trying to read the thumbnails? Click on the file > name at the bottom of the thumbnail and you'll get a full size pic > (with next and previous links to follow)... > > Tim > Team AZFastFeet > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 19:24:56 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 12:24:56 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Log Volume I In-Reply-To: <20030221185920.VNAY22316.fed1mtao05.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net> References: <20030221185920.VNAY22316.fed1mtao05.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net> Message-ID: <3E567D08.3070600@snaptek.com> Tim Giron wrote: > Trisha - are you trying to read the thumbnails? Click on the file name at the bottom of the thumbnail and you'll get a full size pic (with next and previous links to follow)... I also think your trying to read the thumbnails since Bob Renner is about the only person's name I can make out. You can also click on the thumbnail itself to get the full sizes picture. The same goes for the other pictures in the photo album. Once you get to the bigger version, most likely you will be able to get even bigger versions. The pictures from my camera take up 4 or more screen sizes at full resolution. I put them up there at full res so that people can have prints made of thatever I have taken if they want. Brian Cluff Team Snaptek From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 19:50:57 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 12:50:57 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Log Volume I In-Reply-To: <3E567D08.3070600@snaptek.com> References: <20030221185920.VNAY22316.fed1mtao05.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net> <3E567D08.3070600@snaptek.com> Message-ID: <3E568321.3040908@snaptek.com> Brian Cluff wrote: > I also think your trying to read the thumbnails since Bob Renner is > about the only person's name I can make out. You can also click on the > thumbnail itself to get the full sizes picture. The same goes for the > other pictures in the photo album. Once you get to the bigger version, > most likely you will be able to get even bigger versions. The pictures > from my camera take up 4 or more screen sizes at full resolution. I put > them up there at full res so that people can have prints made of > thatever I have taken if they want. I forgot to add... if you want to make a note that everyone can see on your images, just make a plain text file that has the exact same name at the image but ends in .txt instead of the image type. EX ourgeocache.jpg <-- The image ourgeocache.txt <-- the note you want displayed An example of a not on an image can be seen at: http://azgeocaching.com/photos/?mode=album&album=logbooks/Fremont_Saddle-Team_Snaptek and an interesting note it is... Brian Cluff Team Snaptek From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 20:28:37 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Tim Giron) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 15:28:37 -0500 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Photo albums software Message-ID: <20030221202833.WIQE20117.fed1mtao08.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net> Is the software behind the photo albums on the azgeocaching site custom written or something that is downloadable from somewhere? I'd like to add similar functionality to another site. Tim Team AZFastFeet From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 21:10:29 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 14:10:29 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Photo albums software In-Reply-To: <20030221202833.WIQE20117.fed1mtao08.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net> References: <20030221202833.WIQE20117.fed1mtao08.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net> Message-ID: <3E5695C5.4080807@snaptek.com> It's custom written...sorta, but I don't have a problem giving you a copy. The only thing you need it a server that is running a PHP enabled web server, which are extremely common. The "sorta" means that it was origionally a program called PHPpix, but it was a complete mess and by the time I got done "fixing" it, there wasn't really anything at all left of the origional program. I even managed to cut the 50K worth of program code down to about 20ish-K and still added a bunch of features... that how crappy the origional code was. Lemme know if you can use, and we'll make arrangements to get you the code. Brian Cluff Team Snaptek Tim Giron wrote: > Is the software behind the photo albums on the azgeocaching site custom written or something that is downloadable from somewhere? > > I'd like to add similar functionality to another site. > > Tim > Team AZFastFeet > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 21 21:23:38 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mak Smith) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:23:38 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] RE: Caching Placements Message-ID: <20030221212338.65726.qmail@web21503.mail.yahoo.com> --0-1607647261-1045862618=:64883 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Generally, I would prefer urban micro caches in nice parks. It doesn't even have to be something original, just maybe in a very nice location that I can really enjoy. Multi caches aren't bad either. I like the ones where there are maybe a few steps with posted coordinates (like Keychain Cache). Virtuals are o.k., but I would prefer actually finding a container and signing a log. I do not prefer puzzle type caches though mainly becuase I don't want to spend the time to figure them out. I prefer the "coordinates" take you right to the cache kind of thing. Frieza -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Steven Stringham Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2003 10:23 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Caching Preferences Ok, second question. I am planning my first hides with my kids. We want to do something What are the preferences on finding caches out there. More specifically, with the urban caches. (I just tried to get my first off road cache today, with my minivan. Until I get another vehicle, the off road stuff is probably out). Do people prefer: 1) The "quick find", in and out type (micros, under the bench, by the whatever). 2) Microcaches, with a little bit of thought, maybe a small multicache. 3) Full sized caches, in and out. 4) Full sized, with some thought, small multicache. 5) Real puzzlers, with plenty of previous planning. You know the ones, decrypting a message (Valentoid), math problems (like the triangle problem in Tucson), knowledge of a foreign language (Li Ting), 6) Something that makes you hike a while to get there (out of the car, over the hill, through the woods, to grandmothers house we go....) 7) Virtuals, that take you someplace different (ie. the petroglyphs place, or the monuments by the state capitol). In other words, what kind of caches are your favorites? What makes you think that a found cache has been really enjoyable? Glad that you took the time? Thank you Steve, Team SteveJS ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, and more --0-1607647261-1045862618=:64883 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

Generally, I would prefer urban micro caches in nice parks. It doesn't even have to be something original, just maybe in a very nice location that I can really enjoy. Multi caches aren't bad either. I like the ones where there are maybe a few steps with posted coordinates (like Keychain Cache). Virtuals are o.k., but I would prefer actually finding a container and signing a log. I do not prefer puzzle type caches though mainly becuase I don't want to spend the time to figure them out. I prefer the "coordinates" take you right to the cache kind of thing.

Frieza

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of
Steven
Stringham
Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2003 10:23 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Caching Preferences


Ok, second question. I am planning my first hides with my kids. We want
to
do something

What are the preferences on finding caches out there. More
specifically,
with the urban caches. (I just tried to get my first off road cache
today,
with my minivan. Until I get another vehicle, the off road stuff is
probably
out).

Do people prefer:

1) The "quick find", in and out type (micros, under the bench, by the
whatever).

2) Microcaches, with a little bit of thought, maybe a small multicache.

3) Full sized caches, in and out.

4) Full sized, with some thought, small multicache.

5) Real puzzlers, with plenty of previous planning. You know the ones,
decrypting a message (Valentoid), math problems (like the triangle
problem
in Tucson), knowledge of a foreign language (Li Ting),

6) Something that makes you hike a while to get there (out of the car,
over
the hill, through the woods, to grandmothers house we go....)

7) Virtuals, that take you someplace different (ie. the petroglyphs
place,
or the monuments by the state capitol).

In other words, what kind of caches are your favorites? What makes you
think
that a found cache has been really enjoyable? Glad that you took the
time?

Thank you
Steve,
Team SteveJS


____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com


Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, and more --0-1607647261-1045862618=:64883-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 22 01:16:41 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ben Dilcher) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 18:16:41 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Fw: FW: GATES VS. GM Message-ID: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0021_01C2D9D5.624621E0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0022_01C2D9D5.624621E0" ------=_NextPart_001_0022_01C2D9D5.624621E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ----- Original Message -----=20 From: ERIC & MELISSA STUMPF=20 To: Greg Stumpf ; Curt Stumpf ; Ben Dilcher ; Ann Demaray-Fuller=20 Cc: Teresa Stumpf ; Tata and Nana ; John O'hagan ; john kennedy ; Joe = Salgado ; Jessica Cauthen ; Holly Stumpf=20 Sent: Monday, February 17, 2003 3:20 PM Subject: Fw: FW: GATES VS. GM ----- Original Message -----=20 From: JoRita65@aol.com=20 To: Anderson026@aol.com ; AZFLOMAR@aol.com ; jagut25@gte.net ; = saheck@adelphia.net ; BEEBOPHOME@aol.com ; jlembach@ameritech.net ; = roecker@adelphia.net. ; sircorky@justcatholic.net ; LRCT@aol.com ; = Rbtaylor7@cs.com ; M61024@aol.com ; AJKWMa@aol.com ; Oriffaz@aol.com=20 Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 3:24 PM Subject: Fwd: FW: GATES VS. GM In a message dated 2/12/03 10:31:15 AM Eastern Standard Time, M61024 = writes: >>THIS IS SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO TRUE !!!!!!=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>GATES VS. GM=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>For all of us who feel only the deepest love and=20 >>=20 >>affection for the way computers have enhanced our lives, read on.=20 >>=20 >>At a recent computer expo (COMDEX), Bill Gates=20 >>=20 >>reportedly compared the computer industry with the auto industry=20 >>and=20 >>=20 >>stated,=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>"If GM had kept up=20 >>=20 >>with the technology like the computer industry has,=20 >>=20 >>we would all be driving $25.00 cars that got 1,000 miles to the=20 >>gallon".=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>In response to Bill's comments, General Motors=20 >>=20 >>issued a press release stating:If GM had developed technology like=20 >>=20 >>Microsoft, we would all be driving cars with the following=20 >>characteristics:=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>1. For no reason whatsoever, your car would crash twice a day.=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>2. Every time they repainted the lines in the road, you would have=20 >>to buy a new car.=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>3. Occasionally your car would die on the freeway for no reason.=20 >>You would have to=20 >>=20 >>pull over to the side of the road, close all of the windows, shut=20 >>off the car, restart it,=20 >>=20 >>and reopen the windows before you could continue. For some reason=20 >>you would simply=20 >>=20 >>accept this.=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>4. Occasionally, executing a maneuver such as a left turn would=20 >>cause your car to shut=20 >>=20 >>down and refuse to restart, in which case you would have to=20 >>reinstall the engine.=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>5. Macintosh would make a car that was powered by the sun, was=20 >>reliable,=20 >>=20 >>five times as fast and twice as easy to drive - but would run on=20 >>only five=20 >>=20 >>percent of the roads.=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>6. The oil, water temperature, and alternator warning lights would=20 >>all be replaced=20 >>=20 >>by a single "This Car Has Performed An Illegal Operation" warning=20 >>light.=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>7. The airbag system would ask "Are you sure?" before deploying.=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>8. Occasionally, for no reason whatsoever, your car would lock you=20 >>out and refuse=20 >>=20 >>to let you in until you simultaneously lifted the door handle,=20 >>turned the key and grabbed hold=20 >>=20 >>of the radio antenna.=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>9. Every time a new car was introduced car buyers would have to=20 >>learn how to drive all over=20 >>=20 >>again because none of the controls would operate in the same manner=20 >>as the old car.=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>10.You'd have to press the "Start" button to turn the engine off.=20 >>Please share this with your=20 >>=20 >>friends who love - but sometimes hate - their computer!=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 ------=_NextPart_001_0022_01C2D9D5.624621E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
 
----- Original Message -----=20
To: Greg=20 Stumpf ; Curt Stumpf ; Ben Dilcher ; Ann=20 Demaray-Fuller
Cc: Teresa Stumpf ; Tata = and Nana=20 ; John O'hagan ; john = kennedy ; Joe=20 Salgado ; Jessica=20 Cauthen ; Holly=20 Stumpf
Sent: Monday, February 17, 2003 3:20 PM
Subject: Fw: FW: GATES VS. GM

 
----- Original Message -----=20
From: JoRita65@aol.com=20
To: Anderson026@aol.com ; AZFLOMAR@aol.com ; jagut25@gte.net ; saheck@adelphia.net ; BEEBOPHOME@aol.com=20 ; jlembach@ameritech.net ; roecker@adelphia.net. ; sircorky@justcatholic.net = ; LRCT@aol.com ; Rbtaylor7@cs.com ; M61024@aol.com = ; AJKWMa@aol.com = ; Oriffaz@aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 3:24 PM
Subject: Fwd: FW: GATES VS. GM

In a message dated 2/12/03 10:31:15 AM Eastern = Standard Time,=20 M61024 writes:


>>THIS IS SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO TRUE !!!!!!

>>

>>

>>

>>GATES VS. GM

>>

>>

>>

>>For all of us who feel only the deepest = love and=20

>>

>>affection for the way computers have = enhanced our=20 lives, read on.

>>

>>At a recent computer expo (COMDEX), Bill = Gates=20

>>

>>reportedly compared the computer industry = with the=20 auto industry

>>and

>>

>>stated,

>>

>>

>>

>>"If GM had kept up

>>

>>with the technology like the computer = industry has,=20

>>

>>we would all be driving $25.00 cars that = got 1,000=20 miles to the

>>gallon".

>>

>>

>>

>>In response to Bill's comments, General = Motors=20

>>

>>issued a press release stating:If GM had = developed=20 technology like

>>

>>Microsoft, we would all be driving cars = with the=20 following

>>characteristics:

>>

>>

>>

>>1. For no reason whatsoever, your car = would crash=20 twice a day.

>>

>>

>>

>>2. Every time they repainted the lines in = the road,=20 you would have

>>to buy a new car.

>>

>>

>>

>>3. Occasionally your car would die on the = freeway=20 for no reason.

>>You would have to

>>

>>pull over to the side of the road, close = all of the=20 windows, shut

>>off the car, restart it,

>>

>>and reopen the windows before you could = continue.=20 For some reason

>>you would simply

>>

>>accept this.

>>

>>

>>

>>4. Occasionally, executing a maneuver = such as a=20 left turn would

>>cause your car to shut

>>

>>down and refuse to restart, in which case = you would=20 have to

>>reinstall the engine.

>>

>>

>>

>>5. Macintosh would make a car that was = powered by=20 the sun, was

>>reliable,

>>

>>five times as fast and twice as easy to = drive - but=20 would run on

>>only five

>>

>>percent of the roads.

>>

>>

>>

>>6. The oil, water temperature, and = alternator=20 warning lights would

>>all be replaced

>>

>>by a single "This Car Has Performed An = Illegal=20 Operation" warning

>>light.

>>

>>

>>

>>7. The airbag system would ask "Are you = sure?"=20 before deploying.

>>

>>

>>

>>8. Occasionally, for no reason = whatsoever, your car=20 would lock you

>>out and refuse

>>

>>to let you in until you simultaneously = lifted the=20 door handle,

>>turned the key and grabbed hold =

>>

>>of the radio antenna.

>>

>>

>>

>>9. Every time a new car was introduced = car buyers=20 would have to

>>learn how to drive all over

>>

>>again because none of the controls would = operate in=20 the same manner

>>as the old car.

>>

>>

>>

>>10.You'd have to press the "Start" button = to turn=20 the engine off.

>>Please share this with your

>>

>>friends who love - but sometimes hate - = their=20 computer!

>>

>>

>>



------=_NextPart_001_0022_01C2D9D5.624621E0-- ------=_NextPart_000_0021_01C2D9D5.624621E0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Fwd_ FW_ GATES VS. GM.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Fwd_ FW_ GATES VS. GM.eml" Return-path: Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 10:31:15 -0500 (EST) From: M61024@aol.com Subject: Fwd: FW: GATES VS. GM To: alpacas@humminghill.com, tgi@lubrizol.com, ETG333@aol.com, JoRita65@aol.com, KKohl40296@aol.com, MackeY111@aol.com, mccoy0603@email.msn.com, Gmmvey5@aol.com, PRSEDGEWICK@aol.com, happytalk@adelphia.net, wendy@ameritech.net, LRCT@aol.com, BBTERHUNE@aol.com, AJKWMa@aol.com, ethsta@nccw.net, wyszkidz@alltel.net Message-id: <15.9d92645.2b7bc2c3@aol.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 230 Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_gvCglj1QZGJWZG8JDxWVRA)" Full-name: M61024 --Boundary_(ID_gvCglj1QZGJWZG8JDxWVRA) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_q5t/mnHrlzhlKLd+GK4PzQ)" --Boundary_(ID_q5t/mnHrlzhlKLd+GK4PzQ) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT --Boundary_(ID_q5t/mnHrlzhlKLd+GK4PzQ) Content-type: text/html; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

--Boundary_(ID_q5t/mnHrlzhlKLd+GK4PzQ)-- --Boundary_(ID_gvCglj1QZGJWZG8JDxWVRA) Content-type: message/rfc822 Return-path: Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 19:51:43 -0500 (EST) From: AurelieAS@cs.com Subject: Fwd: FW: GATES VS. GM To: mariabachuchin750@hotmail.com, beardinski@hotmail.com, DDJDB@aol.com, flowersbabe2002@yahoo.com, CUBBY32043@aol.com, anash@webtv.net, PVMerkys@aol.com, foxy@dp.net, margempointek@aol.com, sabo0032@tc.umn.edu, sabol@execpc.com, KAREN_STILLITANO@washlaw.org, M61024@aol.com Message-id: <4b.2aa55801.2b7af49f@cs.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: CompuServe 2000 32-bit sub 107 Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_tx7LCjTtJPjMzSeOvROiMA)" Full-name: AurelieAS --Boundary_(ID_tx7LCjTtJPjMzSeOvROiMA) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT --Boundary_(ID_tx7LCjTtJPjMzSeOvROiMA) Content-type: message/rfc822 Return-path: Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2003 13:54:16 -0500 (EST) From: Knitrunner@aol.com Subject: Fwd: FW: GATES VS. GM To: AurelieAS@cs.com Message-id: <1ca.2061a94.2b76ac58@aol.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 139 Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_9HkFdSxYyfysuJDsjwWHqA)" Full-name: Knitrunner --Boundary_(ID_9HkFdSxYyfysuJDsjwWHqA) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT --Boundary_(ID_9HkFdSxYyfysuJDsjwWHqA) Content-type: message/rfc822 Return-path: Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2003 17:59:00 -0500 (EST) From: Marcia4363@aol.com Subject: Fwd: FW: GATES VS. GM To: alana@webNdata.com, Knitrunner@aol.com, LauraLOSU@aol.com, Ialac211@aol.com, TURBOWMOM@aol.com Message-id: <148.9b440b6.2b7442b4@aol.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 230 Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_YDPr0Si6yZmcCBXaBzJgeg)" Full-name: Marcia4363 --Boundary_(ID_YDPr0Si6yZmcCBXaBzJgeg) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT --Boundary_(ID_YDPr0Si6yZmcCBXaBzJgeg) Content-type: message/rfc822 Return-path: Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2003 09:21:01 -0500 (EST) From: JANSILVERM@aol.com Subject: Fwd: FW: GATES VS. GM To: angduke0304@hotmail.com, bonibrju@1st.net, C13271@motorola.com, Liebz@aol.com, cwagner2@neo.rr.com, cwaskin@alltel.net, debbydo40@hotmail.com, esever@raycommedia.com, jillihoose@yahoo.com, jsaletel@ptcom.net, bkaufman@mcw.edu, brk7@po.cwru.edu, Marcia4363@aol.com, mcmama750@yahoo.com, PAMELA.CRONIN@ADELPHIA.COM, perception@core.com, sveeder@gpinvestors.com, Sue.Csuhran@trw.com, Tony.Blaskoski@idealindustries.com Message-id: <1e3.147474d.2b73c94d@aol.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10637 Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_PVygRUiKCftNkZPTP9No6Q)" Full-name: JANSILVERM --Boundary_(ID_PVygRUiKCftNkZPTP9No6Q) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT --Boundary_(ID_PVygRUiKCftNkZPTP9No6Q) Content-type: message/rfc822 Return-path: Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2003 07:32:13 -0500 (EST) From: Jmfredricks@cs.com Subject: Fwd: FW: GATES VS. GM To: basketali69@yahoo.com, holroydsway@aol.com, jblizin@gte.net, rhbroz@jonesday.com, JANSILVERM@aol.com, rickus@Torriville.demon.co.uk, Yfpclare@aol.com Message-id: <181.16711808.2b73afcd@cs.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 8001 Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_LS1y0ZI9JgRN7OUjC1hpqQ)" Full-name: Jmfredricks --Boundary_(ID_LS1y0ZI9JgRN7OUjC1hpqQ) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT --Boundary_(ID_LS1y0ZI9JgRN7OUjC1hpqQ) Content-type: message/rfc822 Return-path: Received: from rly-zd02.mx.aol.com (rly-zd02.mail.aol.com [172.31.33.226]) by air-zd01.mail.aol.com (v90_r2.5) with ESMTP id MAILINZD12-0206044053; Thu, 06 Feb 2003 04:40:53 -0500 Received: from anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.88]) by rly-zd02.mx.aol.com (v90_r1.1) with ESMTP id MAILRELAYINZD23-0206044020; Thu, 06 Feb 2003 04:40:20 -0500 Received: from condymathias.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.33] helo=condynt1.condymathias.co.uk) by anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 18giUH-000ML2-0U; Thu, 06 Feb 2003 09:38:30 +0000 Received: by CONDYNT1 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Thu, 06 Feb 2003 09:33:56 +0000 Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2003 09:33:55 +0000 From: John Hillier Subject: FW: GATES VS. GM To: "Barry Northcott (Barry Northcott [barry@taxbusters.co.uk])" , Grant Venner , Grant Venner , ifredricks@nya.org, "'mhllr9@aol.com'" , "Richard & Jenni Fredricks (Fredrickscompany@cs.com)" , "Richard & Jenni Fredricks (Jmfredricks@cs.com)" , "Rod Short (rod@short14.freeserve.co.uk)" , "Stuart Longrigg (stuartlongrigg@leonardscove.co.uk)" , "Thehilliers (thehilliers@ukonline.co.uk)" Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_hf5oIG9lmZ2mk6fbStgYPQ)" --Boundary_(ID_hf5oIG9lmZ2mk6fbStgYPQ) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_pWjrLZUf7GVAFEDF2FResg)" --Boundary_(ID_pWjrLZUf7GVAFEDF2FResg) Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT -----Original Message----- From: Martin Caruana Sent: 06 February 2003 09:29 To: Andrew Wing; Avril Tozer; Jenny Seaman; John Hillier; Lee Williams; Lisa Williams; Mark Souness; Michael Rosevear; Mike Apps; Neil Stevens Subject: FW: GATES VS. GM Martin -----Original Message----- From: Daleevans [mailto:daleevans@eurobell.co.uk] Sent: 05 February 2003 17:41 To: martin@condymathias.co.uk; mvosper@plymco.co.uk Subject: GATES VS. GM >>THIS IS SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO TRUE !!!!!! >> >> >> >>GATES VS. GM >> >> >> >>For all of us who feel only the deepest love and >> >>affection for the way computers have enhanced our lives, read on. >> >>At a recent computer expo (COMDEX), Bill Gates >> >>reportedly compared the computer industry with the auto industry >>and >> >>stated, >> >> >> >>"If GM had kept up >> >>with the technology like the computer industry has, >> >>we would all be driving $25.00 cars that got 1,000 miles to the >>gallon". >> >> >> >>In response to Bill's comments, General Motors >> >>issued a press release stating:If GM had developed technology like >> >>Microsoft, we would all be driving cars with the following >>characteristics: >> >> >> >>1. For no reason whatsoever, your car would crash twice a day. >> >> >> >>2. Every time they repainted the lines in the road, you would have >>to buy a new car. >> >> >> >>3. Occasionally your car would die on the freeway for no reason. >>You would have to >> >>pull over to the side of the road, close all of the windows, shut >>off the car, restart it, >> >>and reopen the windows before you could continue. For some reason >>you would simply >> >>accept this. >> >> >> >>4. Occasionally, executing a maneuver such as a left turn would >>cause your car to shut >> >>down and refuse to restart, in which case you would have to >>reinstall the engine. >> >> >> >>5. Macintosh would make a car that was powered by the sun, was >>reliable, >> >>five times as fast and twice as easy to drive - but would run on >>only five >> >>percent of the roads. >> >> >> >>6. The oil, water temperature, and alternator warning lights would >>all be replaced >> >>by a single "This Car Has Performed An Illegal Operation" warning >>light. >> >> >> >>7. The airbag system would ask "Are you sure?" before deploying. >> >> >> >>8. Occasionally, for no reason whatsoever, your car would lock you >>out and refuse >> >>to let you in until you simultaneously lifted the door handle, >>turned the key and grabbed hold >> >>of the radio antenna. >> >> >> >>9. Every time a new car was introduced car buyers would have to >>learn how to drive all over >> >>again because none of the controls would operate in the same manner >>as the old car. >> >> >> >>10.You'd have to press the "Start" button to turn the engine off. >>Please share this with your >> >>friends who love - but sometimes hate - their computer! >> >> >> > _____ Message your friends in real time - and for free. Get MSN Messenger today! --Boundary_(ID_pWjrLZUf7GVAFEDF2FResg) Content-type: text/html Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Message
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Martin Caruana
Sent: 06 February 2003 09:29
To: Andrew Wing; Avril Tozer; Jenny Seaman; John Hillier; Lee Williams; Lisa Williams; Mark Souness; Michael Rosevear; Mike Apps; Neil Stevens
Subject: FW: GATES VS. GM

 

 

Martin

-----Original Message-----
From: Daleevans [mailto:daleevans@eurobell.co.uk]
Sent: 05 February 2003 17:41
To: martin@condymathias.co.uk; mvosper@plymco.co.uk
Subject: GATES VS. GM

 

>>THIS IS SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO TRUE !!!!!!

>>

>>

>>

>>GATES VS. GM

>>

>>

>>

>>For all of us who feel only the deepest love and

>>

>>affection for the way computers have enhanced our lives, read on.

>>

>>At a recent computer expo (COMDEX), Bill Gates

>>

>>reportedly compared the computer industry with the auto industry

>>and

>>

>>stated,

>>

>>

>>

>>"If GM had kept up

>>

>>with the technology like the computer industry has,

>>

>>we would all be driving $25.00 cars that got 1,000 miles to the

>>gallon".

>>

>>

>>

>>In response to Bill's comments, General Motors

>>

>>issued a press release stating:If GM had developed technology like

>>

>>Microsoft, we would all be driving cars with the following

>>characteristics:

>>

>>

>>

>>1. For no reason whatsoever, your car would crash twice a day.

>>

>>

>>

>>2. Every time they repainted the lines in the road, you would have

>>to buy a new car.

>>

>>

>>

>>3. Occasionally your car would die on the freeway for no reason.

>>You would have to

>>

>>pull over to the side of the road, close all of the windows, shut

>>off the car, restart it,

>>

>>and reopen the windows before you could continue. For some reason

>>you would simply

>>

>>accept this.

>>

>>

>>

>>4. Occasionally, executing a maneuver such as a left turn would

>>cause your car to shut

>>

>>down and refuse to restart, in which case you would have to

>>reinstall the engine.

>>

>>

>>

>>5. Macintosh would make a car that was powered by the sun, was

>>reliable,

>>

>>five times as fast and twice as easy to drive - but would run on

>>only five

>>

>>percent of the roads.

>>

>>

>>

>>6. The oil, water temperature, and alternator warning lights would

>>all be replaced

>>

>>by a single "This Car Has Performed An Illegal Operation" warning

>>light.

>>

>>

>>

>>7. The airbag system would ask "Are you sure?" before deploying.

>>

>>

>>

>>8. Occasionally, for no reason whatsoever, your car would lock you

>>out and refuse

>>

>>to let you in until you simultaneously lifted the door handle,

>>turned the key and grabbed hold

>>

>>of the radio antenna.

>>

>>

>>

>>9. Every time a new car was introduced car buyers would have to

>>learn how to drive all over

>>

>>again because none of the controls would operate in the same manner

>>as the old car.

>>

>>

>>

>>10.You'd have to press the "Start" button to turn the engine off.

>>Please share this with your

>>

>>friends who love - but sometimes hate - their computer!

>>

>>

>>

>


Message your friends in real time - and for free. Get MSN Messenger today!

--Boundary_(ID_pWjrLZUf7GVAFEDF2FResg)-- --Boundary_(ID_hf5oIG9lmZ2mk6fbStgYPQ) Content-type: message/rfc822 Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2003 09:33:56 +0000 From: daleevans@eurobell.co.uk Subject: To: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_waLG+9RwgawrpKx1Rr4paw)" --Boundary_(ID_waLG+9RwgawrpKx1Rr4paw) Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT --Boundary_(ID_waLG+9RwgawrpKx1Rr4paw) Content-type: text/html Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
--Boundary_(ID_waLG+9RwgawrpKx1Rr4paw)-- --Boundary_(ID_hf5oIG9lmZ2mk6fbStgYPQ)-- --Boundary_(ID_LS1y0ZI9JgRN7OUjC1hpqQ)-- --Boundary_(ID_PVygRUiKCftNkZPTP9No6Q)-- --Boundary_(ID_YDPr0Si6yZmcCBXaBzJgeg)-- --Boundary_(ID_9HkFdSxYyfysuJDsjwWHqA)-- --Boundary_(ID_tx7LCjTtJPjMzSeOvROiMA)-- --Boundary_(ID_gvCglj1QZGJWZG8JDxWVRA)-- ------=_NextPart_000_0021_01C2D9D5.624621E0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 22 01:48:39 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 18:48:39 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Log Volume I In-Reply-To: <3E566062.3000801@snaptek.com> Message-ID: <005801c2da14$8a8aaba0$c069dd18@OUR> > maybe we could start a arizona cache log museum here on the > azgeocaching > web site... Wouldn't it be cool if this idea became so big that we had to build a physical museum to hold all the physical logs? Then we could prevent people from creating virtual caches that take you there! Steve Team Tierra Buena From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 22 02:16:32 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 19:16:32 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] For the gods, Java now I only get Message-ID: <009701c2da18$6bb21b60$3949b83f@fishkiller> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0094_01C2D9DD.BE60A600 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ok on the chat page I did some playing around and uninstalled then = reinstalled Java and now I no longer get anything just the GREY box. any suggestions=20 ------=_NextPart_000_0094_01C2D9DD.BE60A600 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Ok on the chat page I did some = playing around=20 and uninstalled then reinstalled Java and now I no longer get anything = just the=20 GREY box.
 
any suggestions
 
 
------=_NextPart_000_0094_01C2D9DD.BE60A600-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 22 05:52:26 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 22:52:26 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] For the gods, Java now I only get In-Reply-To: <009701c2da18$6bb21b60$3949b83f@fishkiller> References: <009701c2da18$6bb21b60$3949b83f@fishkiller> Message-ID: <3E57101A.1080702@Snaptek.com> Regan Smith wrote: >Ok on the chat page I did some playing around and uninstalled then reinstalled Java and now I no longer get anything just the GREY box. > >any suggestions > Best idea I got... cause I don't want to spend a lot of time on it :) goto www.xchat.org and download the windows version of the software for the configuration: the server is irc.azgeocaching.com the port # is 6666 That will get you connected and you shouldn't have any problems after that... unless you computer just plain doesn't want you chatting. Brian Cluff Team Snaptek From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 22 06:50:50 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 23:50:50 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] For the gods, Java now I only get References: <009701c2da18$6bb21b60$3949b83f@fishkiller> <3E57101A.1080702@Snaptek.com> Message-ID: <001201c2da3e$bdc7a340$e629b83f@fishkiller> which channel ?? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Cluff" To: Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 10:52 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] For the gods, Java now I only get > Regan Smith wrote: > > >Ok on the chat page I did some playing around and uninstalled then reinstalled Java and now I no longer get anything just the GREY box. > > > >any suggestions > > > Best idea I got... cause I don't want to spend a lot of time on it :) > goto www.xchat.org and download the windows version of the software > for the configuration: > the server is irc.azgeocaching.com > the port # is 6666 > > That will get you connected and you shouldn't have any problems after > that... unless you computer just plain doesn't want you chatting. > > Brian Cluff > Team Snaptek > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 22 07:04:02 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson) Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 00:04:02 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] For the gods, Java now I only get In-Reply-To: <001201c2da3e$bdc7a340$e629b83f@fishkiller> Message-ID: <00ea01c2da40$94efc9a0$697ba8c0@sbjr.com> Channel = #azgeocaching -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Regan Smith Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 11:51 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] For the gods, Java now I only get which channel ?? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Cluff" To: Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 10:52 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] For the gods, Java now I only get > Regan Smith wrote: > > >Ok on the chat page I did some playing around and uninstalled then reinstalled Java and now I no longer get anything just the GREY box. > > > >any suggestions > > > Best idea I got... cause I don't want to spend a lot of time on it :) > goto www.xchat.org and download the windows version of the software > for the configuration: the server is irc.azgeocaching.com > the port # is 6666 > > That will get you connected and you shouldn't have any problems after > that... unless you computer just plain doesn't want you chatting. > > Brian Cluff > Team Snaptek > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sat Feb 22 08:08:16 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 01:08:16 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] For the gods, Java now I only get References: <00ea01c2da40$94efc9a0$697ba8c0@sbjr.com> Message-ID: <000901c2da49$8ecf1900$9111b83f@fishkiller> Thank you my computer is now letting me chat with myself :) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Tomlinson" To: Sent: Saturday, February 22, 2003 12:04 AM Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] For the gods, Java now I only get > Channel = #azgeocaching > > -----Original Message----- > From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com > [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Regan > Smith > Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 11:51 PM > To: listserv@azgeocaching.com > Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] For the gods, Java now I only get > > > which channel ?? > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Brian Cluff" > To: > Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 10:52 PM > Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] For the gods, Java now I only get > > > > Regan Smith wrote: > > > > >Ok on the chat page I did some playing around and uninstalled then > reinstalled Java and now I no longer get anything just the GREY box. > > > > > >any suggestions > > > > > Best idea I got... cause I don't want to spend a lot of time on it :) > > goto www.xchat.org and download the windows version of the software > > for the configuration: the server is irc.azgeocaching.com > > the port # is 6666 > > > > That will get you connected and you shouldn't have any problems after > > that... unless you computer just plain doesn't want you chatting. > > > > Brian Cluff > > Team Snaptek > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun Feb 23 00:00:09 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken) Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 17:00:09 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? References: <4D086D55-44E9-11D7-AA41-000393545682@desertsol.com> Message-ID: <003f01c2dace$880c2290$91f50244@cx301817d> O.K. I wanted to let the people here know that I have made contact with the person who made the complaint and we have agreed to discuss this sometime next week. The subject is not Shelly. I appreciate all of the support and will keep you updated on what happens. Ken WhereRWee? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chelby Geiss" To: Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2003 8:38 AM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? > OK, IMO it is the wrong this to do to boycott the DVRAC until we know > the whole story. I am not convinced that this letter to geocaching.com > is truly from the "higher ups." I can't imagine that any of our local > struggling museums would bash something so severely that brings in > support! I know from working with people at the Pueblo Grande Museum > that they greatly appreciate the traffic from the virtual cache placed > there by Libby. May I suggest that when you do go to one of these > museum virtuals, sign the guest book and if there is a "How did you > hear about us?" make sure you put www.geocaching.com! They actually > read those!!! > > I have emailed Kristy, my friend at the Pueblo Grande (who is an > archeologist and has absolutely nothing against geocaching), to see if > she knows any of the people at DVRAC (she's involved with a lot of the > city wide museum meetings and such, so hopefully she does). I'm still > waiting to hear back from her. > > And just like with the recent issues with Mesa Ranger District, PLEASE > remember that if you do contact DVRAC, remember to be level headed and > EDUCATION, EDUCATION, EDUCATION! > > > Team desertSol > Chelby & Kevin > + > Kiva and Lancer (German Shepherds) > Apache Junction, AZ > www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun Feb 23 01:26:14 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff) Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 18:26:14 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? In-Reply-To: <003f01c2dace$880c2290$91f50244@cx301817d> References: <4D086D55-44E9-11D7-AA41-000393545682@desertsol.com> <003f01c2dace$880c2290$91f50244@cx301817d> Message-ID: <3E582336.5010107@Snaptek.com> Ken wrote: >O.K. I wanted to let the people here know that I have made contact with the >person who made the complaint and we have agreed to discuss this sometime >next week. The subject is not Shelly. I appreciate all of the support and >will keep you updated on what happens. > > Is this person an employee of the rock art place, or just someone that took it upon themselves to police the world? Brian Cluff Team Snaptek From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun Feb 23 03:52:15 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken) Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 20:52:15 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? References: <4D086D55-44E9-11D7-AA41-000393545682@desertsol.com> <003f01c2dace$880c2290$91f50244@cx301817d> <3E582336.5010107@Snaptek.com> Message-ID: <001e01c2daee$f4a59880$91f50244@cx301817d> They are a full time management level employee. Ken ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Cluff" To: Sent: Saturday, February 22, 2003 6:26 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? > Ken wrote: > > >O.K. I wanted to let the people here know that I have made contact with the > >person who made the complaint and we have agreed to discuss this sometime > >next week. The subject is not Shelly. I appreciate all of the support and > >will keep you updated on what happens. > > > > > Is this person an employee of the rock art place, or just someone that > took it upon themselves to police the world? > > Brian Cluff > Team Snaptek > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun Feb 23 03:54:53 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Nicol) Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 19:54:53 -0800 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] gasoline and caches Message-ID: >From: "Regan Smith" >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com >To: >Subject: [Az-Geocaching] gasoline and caches >Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 10:51:13 -0700 > >Here are some interesting facts about the companies >that import oil that eventually ends up in our cars' >fuel tanks. > >Major companies that import Middle Eastern oil > > > > Shell........................... ... 205,742,000 >barrels > > Chevron/Texaco......... .......144,332,000 barrels > > Exxon/Mobil.............. ...... 130,082,000 >barrels > > Marathon/Speedway... .......117,740,000 barrels > > Amoco................... .......... ...62,231,000 >barrels > > If you do the math at $30/barrel, these imports > > amount to over $18 BILLION aid to the terrorist. > > > > > Here are some large companies that do not import >Middle Eastern oil: > > Citgo............... 0 barrels > > Sunoco............ 0 barrels > > Conoco........... 0 barrels > > Sinclair............. 0 barrels > > BP/Phillips..... 0 barrels > > Hess................. 0 barrels > >My friend then added: > >A friend sent me these facts in an e-mail that was >intended to make us all aware of the connection >between Middle East oil, the "gas stations" that we >fill up at, and financing terrorism. >Here is the question: >Can I have an effect on the dependence of Middle >Eastern imported oil by choosing a filling station >that does not import Middle Eastern oil? > > >after spending a quarter of a tank on a few finds I thought I was glad > >that I used Phillips gas. Regan has some good stats there! I very much agree that americans should NOT support middle eastern countries and should buy from those oil companies that do not import. Whether it is supporting terrorists or not (I suppose it could be), I simply don't care to support middle eastern countries.. period. I will not say what I think about them (this isn't the place!) ;) It costs a lot of money in gas to go geocaching and I for one will likely be slowing down ALOT from caching if the gas prices climb anymore than they are right now. I personally think the government needs to step in and start regulating the price of gas. (Heck, they regulate everything else in our lives!). If only the large majority of americans would step up and not give in to these price increases. War is just an excuse to rip us off. If I tried that in the business I was in, I would be out of business real quick. I guess I am in the wrong business! (gas stations really only make pennies off of every gallon they sell). We can make a difference if only all americans would step up to the plate. It is much like that thing going around last year about not getting gas on such and such days. That would work, if only everyone would do it. Most people just give in to it and pay it "cuz we need it". Make a small sacrifice now instead of sacrificing your wallet down the road!!!!! I purchase probably 90% or more of my gas from Phillips (Just ask Regan!). Another way I can save gas and cache is by grouping caches together around the valley while out on business or something. I try and go for them while on the way to or from a job or something. (which is why my first find days have pretty much ended!). I used to just jump in the truck and drive to Tempe (from east Mesa) just to get one new cache that pops up! Now, I just go for them when it is convenient. Scott Team Ropingthewind PS... CONGRATS to Team HuntAZ on their find on our cache RTW-1!!!!!!! They are the third team (since the cache was placed Sept 15, 2002) to find this cache and the first team since Nov 2002 to log into it!!!!!! Way to go yall!!! _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun Feb 23 04:27:19 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken) Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 21:27:19 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? References: <4D086D55-44E9-11D7-AA41-000393545682@desertsol.com> <003f01c2dace$880c2290$91f50244@cx301817d> <3E582336.5010107@Snaptek.com> Message-ID: <002a01c2daf3$daaa7ef0$91f50244@cx301817d> FYI for anyone who is interested I posted some new pic's I took today while at the DVRAM today. They are posted on the geocaching thread discussing this matter. Ken ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Cluff" To: Sent: Saturday, February 22, 2003 6:26 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Is Shelly at it a again or what????? > Ken wrote: > > >O.K. I wanted to let the people here know that I have made contact with the > >person who made the complaint and we have agreed to discuss this sometime > >next week. The subject is not Shelly. I appreciate all of the support and > >will keep you updated on what happens. > > > > > Is this person an employee of the rock art place, or just someone that > took it upon themselves to police the world? > > Brian Cluff > Team Snaptek > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 24 02:31:33 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (GREGG OBUCH) Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 18:31:33 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Find #300 Message-ID: <20030224023133.17430.qmail@web80210.mail.yahoo.com> --0-1009474712-1046053893=:16461 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Congratulations to Scott and Ann of Team My Blue Heaven on reaching their 300th cache find! We were honored that they picked one of our caches for this event. Gregg and Maureen (MO & GO) --0-1009474712-1046053893=:16461 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

Congratulations to Scott and Ann of Team My Blue Heaven on reaching their 300th cache find!  We were honored that they picked one of our caches for this event. 

Gregg and Maureen (MO & GO)

--0-1009474712-1046053893=:16461-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 24 02:53:32 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jim Scotti) Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 19:53:32 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Find #300 In-Reply-To: <20030224023133.17430.qmail@web80210.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Congrats to Scott & Ann - the first to 300 in the Tucson area. And while I'm at it, Congratulations to Gregg & Maureen of MO & GO on their 200th find! Jim. On Sun, 23 Feb 2003, GREGG OBUCH wrote: > > Congratulations to Scott and Ann of Team My Blue Heaven on reaching their > 300th cache find! We were honored that they picked one of our caches for > this event. > > Gregg and Maureen (MO & GO) > Jim Scotti Lunar & Planetary Laboratory University of Arizona Tucson, AZ 85721 USA http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/~jscotti/ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 24 05:22:06 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Nicol) Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 21:22:06 -0800 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Find #300 Message-ID: Congratulations Scott/Ann MBH for finding your 300th cache! Way to go! Scott Team Ropingthewind _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 24 05:33:08 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 22:33:08 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Find #300 In-Reply-To: <20030224023133.17430.qmail@web80210.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030223223149.025c11a0@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 06:31 PM 2/23/2003 -0800, you wrote: >Congratulations to Scott and Ann of Team My Blue Heaven on reaching their >300th cache find! We were honored that they picked one of our caches for >this event. Thanks, we really enjoyed the walking tour, after all these years in Tucson, we had never been to that park. Let's not forget another milestone today, MO&GO got their 200th. Congratulations. In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 24 09:12:13 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 02:12:13 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Find #300 In-Reply-To: References: <20030224023133.17430.qmail@web80210.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030224021159.02bcaaf8@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 07:53 PM 2/23/2003 -0700, you wrote: >Congrats to Scott & Ann - the first to 300 in the Tucson area. And while I'm >at it, Congratulations to Gregg & Maureen of MO & GO on their 200th find! A good day for milestones in Tucson. In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 24 09:12:40 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 02:12:40 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Find #300 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030224021220.02c17c78@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 09:22 PM 2/23/2003 -0800, you wrote: >Congratulations Scott/Ann MBH for finding your 300th cache! Way to go! Thanks Scott. Still waiting to see you name in the logs for all the caches down here. :-) In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 24 18:28:42 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 11:28:42 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] How soon is Soon??? Message-ID: <000c01c2dc32$903d30c0$8010b83f@fishkiller> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01C2DBF7.E2CA29A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable in regards to Home Run Country:=20 because it is now archived and we have not updated it yet into the = archived section for it to download the latest update finds on it... should be done soon Jason?? ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01C2DBF7.E2CA29A0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
 
in regards to Home Run Country:
 
because it is now archived and we have not = updated it yet=20 into the archived section for it to download the latest update finds on=20 it...

should be done soon

Jason??
 
 
 


 ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01C2DBF7.E2CA29A0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 24 21:01:30 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 13:01:30 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Proposed virtual cache not approved - this is an outstanding scenic area - what can I do to appeal this decision? Message-ID: <20030224210130.899.qmail@web21101.mail.yahoo.com> --0-906766584-1046120490=:778 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hello Geocachers, During a recent trip to southwestern Texas, I visited an area that I thought should be worthy of a virtual cache. This area is Closed Canyon near the Rio Grande. I wrote what I tought is a good cache description. However, the authorities who approve caches turned this one down. There are many virtual caches far inferior to this one, but this one was not approved. It was featured in the October 1997 issue of Texas Monthly, so it is an area that is worthy of being featured in a major travel magazine. It was even described in The Boston Globe on June 23, 1996, so it clearly is an area that receives recognition from major newspapers and publications based far away from Texas. Since this location is in a remote area far from my home, I am unable to put a physical cache here. It would be very difficult to place a physical cache in this area, because there are few or no known geocachers who live in this region. However, I firmly believe we need more caches in remote areas, not just caches close to the city. Therefore, what can I do to appeal this decision, and get this cache approved? I firmly believe that this is an area that warrants having a cache, even if the only cache that I could establish there is a virtual cache. Below is the text of the cache description so you can see what this cache is about. Sincerely, Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer) Closed Canyon [Click to temporarily disable] by Highpointer [profile] User's Web Page This cache has not been approved yet. Once it is approved, it will be listed on the site. N 29° 19.629 W 104° 01.901 (WGS84) UTM: 13R E 594018 N 3244621 or convert to NAD27 at Jeeep.com [input] [input] also download nearest placenames. Need help? Read about EasyGPS In Texas, United States [state map] Hidden: 2/24/2003 Use waypoint: GCDA59 (what's this?) Make this page print-friendly (no logs) Note:To use the services of geocaching.com, you must agree to the terms and conditions in our disclaimer. (ratings out of 5 stars. 1 is easiest, 5 is hardest) Difficulty: Terrain: Hike into a narrow canyon near the Rio Grande in southwestern Texas. Admin - Emailed to see why a physical cache could not be placed Explore Closed Canyon in Big Bend Ranch State Park, the largest state park in Texas. This is a narrow ravine, just 3-4 meters wide with sheer, vertical walls, cut by a seasonal stream that flows into the Rio Grande. Traversing the entire canyon is a real canyoneering adventure, and requires proper knowledge, skills, and equipment. However, you don't need to traverse the entire canyon to claim this virtual cache, so most geocachers can do this. Begin your journey by parking at N 29° 19.669 W 104° 01.690, about a quarter-mile from the canyon entrance. To claim this cache, visit the entrance to the canyon at the posted coordinates, and if the stream is not flowing and there is no danger of flash flooding, then hike into the canyon as far as you comfortably and safely can do. The first difficult traverse is at a point where a ladder descends into a pool (see this picture), so if you are hiking into the canyon then take a picture of yourself here and post it to earn credit. Other photographs are greatly welcome. You can go farther if you like, but you will need rope and rappelling gear and know how to use the equipment properly in order to reach the Rio Grande. Because the configuration of the canyon blocks most satellite signals, GPS reception is virtually non-existent in the canyon. Because this canyon is very narrow and there are no escape routes once past the entrance, there is real danger of flash flooding during times of heavy rainfall, particularly during the summer thunderstorm season. Therefore, please heed the weather forecasts and don't enter the canyon if there is any chance of heavy rain in the area. If it is not safe to enter the canyon, then post of picture of yourself at the entrance. --0-906766584-1046120490=:778 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

Hello Geocachers,

During a recent trip to southwestern Texas, I visited an area that I thought should be worthy of a virtual cache.  This area is Closed Canyon near the Rio Grande.  I wrote what I tought is a good cache description.  However, the authorities who approve caches turned this one down.

There are many virtual caches far inferior to this one, but this one was not approved.  It was featured in the October 1997 issue of Texas Monthly, so it is an area that is worthy of being featured in a major travel magazine.  It was even described in The Boston Globe on June 23, 1996, so it clearly is an area that receives recognition from major newspapers and publications based far away from Texas.

Since this location is in a remote area far from my home, I am unable to put a physical cache here.  It would be very difficult to place a physical cache in this area, because there are few or no known geocachers who live in this region.  However, I firmly believe we need more caches in remote areas, not just caches close to the city.

Therefore, what can I do to appeal this decision, and get this cache approved?  I firmly believe that this is an area that warrants having a cache, even if the only cache that I could establish there is a virtual cache.

Below is the text of the cache description so you can see what this cache is about.

Sincerely,

Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer)

Closed Canyon
[Click to temporarily disable]
by Highpointer [profile]
User's Web Page

This cache has not been approved yet. Once it is approved, it will be listed on the site.

N 29° 19.629 W 104° 01.901 (WGS84)
UTM: 13R E 594018 N 3244621
or convert to NAD27 at Jeeep.com


also download nearest placenames.
Need help? Read about EasyGPS

In Texas, United States [state map]
Hidden: 2/24/2003
Use waypoint: GCDA59 (what's this?)
Make this page print-friendly (no logs)

Note:To use the services of geocaching.com, you must agree to the terms and conditions in our disclaimer.

(ratings out of 5 stars. 1 is easiest, 5 is hardest)
Difficulty:  *  Terrain: ***      

Hike into a narrow canyon near the Rio Grande in southwestern Texas.

Admin - Emailed to see why a physical cache could not be placed

Explore Closed Canyon in Big Bend Ranch State Park, the largest state park in Texas. This is a narrow ravine, just 3-4 meters wide with sheer, vertical walls, cut by a seasonal stream that flows into the Rio Grande.

Traversing the entire canyon is a real canyoneering adventure, and requires proper knowledge, skills, and equipment. However, you don't need to traverse the entire canyon to claim this virtual cache, so most geocachers can do this. Begin your journey by parking at N 29° 19.669 W 104° 01.690, about a quarter-mile from the canyon entrance.

To claim this cache, visit the entrance to the canyon at the posted coordinates, and if the stream is not flowing and there is no danger of flash flooding, then hike into the canyon as far as you comfortably and safely can do. The first difficult traverse is at a point where a ladder descends into a pool (see this picture), so if you are hiking into the canyon then take a picture of yourself here and post it to earn credit.

Other photographs are greatly welcome. You can go farther if you like, but you will need rope and rappelling gear and know how to use the equipment properly in order to reach the Rio Grande. Because the configuration of the canyon blocks most satellite signals, GPS reception is virtually non-existent in the canyon.

Because this canyon is very narrow and there are no escape routes once past the entrance, there is real danger of flash flooding during times of heavy rainfall, particularly during the summer thunderstorm season. Therefore, please heed the weather forecasts and don't enter the canyon if there is any chance of heavy rain in the area. If it is not safe to enter the canyon, then post of picture of yourself at the entrance.

 --0-906766584-1046120490=:778-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 24 21:05:38 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 13:05:38 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Addition information about geocacher who denied "Closed Canyon" virtual cache Message-ID: <20030224210538.50352.qmail@web21110.mail.yahoo.com> --0-822284515-1046120738=:48951 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii The geocacher who reject my "Closed Canyon" virtual cache near the Rio Grande in Texas is 9Key. His e-mail address is nienke@nienke.com. Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer) --0-822284515-1046120738=:48951 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

The geocacher who reject my "Closed Canyon" virtual cache near the Rio Grande in Texas is 9Key.  His e-mail address is nienke@nienke.com.

Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer)

--0-822284515-1046120738=:48951-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 24 21:41:38 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 14:41:38 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Proposed virtual cache not approved - this is an outstanding scenic area - what can I do to appeal this decision? In-Reply-To: <20030224210130.899.qmail@web21101.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030224144040.01e2f770@mail.myblueheaven.com> --=====================_20127171==_.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 01:01 PM 2/24/2003 -0800, you wrote: >Therefore, what can I do to appeal this decision, and get this cache >approved? I firmly believe that this is an area that warrants having a >cache, even if the only cache that I could establish there is a virtual cache. I just went through the same thing on my trip to Idaho. I posted some of the details here. Basically you have to start a conversation with the person who denied the cache. Plead your case and tell them why it is worthy of being a virtual cache. If that fails, you have to contact Jeremey. In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com --=====================_20127171==_.ALT Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" At 01:01 PM 2/24/2003 -0800, you wrote:

Therefore, what can I do to appeal this decision, and get this cache approved?  I firmly believe that this is an area that warrants having a cache, even if the only cache that I could establish there is a virtual cache.

I just went through the same thing on my trip to Idaho.  I posted some of the details here.  Basically you have to start a conversation with the person who denied the cache.  Plead your case and tell them why it is worthy of being a virtual cache.  If that fails, you have to contact Jeremey.


In liberty,

Scott

wood@myblueheaven.com
--=====================_20127171==_.ALT-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon Feb 24 23:11:26 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jason Poulter) Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 16:11:26 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] How soon is Soon??? In-Reply-To: <000c01c2dc32$903d30c0$8010b83f@fishkiller> References: <000c01c2dc32$903d30c0$8010b83f@fishkiller> Message-ID: <3E5AA69E.2090703@snaptek.com> Soon is defined in the Jason's Universal Dictionary as SOON (adv) Happening sometime in the future, whenever it is gotton around to. Remember this is just a game and the stats don't really mean anything... so it is really meaningless to define the word SOON! jason ;) Regan Smith wrote: > > in regards to Home Run Country: > > because it is now archived and we have not updated it yet into the > archived section for it to download the latest update finds on it... > > should be done soon > > Jason?? > > > > > From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 25 01:29:45 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 18:29:45 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] How soon is Soon??? References: <000c01c2dc32$903d30c0$8010b83f@fishkiller> <3E5AA69E.2090703@snaptek.com> Message-ID: <001d01c2dc6d$6236cde0$7429bf3f@fishkiller> That page must have been missing from my book, sorry I was thinking of another word :) actually of a couple of words but this is a family list..... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jason Poulter" To: Sent: Monday, February 24, 2003 4:11 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] How soon is Soon??? > Soon is defined in the Jason's Universal Dictionary as > > SOON (adv) Happening sometime in the future, whenever it is gotton > around to. > > > Remember this is just a game and the stats don't really mean anything... > so it is really meaningless to define the word SOON! > > jason > ;) > > > Regan Smith wrote: > > > > in regards to Home Run Country: > > > > because it is now archived and we have not updated it yet into the > > archived section for it to download the latest update finds on it... > > > > should be done soon > > > > Jason?? > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 25 01:10:28 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ben Dilcher) Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 18:10:28 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Fw: Walgreen's 3/$1 Message-ID: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0022_01C2DC30.02B0D740 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Rancho Santa Ynez=20 To: BJ Dilcher=20 Sent: Monday, February 24, 2003 3:07 PM Subject: Walgreen's 3/$1 Walgreens has little wire bound memo books 3 for $1.00. These are the = ones we usually see as logs in caches. Also, tweezers, nail clippers, = small cars (like hot wheels), punch balls, and some other things, all 3 = for $1.00. Great cache goodies! We got some 'cause if we start hiding = them it will use up lots of trinkets. Even though it seems like we have = a lot now, they will go fast!=20 ------=_NextPart_000_0022_01C2DC30.02B0D740 Content-Type: text/html; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
 
----- Original Message -----=20
Sent: Monday, February 24, 2003 3:07 PM
Subject: Walgreen's 3/$1

Walgreens has little wire bound memo books 3 for = $1.00.  These are the ones we usually see as logs in caches.  = Also,=20 tweezers, nail clippers, small cars (like hot wheels), punch balls, and = some=20 other things, all 3 for $1.00.  Great cache goodies!  We got = some=20 'cause if we start hiding them it will use up lots of trinkets.  = Even=20 though it seems like we have a lot now, they will go fast!
 
 
------=_NextPart_000_0022_01C2DC30.02B0D740-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 25 02:58:57 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (GREGG OBUCH) Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 18:58:57 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Proposed virtual cache not approved - this is an outstanding scenic area - what can I do to appeal this decision? In-Reply-To: <20030224210130.899.qmail@web21101.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20030225025857.16003.qmail@web80212.mail.yahoo.com> --0-838512834-1046141937=:14999 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Ken, Congrats, from looking at the geocaching site, it seems you got this approved. We will have to make the swing south next time we go visit our daughter. Gregg of MO & GO ken@highpointer.com wrote: Hello Geocachers, During a recent trip to southwestern Texas, I visited an area that I thought should be worthy of a virtual cache. This area is Closed Canyon near the Rio Grande. I wrote what I tought is a good cache description. However, the authorities who approve caches turned this one down. There are many virtual caches far inferior to this one, but this one was not approved. It was featured in the October 1997 issue of Texas Monthly, so it is an area that is worthy of being featured in a major travel magazine. It was even described in The Boston Globe on June 23, 1996, so it clearly is an area that receives recognition from major newspapers and publications based far away from Texas. Since this location is in a remote area far from my home, I am unable to put a physical cache here. It would be very difficult to place a physical cache in this area, because there are few or no known geocachers who live in this region. However, I firmly believe we need more caches in remote areas, not just caches close to the city. Therefore, what can I do to appeal this decision, and get this cache approved? I firmly believe that this is an area that warrants having a cache, even if the only cache that I could establish there is a virtual cache. Below is the text of the cache description so you can see what this cache is about. Sincerely, Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer) Closed Canyon [Click to temporarily disable] by Highpointer [profile] User's Web Page This cache has not been approved yet. Once it is approved, it will be listed on the site. N 29° 19.629 W 104° 01.901 (WGS84) UTM: 13R E 594018 N 3244621 or convert to NAD27 at Jeeep.com [input] [input] also download nearest placenames. Need help? Read about EasyGPS In Texas, United States [state map] Hidden: 2/24/2003 Use waypoint: GCDA59 (what's this?) Make this page print-friendly (no logs) Note:To use the services of geocaching.com, you must agree to the terms and conditions in our disclaimer. (ratings out of 5 stars. 1 is easiest, 5 is hardest) Difficulty: Terrain: Hike into a narrow canyon near the Rio Grande in southwestern Texas. Admin - Emailed to see why a physical cache could not be placed Explore Closed Canyon in Big Bend Ranch State Park, the largest state park in Texas. This is a narrow ravine, just 3-4 meters wide with sheer, vertical walls, cut by a seasonal stream that flows into the Rio Grande. Traversing the entire canyon is a real canyoneering adventure, and requires proper knowledge, skills, and equipment. However, you don't need to traverse the entire canyon to claim this virtual cache, so most geocachers can do this. Begin your journey by parking at N 29° 19.669 W 104° 01.690, about a quarter-mile from the canyon entrance. To claim this cache, visit the entrance to the canyon at the posted coordinates, and if the stream is not flowing and there is no danger of flash flooding, then hike into the canyon as far as you comfortably and safely can do. The first difficult traverse is at a point where a ladder descends into a pool (see this picture), so if you are hiking into the canyon then take a picture of yourself here and post it to earn credit. Other photographs are greatly welcome. You can go farther if you like, but you will need rope and rappelling gear and know how to use the equipment properly in order to reach the Rio Grande. Because the configuration of the canyon blocks most satellite signals, GPS reception is virtually non-existent in the canyon. Because this canyon is very narrow and there are no escape routes once past the entrance, there is real danger of flash flooding during times of heavy rainfall, particularly during the summer thunderstorm season. Therefore, please heed the weather forecasts and don't enter the canyon if there is any chance of heavy rain in the area. If it is not safe to enter the canyon, then post of picture of yourself at the entrance. --0-838512834-1046141937=:14999 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

Ken,

Congrats, from looking at the geocaching site, it seems you got this approved.  We will have to make the swing south next time we go visit our daughter.

Gregg of MO & GO

 ken@highpointer.com wrote:

Hello Geocachers,

During a recent trip to southwestern Texas, I visited an area that I thought should be worthy of a virtual cache.  This area is Closed Canyon near the Rio Grande.  I wrote what I tought is a good cache description.  However, the authorities who approve caches turned this one down.

There are many virtual caches far inferior to this one, but this one was not approved.  It was featured in the October 1997 issue of Texas Monthly, so it is an area that is worthy of being featured in a major travel magazine.  It was even described in The Boston Globe on June 23, 1996, so it clearly is an area that receives recognition from major newspapers and publications based far away from Texas.

Since this location is in a remote area far from my home, I am unable to put a physical cache here.  It would be very difficult to place a physical cache in this area, because there are few or no known geocachers who live in this region.  However, I firmly believe we need more caches in remote areas, not just caches close to the city.

Therefore, what can I do to appeal this decision, and get this cache approved?  I firmly believe that this is an area that warrants having a cache, even if the only cache that I could establish there is a virtual cache.

Below is the text of the cache description so you can see what this cache is about.

Sincerely,

Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer)

Closed Canyon
[Click to temporarily disable]
by Highpointer [profile]
User's Web Page

This cache has not been approved yet. Once it is approved, it will be listed on the site.

N 29° 19.629 W 104° 01.901 (WGS84)
UTM: 13R E 594018 N 3244621
or convert to NAD27 at Jeeep.com


also download nearest placenames.
Need help? Read about EasyGPS

In Texas, United States [state map]
Hidden: 2/24/2003
Use waypoint: GCDA59 (what's this?)
Make this page print-friendly (no logs)

Note:To use the services of geocaching.com, you must agree to the terms and conditions in our disclaimer.

(ratings out of 5 stars. 1 is easiest, 5 is hardest)
Difficulty:  *  Terrain: ***      

Hike into a narrow canyon near the Rio Grande in southwestern Texas.

Admin - Emailed to see why a physical cache could not be placed

Explore Closed Canyon in Big Bend Ranch State Park, the largest state park in Texas. This is a narrow ravine, just 3-4 meters wide with sheer, vertical walls, cut by a seasonal stream that flows into the Rio Grande.

Traversing the entire canyon is a real canyoneering adventure, and requires proper knowledge, skills, and equipment. However, you don't need to traverse the entire canyon to claim this virtual cache, so most geocachers can do this. Begin your journey by parking at N 29° 19.669 W 104° 01.690, about a quarter-mile from the canyon entrance.

To claim this cache, visit the entrance to the canyon at the posted coordinates, and if the stream is not flowing and there is no danger of flash flooding, then hike into the canyon as far as you comfortably and safely can do. The first difficult traverse is at a point where a ladder descends into a pool (see this picture), so if you are hiking into the canyon then take a picture of yourself here and post it to earn credit.

Other photographs are greatly welcome. You can go farther if you like, but you will need rope and rappelling gear and know how to use the equipment properly in order to reach the Rio Grande. Because the configuration of the canyon blocks most satellite signals, GPS reception is virtually non-existent in the canyon.

Because this canyon is very narrow and there are no escape routes once past the entrance, there is real danger of flash flooding during times of heavy rainfall, particularly during the summer thunderstorm season. Therefore, please heed the weather forecasts and don't enter the canyon if there is any chance of heavy rain in the area. If it is not safe to enter the canyon, then post of picture of yourself at the entrance.

--0-838512834-1046141937=:14999-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 25 03:10:40 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 19:10:40 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Closed Canyon cache approved Message-ID: <20030225031041.42336.qmail@web21107.mail.yahoo.com> --0-1129042921-1046142640=:40286 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Scott, Thank you for the advice and information. I did get the cache approved. Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer) http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=55897 --0-1129042921-1046142640=:40286 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

Scott,

Thank you for the advice and information.  I did get the cache approved.

Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=55897

--0-1129042921-1046142640=:40286-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Tue Feb 25 07:04:07 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 00:04:07 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Closed Canyon cache approved In-Reply-To: <20030225031041.42336.qmail@web21107.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030225000334.02671058@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 07:10 PM 2/24/2003 -0800, you wrote: >Scott, > >Thank you for the advice and information. I did get the cache approved. I glad to hear that. I can understand them really coming down on locationless, but it seems like they are going a little overboard on the virtuals. In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 27 17:00:22 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bell, Robert) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 10:00:22 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Utah Geocache brings out bomb squad Message-ID: An interesting read, and good reminder of cache placement responsibility. http://www.azcentral.com/offbeat/articles/0226geocaching-bombscare-ON.html I haven't looked, but I'm sure this is out all over the forums; anybody have the details on what cache this is? Rob, Team CHUMP From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 27 17:14:02 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Ayre) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 10:14:02 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Utah Geocache brings out bomb squad In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Apparently its this one: http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=39994 If someone is so stupid as to hide a cache near a base, you wonder how they have the intelligence to operate a GPS unit... Andy (Groover) -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Bell, Robert Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2003 10:00 AM To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com' Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Utah Geocache brings out bomb squad An interesting read, and good reminder of cache placement responsibility. http://www.azcentral.com/offbeat/articles/0226geocaching-bombscare-ON.html I haven't looked, but I'm sure this is out all over the forums; anybody have the details on what cache this is? Rob, Team CHUMP ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 27 17:37:22 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jim Scotti) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 10:37:22 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Utah Geocache brings out bomb squad In-Reply-To: Message-ID: This cache really does look suspicious - particularly because of Team My Blue Heaven's having visited it on January 25. :-) Perhaps Scott can describe the area a bit better for us. Certainly, there might be some geocaches here in Arizona that might be percieved in a similar light by unknowing witnesses. I've often wondered if local law enforcement have any idea generally about geocaches. I'm sure some officers do, but I would hope that that average officer might even be made aware of geocaching so that they might recognize them before a significant event occurs by an unrecognized cache. Jim. On Thu, 27 Feb 2003, Andrew Ayre wrote: > Apparently its this one: > > http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=39994 > > If someone is so stupid as to hide a cache near a base, you wonder how they > have the intelligence to operate a GPS unit... > > Andy (Groover) > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com > [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Bell, > Robert > Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2003 10:00 AM > To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com' > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Utah Geocache brings out bomb squad > > > An interesting read, and good reminder of cache placement responsibility. > > http://www.azcentral.com/offbeat/articles/0226geocaching-bombscare-ON.html > > > I haven't looked, but I'm sure this is out all over the forums; anybody > have the details on what cache this is? > > Rob, Team CHUMP > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > Jim Scotti Lunar & Planetary Laboratory University of Arizona Tucson, AZ 85721 USA http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/~jscotti/ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 27 17:37:35 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bell, Robert) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 10:37:35 -0700 Subject: FW: [Az-Geocaching] Utah Geocache brings out bomb squad Message-ID: If you watch the video, they did a live broadcast from the area. In addition to showing the closed off area and the guy in the bomb suit, the cache contents are briefly shown displayed on a table. If you pay close attention, you'll notice a Team My Blue Heaven Arizona Keychain as one of the cache items!! The video is at the local news affiliate KSL website, here: http://tv.ksl.com/index.php?nid=39&sid=11248 Rob, Team CHUMP -----Original Message----- From: Andrew Ayre [mailto:andy@britishideas.com] Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2003 10:14 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Utah Geocache brings out bomb squad Apparently its this one: http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=39994 If someone is so stupid as to hide a cache near a base, you wonder how they have the intelligence to operate a GPS unit... Andy (Groover) -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Bell, Robert Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2003 10:00 AM To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com' Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Utah Geocache brings out bomb squad An interesting read, and good reminder of cache placement responsibility. http://www.azcentral.com/offbeat/articles/0226geocaching-bombscare-ON.html I haven't looked, but I'm sure this is out all over the forums; anybody have the details on what cache this is? Rob, Team CHUMP ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 27 17:49:47 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Ayre) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 10:49:47 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Utah Geocache brings out bomb squad In-Reply-To: Message-ID: If a police officer was told about a suspicious container that appears to be a PVC tube or an ammo can, near a base, water treatment plant, etc. and the police officer knows about geocaches, I don't think the officer would just take a quick look and assume its a geocache. I've seen many times in England people leaving their shopping bags in a train station and although everyone is aware that shopping bags exist, they still brought in the bomb squad to blow it up, just to be on the safe side. Andy (Groover) -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Jim Scotti Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2003 10:37 AM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Utah Geocache brings out bomb squad This cache really does look suspicious - particularly because of Team My Blue Heaven's having visited it on January 25. :-) Perhaps Scott can describe the area a bit better for us. Certainly, there might be some geocaches here in Arizona that might be percieved in a similar light by unknowing witnesses. I've often wondered if local law enforcement have any idea generally about geocaches. I'm sure some officers do, but I would hope that that average officer might even be made aware of geocaching so that they might recognize them before a significant event occurs by an unrecognized cache. Jim. On Thu, 27 Feb 2003, Andrew Ayre wrote: > Apparently its this one: > > http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=39994 > > If someone is so stupid as to hide a cache near a base, you wonder how they > have the intelligence to operate a GPS unit... > > Andy (Groover) > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com > [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Bell, > Robert > Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2003 10:00 AM > To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com' > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Utah Geocache brings out bomb squad > > > An interesting read, and good reminder of cache placement responsibility. > > http://www.azcentral.com/offbeat/articles/0226geocaching-bombscare-ON.html > > > I haven't looked, but I'm sure this is out all over the forums; anybody > have the details on what cache this is? > > Rob, Team CHUMP > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > Jim Scotti Lunar & Planetary Laboratory University of Arizona Tucson, AZ 85721 USA http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/~jscotti/ ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 27 18:52:32 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 10:52:32 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Utah Geocache brings out bomb squad Message-ID: <20030227105235.28868.h014.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> I just read all the logs on this cache (someone is real serious about TB's and cache-nuts) and frankly I am ASTONISHED that it lasted as long as it did! I would have suspected that someone would have reported the activity in the first week. I can't wait to hear Scott's (MBH) description of the area. I think from the logs that the cache owner was more concerned with "permission" to put it near the museum and didn't consider the nearby (?) AFB. Geez! Trisha "Lightning" Prescott On Thu, 27 Feb 2003, "Andrew Ayre" wrote: > > Apparently its this one: > > http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=39994 > > If someone is so stupid as to hide a cache near a base, you wonder how > they > have the intelligence to operate a GPS unit... > > Andy (Groover) > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com > [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of > Bell, > Robert > Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2003 10:00 AM > To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com' > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Utah Geocache brings out bomb squad > > > An interesting read, and good reminder of cache placement > responsibility. > > http://www.azcentral.com/offbeat/articles/0226geocaching-bombscare-ON.html > > > I haven't looked, but I'm sure this is out all over the forums; > anybody > have the details on what cache this is? > > Rob, Team CHUMP > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 27 19:34:53 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 11:34:53 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Fwd: Do you have an enemy Message-ID: <20030227113454.714.h003.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> SEE BELOW ------- Start of forwarded message ------- Subject: Do you have an enemy From: Scott Wood Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 13:17:13 -0700 To: trisha@brasher.com I really didn't think this should go out to the list, unless you want it to, but felt you should know about this thread on the geocaching.com forums. Looks like someone doesn't like you much. Scott ------- End of forwarded message ------- Hi all, Scott recently alerted me to a nasty message on the forums directed at me, in case any of you saw it (you will know if you did, I am deliberately NOT posting the reference here), that is apparently from my ex-husband who is now stalking and harrassing me on the Internet. You'd think that after 11 years he would get over it and stop with the lies and crap (my RN license is not revoked), but he feels he needs to attack me. I recently filed for a review of the child support, so I am guessing that is what sparked him up again. For all I know, he is now signed up with this list serve and "stalking" me by watching every word I write and every move I make. It is creepy, as he is a true sociopath. I have asked the GC Admin to look at the post, confirm the person's ID (doubt they will, but I can ask...) and remove the post. I felt I should put a note here for those of you who may have read it, so you will know the truth. Thanks Trisha "Lightning" Prescott ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 27 22:44:26 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 15:44:26 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Utah Geocache brings out bomb squad In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030227154404.0260f3f8@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 10:14 AM 2/27/2003 -0700, you wrote: >Apparently its this one: > >http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=39994 > >If someone is so stupid as to hide a cache near a base, you wonder how they >have the intelligence to operate a GPS unit... Wow, I found that one on my recent trip to Idaho! In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 27 22:46:38 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 15:46:38 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Utah Geocache brings out bomb squad In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030227154557.02646868@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 10:37 AM 2/27/2003 -0700, you wrote: >Heaven's having visited it on January 25. :-) Perhaps Scott can describe the >area a bit better for us. Certainly, there might be some geocaches here in I will be happy to, but it will have to wait until a little later tonight. I am getting ready to run out the door for a quick trip down to Sierra Vista. In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu Feb 27 21:50:06 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Doug Kreutz) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 14:50:06 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] geocaching Message-ID: Hello Scott, I'm a feature writer at the Arizona Daily Star newspaper, planning to do a story on geocaching. I'd like to talk with you, or anyone else you might recommend, for some information on geochaching in the Tucson area. Would you be able to give me a call at 573-4192 or send me a phone number by email so I might contact you or another avid geocacher? Many thanks, Doug Kreutz Arizona Daily Star From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 28 00:15:58 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 17:15:58 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] geocaching In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E5EAA3E.9030104@snaptek.com> Doug Kreutz wrote: > I'm a feature writer at the Arizona Daily Star newspaper, planning to do a > story on geocaching. I'd like to talk with you, or anyone else you might > recommend, for some information on geochaching in the Tucson area. Would > you be able to give me a call at 573-4192 or send me a phone number by > email so I might contact you or another avid geocacher? I think this message was ment to go to us privatly. It was stuck in the message queue on the mailing list because the reporter is NOT subscribed and I decided to just let it though, and see if any of you people inb Tuscon (Tusconites, Tusconians.. what are you... and are people from Livermore, Livermorons (I used to live there :)) would like to give him a call. If he wants to talk to Jason or myself, we will be happy to talk to them. Just have him e-mail us as geocaching@azgeocaching.com and we'll get back to him ASAP. It does sound like he's looking for a tuscon type person though. Brian Cluff AzGeocaching.com Team Snaptek From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 28 04:23:53 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 21:23:53 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] geocaching In-Reply-To: <3E5EAA3E.9030104@snaptek.com> References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030227212331.02713328@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 05:15 PM 2/27/2003 -0700, you wrote: >If he wants to talk to Jason or myself, we will be happy to talk to >them. Just have him e-mail us as geocaching@azgeocaching.com and we'll >get back to him ASAP. >It does sound like he's looking for a tuscon type person though. I just sent him an e-mail offlist, and will give him a call tomorrow. In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 28 05:09:38 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 22:09:38 -0700 Subject: FW: [Az-Geocaching] Utah Geocache brings out bomb squad In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030227220851.026e8e88@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 10:37 AM 2/27/2003 -0700, you wrote: >If you pay close attention, you'll notice a Team My Blue Heaven >Arizona Keychain as one of the cache items!! > >The video is at the local news affiliate KSL website, here: >http://tv.ksl.com/index.php?nid=39&sid=11248 You have to admit, that is pretty cool. Perhaps there should be a link for this story on the azgeocaching.com news links. :-) In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 28 05:23:21 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 22:23:21 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Utah Geocache brings out bomb squad In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030227220948.026edd60@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 10:37 AM 2/27/2003 -0700, you wrote: >This cache really does look suspicious - particularly because of Team My Blue >Heaven's having visited it on January 25. :-) Perhaps Scott can describe the I don't know how many people have been to the Hill AFB area, I have spent quite a lot of time there. The base borders the interstate on the East side of the road. Where is particular cache was hidden is a little ways from the actual active base, but right outside the gate to the museum, which you really should visit if you ever find yourself in that area. All of this is a way North of Salt Lake City. I found that cache at about 7:30 am after staying over night in Provo, which is just south of SLC. The entrance to the museum is pretty much the only thing on the Eastbound off ramp from the freeway, to the West are a number of gas stations and fast food places. The entrance gate to the museum is no more than 500 feet or so from the freeway. As mentioned in the story, there is a small bridge for a canal that runs along the freeway, and is between the freeway and the gate to the museum. I actually had an interesting experience at this cache when I found it, I actually sort of got caught finding it, but didn't post it in the logs since I was in Idaho with a pretty bad internet connection at the time. I pulled off the freeway and parked near the gate to the museum on the south side of the road. I no more than got out of the car that I realized that the cache was actually under the North end of the bridge. Before I could start walking over there, a red pickup pulled up to talk to me, he had just left the museum. He asked if I needed any help finding my way into the museum. I told him no, that even though I had been there many times, I was just stopping to stretch my legs during a long drive, which was sort of true. He still seemed a little suspicious so I started talking to him about having been active duty in the Air Force and that I used to work on A-10s. I went on to tell him how odd I thought that the 1973 model A-10 was that is in the Hill museum. He knew exactly what I was talking about and we chatted a little more. He told me how he was jealous of me since he had always wanted to visit the Pima Air and Space Museum. We said our good-byes and he was on his way. That left the coast pretty much clear to head over to the north side of the bridge and claim the cache. As you saw in the video, it is a small, red tackle box. It was hidden just inside the culvert that goes through the bridge. From where the cache was hidden, the only people that can really see you from the interstate are cars that are heading North. If they see you, it is because they are looking back over their shoulders, but you are right out in plain sight. Given the location of the cache, and the layout of the streets in the area, I suspect that the closures in the area were the road into the museum, it should have actually made any difference to the entrance to the base which is about 3/4 miles from there. I suspect that it also closed atleast the Northbound lanes of the interstate. I have to admit, when I found the cache I was somewhat amazed that it was still there, I figured it would have been found by accident long before this. I am also surprised that our keychain was still in the cache. :-) In liberty, Scott wood@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 28 05:38:36 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jason Poulter) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 22:38:36 -0700 Subject: FW: [Az-Geocaching] Utah Geocache brings out bomb squad In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030227220851.026e8e88@mail.myblueheaven.com> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030227220851.026e8e88@mail.myblueheaven.com> Message-ID: <3E5EF5DC.1010506@snaptek.com> has to be related to arizona to get on the news section!!! jason Scott Wood wrote: > At 10:37 AM 2/27/2003 -0700, you wrote: > >> If you pay close attention, you'll notice a Team My Blue Heaven >> Arizona Keychain as one of the cache items!! >> >> The video is at the local news affiliate KSL website, here: >> http://tv.ksl.com/index.php?nid=39&sid=11248 > > > You have to admit, that is pretty cool. Perhaps there should be a link > for this story on the azgeocaching.com news links. :-) > > > In liberty, > > Scott > > wood@myblueheaven.com > www.myblueheaven.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri Feb 28 23:46:40 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (HighwayHavoc) Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 15:46:40 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GPS Clinic In-Reply-To: <20030227113454.714.h003.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Message-ID: <20030228234640.44888.qmail@web40501.mail.yahoo.com> For those who might be interested: Introduction to GPS Join Chris Miller, our local REI GPS wizard, as he presents a clinic on introductory GPS use. Chris will discuss how the Global Positioning System works and how the handheld GPS device can help you navigate through the backcountry. If you own a GPS system or are thinking of purchasing one, this clinic will help you become more comfortable and versed with how they function * March 18th @ REI Paradise Valley * March 19th @ REI Tempe * 7:00pm to 8:30pm * FREE __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/